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View Full Version : A look at JABB: big band sound


Godfrey
11-27-2005, 02:36 AM
Today I decided to take a look at getting a big band sound out of JABB. Thanks to Google, I found a site (http://www.lushlifemusic.com/acatalog/Instrumentals_listing.htm) that sells big band charts -- and, happily, provides samples of them (usually the first three pages of each chart). I picked "In The Mood (http://www.lushlifemusic.com/arrangements/pdf/in_the_mood.pdf)" (PDF), as it's a well-known tune, and should be easy to tell if it sounds "right". I used SONAR 5 Producer as my sequencer, and a Yamaha WX5 as the input device for the wind instruments. The bass, guitar, piano and percussion were entered on a Kurzweil K1000.

All told, I used three alto saxes, two tenor saxes, four trumpets, four trombones, electric guitar, piano, acoustic bass, bass drum, high hat and snare. I set the percussion instruments up separately, rather than using a kit, so I could adjust the levels of each separately. I set up three instances of JABB in the synth rack, with individual outputs for each instrument.

One oddity is that the instruments don't seem to be volume-leveled; for example, Trumpet 1 Open and Trumpet 4 Open are noticeably louder than Trumpet 2 Open and Trumpet 3 Open; Trombone 1 Open is louder than the other three. However, once one is aware of that fact, one can compensate -- and I can see how it might come in useful, for solos and the like.

The brass instruments definitely have more "bite" than their GPO counterparts. The additional controls -- vibrato, flutter tongue, shake, filter, and so on -- are going to make these instruments extremely versatile. And the mutes sound excellent all round. I didn't use the mutes, or most of the controls, on "In The Mood" -- mainly vibrato depth and speed, to keep the longer notes from sounding too static.

After each take was done, I had to nudge the clip over about 128 ticks to the right. I'm guessing it was the fact that I had 52 MFX plugins running (four on each wind instrument), in addition to PerfectSpace and a compressor. Apart from that, it went pretty easily.

The plugins were for ease of use with my WX5: AutoLegato, and three instances of CC Map: one to convert breath data to mod wheel, one to convert CC17 (thumb wheel down) to channel aftertouch (vibrato depth), and one to convert CC16 (thumb wheel up) to CC18 (flutter tongue). The latter I didn't actually use in this piece; I had set it up in my "big band" template for future use.

Overall, I'm pretty happy with the sound I got out of it, though there's definitely a lot more I could do to improve it (well, practice, for one, but also playing a bit more with the controls). Still, for something I've only had my mitts on for three days, one of which was mostly wasted eating turkey and whatnot, I'm really happy with what I've been able to do with it so far.

Here's the MP3: In The Mood (excerpt) (http://www.shipbrook.com/jeff/temp/InTheMood.mp3) (1.4 MB)

And, for anyone who wants to take a look, here's the SONAR project (http://www.shipbrook.com/jeff/temp/InTheMood-cwp.zip) (577 KB) and a MIDI file (http://www.shipbrook.com/jeff/temp/InTheMood-mid.zip) (81 KB) exported from SONAR.

Lenchris
11-27-2005, 04:54 AM
This was really interesting. Thanks for taking the time to post on the forum.

Lennart Christianson

TheLastCrusader
11-27-2005, 11:53 PM
ACK! speed this chart up!

sounds like this was written to be played at an old folks home!

the real ACK is the fact its been about 12 years since I last played this chart, and I'm only 27!!! :)

great work!

Godfrey
11-28-2005, 01:21 AM
Kidding, right? It's actually about 5 BPM faster than Glen Miller did it.

Markleford
11-28-2005, 01:32 AM
It's think it's a truism these days that the "dirtier" ensembles will attempt everything faster, louder, and more dissonant than their forebearers. ;)

- m

TheLastCrusader
11-28-2005, 02:49 AM
Nope, not kidding at all, I have several GM recordings that are much quicker :)

Actually, in retrospect, I wished we had "jazzed" those arrangements up!

Another chart we played into the ground was "Big Noise From Winnetka" in case we have any hardcore big band jazz heads in the house :)

SeanHannifin
11-28-2005, 02:58 AM
Great work, Godfrey! I enjoyed what you've done! Also, thanks for the link. If I had the money, I'd love to buy some of these scores to study from, but just being able to see samples can be a nice resource.

"In the Mood" never fails to put me . . . in the mood :)

Great work!

Godfrey
11-28-2005, 08:27 AM
Nope, not kidding at all, I have several GM recordings that are much quicker :)
Well, to each his own, I guess. Me, I'd rather end up with something you can still dance to if you have the inclination -- though I suppose what passes for dancing nowadays can be done at about any tempo. :rolleyes:

Ivan P
11-28-2005, 10:31 AM
Thanks a lot Godfrey for pointing us this site :) This is really helpful!

JABB sounds very nice :)

Best,

Iván

Styxx
11-28-2005, 10:39 AM
The tempo is fine. As a matter of fact it's at dance tempo. You forget what age group usually dances to these old standards.
Nice work! Where's the rest?

Godfrey
11-28-2005, 10:55 AM
The tempo is fine. As a matter of fact it's at dance tempo. You forget what age group usually dances to these old standards.
You mean apart from the young kids who saw that Gap commercial and thought swing dancing looked neat? :D
Nice work! Where's the rest?
Thanks! Sadly, the chart sample ended just as things were getting interesting; it'd cost me £22 (plus international shipping costs) to get the rest of the chart. :(

Styxx
11-28-2005, 11:13 AM
You mean apart from the young kids who saw that Gap commercial and thought swing dancing looked neat? :D

Thanks! Sadly, the chart sample ended just as things were getting interesting; it'd cost me £22 (plus international shipping costs) to get the rest of the chart. :(
Hmm, let me check later after woik. I think I may have it from when I played with a big band. Don't remember if it was the leaders or if it was one of the tunes I had to pay for myself. It may be piano only or a drum chart. At any rate I'll look for it and get back to you later.

Godfrey
11-28-2005, 11:17 AM
Nifty, thanks!

Styxx
11-28-2005, 11:32 AM
Try this site as well. Supposedly free pdf downloads. www.pdfjazzmusic.com

SeanHannifin
11-28-2005, 03:00 PM
Try this site as well. Supposedly free pdf downloads. www.pdfjazzmusic.com (http://www.pdfjazzmusic.com)
Yes! Thanks for the link! This will certainly come in handy! :)

Richard N.
11-28-2005, 04:30 PM
Try this site as well. Supposedly free pdf downloads. www.pdfjazzmusic.com (http://www.pdfjazzmusic.com)

Jim Martin has some great charts on there - I've been buying them off him for some time now - he offers very good value for money.

I am sure he would appreciate if you ask permission to use the scores available for mock up purposes before you post them.

:)

KeithW
11-28-2005, 04:33 PM
Gary Wachtel (garyw0001.com) has quite a few Big Band charts that have already been input into MIDI from the original charts. He charges a nominal fee for subscription and I think you'll find them good quality. They are only (only?!) 16-part GM, but I think they will sound good with J&BB (and a little tweaking in the Sequencer.)

I plan to start experimenting with these as soon as my J&BB arrives.

Keith Walls

drdancm
11-28-2005, 09:30 PM
Thanks Godfrey,

Sounds nice to me -fine tempo. No matter what you do, you cannot please everyone all the time. However he did say it was great (other than his preferred tempo). It's a matter of taste.

And special thanks for making the sequencer and midi files available, that's esp. generous.

Dan

Styxx
11-29-2005, 10:33 AM
Ehhhhh! Sorry man, no charts. I called the old leader up and he told me I had left all my charts with the new drummer at the time. That's what I get for having a generous heart.
But one nice thing came out of all this. He asked if I was available for fill in if needed. Heck, yeah! :D

TheLastCrusader
11-29-2005, 03:10 PM
Hey guys,

I'm back, didn't meant to chat and run.

No, I thought it was a GREAT rendition, I was merely pointing out that when I performed it, we performed it a tad quicker.

Let me dig around, I have a ton of old big band charts as well from my playing days, I know I should have a ton of GM stuff, Big Noise from Winnetka, and some other classics.

dewdman42
11-29-2005, 08:03 PM
I've heard it faster. But I've also heard it at this speed. I actually think this could be rendered with exactly this tempo and be made to sound more "go" by working with the rythmn section a little bit and getting a bit more into the feel of some of the parts. I don't know if this was played live or notated out..but doing it live may add some subtle timing issues which can make it sound a bit more lively. Personally, I've definitely heard it this tempo and I've definitely heard it faster...I think this tempo definitely works fine, depending on the purpose..

TheLastCrusader
11-29-2005, 08:05 PM
Yeah, this tempo does work fine. I was just jealous, cause if I had the luxury of playing it that slow, I probably could have sight read the thing!

I had to shed a bit to get those runs down back in the day :D

Eric Heberling
12-02-2005, 04:34 PM
The plugins were for ease of use with my WX5: AutoLegato, and three instances of CC Map: one to convert breath data to mod wheel, one to convert CC17 (thumb wheel down) to channel aftertouch (vibrato depth), and one to convert CC16 (thumb wheel up) to CC18 (flutter tongue). The latter I didn't actually use in this piece; I had set it up in my "big band" template for future use.

I use Sonar 5. I can't find these MIDI plug-ins. How can I get them?

Thanks,
Eric

Markleford
12-02-2005, 07:48 PM
My site. (url below)

- m

FireGS
12-04-2005, 09:04 AM
Hey, I have the whole chart for every piece cause im in my schools jazz band! can i finish this when mmy JABB comes? ^_^

~Fire

Quasar
12-04-2005, 12:36 PM
Very nice job, G! Nothing wrong with the tempo, and thanks for the link. Just tracked the shipping progress on my copy of JABB, (hoping it comes tomorrow) and your demo of this standard (that everyone knows like the back of their hand) is a great choice for isolating the sounds of the library.

Keep up the fine work!

Michael