Trent Reznor... film composer???

[Alan Lastufka]

I just got through watching Denzel Washington in "Man On Fire" - and funny thing was - almost the entire movie's soundtrack was remixes of Nine Inch Nails tunes (including The Downward Spiral - the song - not the album, Mr. Deconstruct and some others...)

This is the third film I've seen this month that has used the remix versions of Nine Inch Nails songs for its score, the other two being Seven (remixes of Closer To God) and The Fan w/ Wesly Snipes (a ton of NIN stuff).

And I'm not talking just like - an NIN song on the soundtrack - I mean 90% of the music being his. NIN is a one man studio band consisting of the genious Trent Reznor. He creates "industrial" music through synths, samples and mangling acoustic elements. Just wondering why he hasn't officially taken on a film score and if he ever will. The three films above were scored great using his premade music - but if he would have scored to the picture - I think it would have turned out even better. BTW, when NIN releases an album, Trent also releases one or two fully remixed and re'realized vrsion of that album - and these "remix" albums are where most of the material is coming from.

Also, Trent Reznor was classically trained at a very young age but found his home in industrial rock. You can hear his classical influences on many of his works - and knowing the guy writes and plays everything on the albums himself gives me even more respect for him - some of his piano and cello works are amazing...

Other films Reznor has contributed material for: Lost Highway, The Crow and Natural Born Killers... c'mon Trent - let's hear a full original score from ya...

Guess as Potter keeps getting darker with each new installment - Reznor should be gold for Harry Potter VI... :D

[Herman Witkam]

lol. that 'd be fun to listen to.
I think it's a bit easy to use prewritten music for a soundtrack. Since he's classically trained and a good songwriter he should be able to come up with an orginal score...

[Joseph Burrell]

Trent Reznor is a genius. Simply put. I would like to see him branch into film. I thought his music fit Seven very well, as well as his work on the Lost Highway and Crow films. I'll just be happy to get his next album.

[Alan Lastufka]

lol. that 'd be fun to listen to.
I think it's a bit easy to use prewritten music for a soundtrack. Since he's classically trained and a good songwriter he should be able to come up with an orginal score...

Right. But the filmmakers aren't asking him to - they are taking instrumental works of his and sprinkling them throughout the films... This is why I hope they will approach him to write a bad*ss score sometime, instead of just ripping instrumental tracks from his albums.

[Herman Witkam]

indeed...cause this is more like library music

[christianb]

lets not forget that a fella by the name of Howard Shore did some very interesting stuff in se7en (a great soundtrack if you're in the mood to give yourself the willies) and harry gregson williams, no slouch himself , contributed about 29 cues for 'man on fire'

Not to take a thing away from ole trent tho. I agree, i would like to see him go down that road. Monsieur Manson has started doing it to good effect I think.

cb

[SWL]

FYI: NIN is a 'two man band' - Trent relies alot on his right handman Danny Lohner. Not to discredit Trent at all - he is the mastermind, of course, but he has a team.

He did score the soundtrack to the original 'Quake' - and was also slated to score Doom 3 - but left for undisclosed reasons.

He took a stab at film scoring, for 'One Hour Photo' - but his score was rejected and he was replaced. Film scoring is not for everyone - regardless of how talented they may be.

His studio is very nice - btw :-)

[Jaibulu]

Trent Reznor is a genius.

I wouldn't go that far! What's next, Kurt Cobain was a Maestro?

[Joseph Burrell]

Why not? It's better than Howard Snore or Drab Williams.

[Christopher Drake]

FYI: NIN is a 'two man band' - Trent relies alot on his right handman Danny Lohner. Not to discredit Trent at all - he is the mastermind, of course, but he has a team.

He did score the soundtrack to the original 'Quake' - and was also slated to score Doom 3 - but left for undisclosed reasons.

He took a stab at film scoring, for 'One Hour Photo' - but his score was rejected and he was replaced. Film scoring is not for everyone - regardless of how talented they may be.

His studio is very nice - btw :-)

i thought Lohner pretty much was just guitar...I think Clouser has more of an impact on the production than Lohner.

[A_Sapp]

Why not? It's better than Howard Snore or Drab Williams.
Hahaha, you're a funny guy! Keep it up!

[midphase]

While I do think that Trent Reznor is a good songwriter/producer (his singing talents are subjectively good or merely sufficient), I don't consider him as innovative as people think he is. Skinny Puppy, Front 242, Front Line Assembly, KMFDM, Kraftwerk, Genesis P. Orridge, even Nina Hagen were experimenting with that type of sound many years before Trent popularized it. I guess that should be his biggest claim to fame, he brought the industrial/electronic sound to the masses!

Having said that, I am a big fan of his, saw NIN several times live and find Pretty Hate Machine one of the most inspirational CD's I've ever owned.

His music has a fairly cinematic feel to it to begin with, perhaps the reason why he hasn't actually scored a film is because he really doesn't like the idea of dealing with the whole movie industry and control freak producer/directors.

[SWL]

i thought Lohner pretty much was just guitar...I think Clouser has more of an impact on the production than Lohner.

Ah yeah - that guy ;-)

[SWL]

Why not? It's better than Howard Snore or Drab Williams.

Easy Joey - 99% of the people herecare nothing about trent reznor, and honestly in 2004, he is irrelevent ....he hasnt made a record in nearly a decade, and todays record buying consumer has no idea who he is. Currently he is just a video game junkie with alot of cash and a nice studio.

[Ranietz]

I'm a big NIN fan myself and I read an interview with Trent years ago. He said that when NIN was no more he wanted to start making music for movies.

And if I remember correctly Trent wrote some music specific for Lost Highway, not using any premade music. And I think he wrote a song specific for the Tomb Raider soundtrack too.

[Alan Lastufka]

It has been a while - but he does have a new album due out soon - which he describes as "twelve tracks. twelve punches to the face."
- :D - now where's that smilie with a few missing teeth?

[Joseph Burrell]

Well, SWL, it all boils down to I have my opinion and everyone else has theirs and I wasn't stepping on anyones toes until they started stepping on mine. And actually he released a double album on a few years ago.

[Ned Bouhalassa]

.. in 2004, he is irrelevent ....he hasnt made a record in nearly a decade, and todays record buying consumer has no idea who he is. Currently he is just a video game junkie with alot of cash and a nice studio.

Mmmm. Google "nine inch nails" = 1/2 million hits

Google "James Newton Howard" = 55,000

I'd like to be as irrelevant as Trent Reznor... :)

I think he's a very gifted artist. I was very influenced by Pretty Hate Machine, and I think his subsequent cds will hold up very well over time.

[Jaibulu]

Mmmm. Google "nine inch nails" = 1/2 million hits

Google "James Newton Howard" = 55,000

I'd like to be as irrelevant as Trent Reznor... :)

I think he's a very gifted artist. I was very influenced by Pretty Hate Machine, and I think his subsequent cds will hold up very well over time.

Common music for common minds

[Ned Bouhalassa]

Common music for common minds

Hey Jaibulu, note that I was specifically responding to this
he hasnt made a record in nearly a decade, and todays record buying consumer has no idea who he is. Currently he is just a video game junkie with alot of cash and a nice studio..

Oh, and there's nothing common about Reznor.

[SWL]

Mmmm. Google "nine inch nails" = 1/2 million hits

Google "James Newton Howard" = 55,000

I'd like to be as irrelevant as Trent Reznor... :)

I think he's a very gifted artist. I was very influenced by Pretty Hate Machine, and I think his subsequent cds will hold up very well over time.

Hmmm, so Google is now somehow the definative resource for statistical analysis of poplular music and cultural relevence ??? Thought you were smarter than that ..... Your apples to oranges comparison is flawed in too many ways to bother pointing out.

[Ned Bouhalassa]

Hmmm, so Google is now somehow the definative resource for statistical analysis of poplular music and cultural relevence ???

No, I just found it useful for my own quick analysis. I don't speak for anyone else and would not presume to know anything about the statistical analysis of music in general. I'm a composer.


Thought you were smarter than that ..... Your apples to oranges comparison is flawed in too many ways to bother pointing out.

How convenient for you, then.

[Alan Lastufka]

Funny how things turned out in this thread - Ned - sorry for the insults of the others... and thanks for your input on the subject - I agree with you - you stop 100 random people on the street - in the supermarket - even attending LOTR and more will have heard of NIN than Shore...

[Joseph Burrell]

:confused:

Jeeze.

All because I consider the man to be a genius. Look, througout the course of musical history there are those that undoubtable change the face of music through innovation or through their masterful use of current applied theory in their work. Surely I do not wish to compare Trent Reznor with those undying composers of yesteryear as it doesn't particularly apply at this point. However, I feel, it is undeniable that his music has had a lasting effect on his particular genre of music to where it would not be at its current state should he had not chosen to participate in it. Regardless, I feel it undeniable that he has had a lasting effect on popular musical culture and myself have a strong connection with his music emotionally. The same cannot be said (about myself) when comparing him to the new crop of Hollywood composers. Trent's music is a complete package that visually, mentally, and emotionally affects the listener in a way that some film music composers cannot. This being said, however, film music is hard taken when presented without those visuals in which they were designed to be used. When taken in the context of those films for which they were made, then you have a complete package, and the resulting work is just as impacting to you or I as music made for the sole purpose of acting upon the listener. Bottom line, Trent's music can impact upon the listener effects that most film score cannot, especially when they are without those visuals that give them their meaning.

Ah, Jeeze.

[Bruce A. Richardson]

In my opinion, the average orchestral film score is quite musically "common," to the point of cliche in a great many cases. My own work included in that. It's difficult to break barriers, but I think the neo-romantics are coming to the end of their run, and we'll see a more integrated score/sound design approach as time goes by.

[FredProgGH]

Hmmm, so Google is now somehow the definative resource for statistical analysis of poplular music and cultural relevence ???

I don't know about definative, but Google probably makes a pretty darn good quick reference for cultural popularity.

As for the matter at hand, I really never listened enough to NiN to make any comment about whether TR is a genius or not but I think he is certainly an Important figure iin the development of popular music with the capitol "I"...

[SWL]

For the record - i like NIN - respect their position in modern music history - have all their records - been to a few shows - ohh, and i hate name dropping - but i've been to Trent's house and to his studio - and have alot of respect for him -

My point - he hasnt made a record in 5 years - took a stab at scoring, wasnt his bag - and this (2004) would probably not be a good time for him to try to drop a new record on the mainstream - although, he does have a huge fan base. Pretty Hte Machine and the Downward Spiral sold of 3 million each --- The Fragile - only 850,000 (still a good number though).

Check out his score to Quake !

Good point Bruce !! I'm ready for the neo-post-modern movement :p

[Alan Lastufka]

Did he still have animation cell #666 from Floyd's "The Wall" above the enterance door while you were there? :D

[ngstime]

Did he still have animation cell #666 from Floyd's "The Wall" above the enterance door while you were there? :D



of all of the coolest things to have!!!! what is #666 of?

a friend had a cell of the face screaming from a brick wall.... doubt it was original, still cool looking though.

[SWL]

Did he still have animation cell #666 from Floyd's "The Wall" above the enterance door while you were there? :D

LOL! I have no idea about the #666 - but yeah there were artwork stills from the Wall and assorted other oddities, and of course, gold records - and old school video games, etc, etc. And very little LIGHT ! I have pics somewhere - will have to ask the wifey where they are.

The most unique studio i've ever seen !

[midphase]

Just a thought considering the Google factoid...

I think a fair comparison of Google searches would be best done for:

NIN Google hits vs. Lord of the Rings Google hits

I think it's safe to say LOTR has had more Google hits?

Just a thought?

[handz]

" Skinny Puppy, Front 242, Front Line Assembly, KMFDM, Kraftwerk, Genesis P. Orridge, even Nina Hagen were experimenting with that type of sound many years before Trent popularized it. I guess that should be his biggest claim to fame, he brought the industrial/electronic sound to the masses!"

Yeah, good old psychic TV...:)



head like a hole
black as your soul
i'd rather die
than give you control

[KingIdiot]

experimenting, and really having a grasp on what you're doing is two different things. I think Trents pushed the electronic/industrial (I dont think he's really industrial), way beyond some of the aforementioned people. Not to mention Trent is always pushing envelopes. Consider KMFDM. I saw them a couple months ago, and crap they bored the ~~~~ out of me. I never really saw much in KMFDM anyway, except YEEEEEAARS ago when their sound was still new....now they are the same band writing the same tunes over and over again pretty much.

Skinny Puppy back when was DEFINITELY more of the amazing one of the bunch listed, but then they/he reached a limit and never went further.

Trent IMO is still a genius at manipulating electronics and noisess and still keeping them listenable and in most cases intriguing.....and in some other cases somewhat hookable. Consider his remix of Judith from APC. That orchestral/chamber string sample thingy that he makes into a seamless loop thats hard to find the loop in.....is jsut perfect used with the noise/electronic basses that he gates and the aphex twin like bass n drums stuff. Its really somethign that only NIN can come up with and do, anyone else who tries overdoes it on everyone of those things and all the charisma is lost.

Dont get me wrong. I dont think he's the end all genius to the music world...thats like saying Kurt Cobain was....its all about waht people see in different talents. I personally dont see much of anything in Cobain, I also cant stand Bob Dylan, but atleast I see his relevance to the times and what he was singing about as bieng pretty amazing. I still hate his music tho. And so thats teh point...some people hate the beatles, some people think their writing is in the genius realm. Some people like the Spice Girls, some like terrance trent darby, I'm sure there are a few people in the world who think they are geniuses too.......FOR ME TO POOP ON!

one thing tho, if you dont like the music, then dont judge the talent. You proobably dont pay enough attention to what goes into the creation of it to have a grasp on what kind of talent it takes. The same goes for all those "blues guitarist" peope that cant understand "what the deal is with orchestral music.....its just mathematics, there's no feel" ... yah I've actually had that said to me, by a pre med student no less :)


BTW Alan, he did write music specific for Lost Highway, I dont believe it was "scored" to picture, but made for specific scenes.

In se7en the tens were used in opening credxits and end credits only IIRC, and the opening was cut like a video anyway, so ofcourse it was gonna work :) I think that might be more Fincher's Genius than Trents :)

The Fan....it worked for the most part, but got annoying to me.

and while we're on the subject. My Vote for worst choice of music this year actually USED IN a movie (not credits and not jsut in the background on a radio) AudioSlave - Shadow of the Sun, in Collateral. I love that band, and that song, but cripes...the only thing that BARELY worked was the intro....

One that goes unnoticed...Stabbing Westward in Mortal Kombat, They are ALL OVER the movie. Like used in 5 places, used as if it was score too (and it really works), but not on the soundtrack. They didnt want to be lumped in with all the other bands on the soundtrack.....and then thy go and let themselves be used in...Johnny Neumonic....ooops

[Joseph Burrell]

Stabbing Westward, the one that could have been something great that dribbled into the nonsense of mainstream. Darkest Days, the most beautiful industrial album I've ever heard. So much raw emotion.

Anyway, I agree with ya 100% King.

[ngstime]

I never bought any NIN cd's (I did get Ministry:rolleyes: ).... but I can say Trent played a huge influence on me. Trent opened my eyes to MIDI.... not only that, but I could have a keyboard and not be labeled the "Geek" of the band. Thanks to Trent, I ran out and bought a PowerMac 8100 w/ StudioVision Pro and tossed the 4track cassette. Thanks to Trent, the word "sampling" entered my vocabulary. Thanks to Trent, I learned I didn't have to rely on drunks or drug addicts to get things done.... I could be self centered and just do it myself!!!!

And to this day when I mention to someone that has the slightest clue what I'm talking about when I mention I'm into sampling, they always respond:
"You mean like Trent Reznor?" :cool:

[KingIdiot]

Stabbing Westward, the one that could have been something great that dribbled into the nonsense of mainstream. Darkest Days, the most beautiful industrial album I've ever heard. So much raw emotion.

Anyway, I agree with ya 100% King.


I think that Wither is their best album, theres TONS more rawness in it, and I like the semi lo-fi ness of it. Ungod as an album is possibly too raw, too bad its mixed like ~~~~, but it does have some really cool textures. Darkest is a GREAT album with possibly their best song ever (waking up beside you), but it sounds like ~~~~ over all to me. The mixes are jsut poo poo if you ask me. The last album really grows on you, so long as you dont think of it as Stabbing. Sort of like a reinvention of the band. I personally think it SOUNDS awesome, the recording is their best to date, and some of the guitar textures are really cool, but the tunes are only "ok".


Joseph check out my new band Broken by Default

heavily influenced by Stabbing, Soundgarded and Muse. Right now the tune up doesnt show all those influences, mainly Stabbing.


www.myspace.com/brokenbydefault


rough demo of the tune BTW. I have to re-record just about everything

and ngs,

I'm with you, its because of Trent/NIN that I got into the concept of "sampling". Not in the multisample sense, but in the way of grabbing anykind of sound and screwing it up and making i sound cool and using it in music :). Then Stabbing Westward did a HUGE number on me and it was over.

Then I got into making Game music.....and Forced myself ot learn this thing called MIDI....I still cant believe it hasnt been that long that I've been using MIDI, I cant live without it now...

[Joseph Burrell]

Thanks, I'll definitely check that out...

Yeah, Wither was awesome as well... It holds too many dark memories for me. I still get chills every time I hear Sleep. God, that song...

Ungod while great, you're right, sounds like butt.

[ngstime]

www.myspace.com/brokenbydefault

Dude,
that kicks @SS!!

I can hear the Stabbing.

and all them Hot Chicks.... and a Dude signing another Dude's butt can't be wrong either :p

:( ....I almost miss being in a band

[KingIdiot]

Cool! Thanks man!

heh, I dunno about the chicas, but man I want to get out and play live again, I miss it!

Haha, yah thats my buddy Gabe, he's playing bass live when we start gigging. He plays in a band called Karate High School, talk about getting chicas.... Man those guys have so many girls after them its not even funny.....damn rock stars.

[FredProgGH]

In se7en the tens were used in opening credxits and end credits only IIRC, and the opening was cut like a video anyway, so ofcourse it was gonna work :) I think that might be more Fincher's Genius than Trents :)


Actually that would be this guy's genius!!

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0178204/

[Bruce A. Richardson]

That is actually a very salient point in the discussion...that the editor who takes a piece of existing music and cuts to it, ala rock video style, is often the one whose "genius" is more on display in a situation of found music and video.

I have had editors make me look like a genius, and conversely, an idiot.

I'm taking a break from trying to score an intro to a new series I'm working on, and I have to tell you, I wish that I'd done the music first and that they'd cut the video to it. It is one of those hellishly difficult pieces of video to score. I have yet to find a tempo that actually "works," and of course, I'm stuck in experimentation mode until something finally locks into place.

If I'd done the music up front, I'd be having a beer right now. Come to think of it, that might just be an excellent idea...

[Bruce A. Richardson]

Not that I'm detracting from anyone's genius, by the way. Just saying that it's one thing to compose really great pop music, and another thing entirely to be sitting in front of a video that's cut already, and needing to compose something which will make it work. A whole different ballgame.

[SWL]

That's a great point Bruce. Lately i have been working very close with editors, supplying them with temp tracks to cut to, if it is nothing more than a handful of loops ... that 1/2 hour i spend in pre-pro saves me hours on the backend. Of course, i have to have a general idea of what im going to do, and this only works with certain things (commercials, opens, action scenes, corporate videos). And your right, it does make ya look slick when everything synced and stylized.

[ngstime]

Cool! Thanks man!

heh, I dunno about the chicas, but man I want to get out and play live again, I miss it!

Haha, yah thats my buddy Gabe, he's playing bass live when we start gigging. He plays in a band called Karate High School, talk about getting chicas.... Man those guys have so many girls after them its not even funny.....damn rock stars.

lol,
I always got chicks that claimed I looked like someone I didn't even remotely look like.... oh well.... close enough ;)

I do, but I don't miss gigging. I guess the cons finally out weighed the pros.

I'll never forget my last gig- when some big fat DRUNK who was there to see the band before us, desided to show his support for his band by blowing major CHUNKS all over our singer(who was an ex-marine) during our "now un-finished" set.... I kinda sucker kicked some poor fool on the bottom of the pile:rolleyes: ....it's all rock n' roll baby!

[KingIdiot]

Actually that would be this guy's genius!!

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0178204/

D'OH!! I knew that!!! dammit... too many brain cells being killed in this rock n roll experience!!! mwahahaa


Bruce,

I agree, its interesting working with so many artists that edit their own video/audio. I think its best to have a seperate editor do that work, they are able to chop and work video to best fit both mood and music. Making the whole thing work better. ather than forcing music to go someplace that makes it too chaotic. Even when its already cut to a tempo, it doesnt really mean its the best cut for the music and mood.

ngs,

yah ngs, I get enough of the lookalike thing. I'm just hoping people dig the music and the shows dont suck ;)

[Joseph Burrell]

Hey, King, let us/me know when you've got your album ready. Will make a nice addition to my collection. Its such a long time since I listened to music like this. Its all nice gentle film score pieces around here. Its nice to crack a few skulls every once in a while. Thumbs way up.

[KingIdiot]

COOL!!!! I Just hijacked a Trent Reznor thread!!! Awesome!!!

Thanks man!!

3/4 song "industry" demo by middle of next month (have to get it out to some producers and label shoppers as well as local radio (some good opportunities for me there) and college radio.stations

then by the end of the year a nice 5-6 song EP, to sell at shows and early next a 12-14 song CD if all keeps going well with it.

Theres definitely some cool tunes I'm anxious to work on. If you guys are interested I can give you a hint of the other tunes in demo format via PM, but give me a couple of weeks to finish writing lyrics/vocal melodies and the other tunes will be mixed and up as I go back to remix/rerecord this one.

I'm totally excited about this stuff. I've been focusing on orchestral music for so long that I forgot how fun and theraputic making this stuff is. Plus hanging out at live shows has really lit a fire under my ~~~ to get the hell out and play shows again.

Its also no wonder that I dont have much to say on these forums anymore. Its not that I dont know my way around the orchestral samples....I'm jsut not into the debates anymore.