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View Full Version : Spectrasonics Fun at NAMM with Eric



Mike Greene
01-23-2006, 03:05 PM
One of the more popular demonstrations at the show was Eric's at the Spectrasonics booth. He showed a bunch of very cool tricks for Atmosphere and Trilogy. But first, a little history:

Back in the olden days, a common trick was to take a rock guitar track (usually long chords) and run it through a gate that was triggered by a sidechain fed by a synth playing some percussive rhythm.

For example, get a really straight, boring, hard attack synth sound. The tone doesn't matter, because we won't HEAR the synth, it's only purpose is to trigger the gate which will be effecting the guitar. Have the sequencer play straight 16th notes.

Route this synth into the "sidechain" input of the gate. So the guitar's gate opens when the SYNTH plays, rather than the normal gate method of opening when the GUITAR plays. We don't hear the synth, only the guitar. Play the guitar, and the sound is a stuttered guitar, just like a whole bunch of New Wave power pop tunes from the 80's.

1. Fast forward to Eric Persing at NAMM 2006. Replace the synth with Stylus RMX loops and replace the guitar with beds from Atmosphere. The RMX loop is bussed into the sidechain input of a gate, which is an insert effect on the Atmosphere track. So we hear stuttery sweeping synths.

Do a few of these all at once (several different beats feeding several different sweeping pads) and things get very interesting. Eric used "Frozen Rings," "Hypnotic," "Octavio" and I don't remember what else on Atmoshpere. I don't remember the RMX patches, but of course, this is all just springbaord material, so it doesn't matter because experimentation is key. It sounded really cool and I now kick myself for not using a trick I used to use all the time when I was a mere young whippersnapper!

2. A related trick Eric showed was using RMX sidechained into Ringshifter (a Logic plugin, but any ring modulator or other "weird" plugin would work). On Atmosphere, Eric had "Octavio" with Ringshifter (sidechained by RMX) as well as EVOC 20 (a synth style filter) patched in as inserts. This sounded very cool and unique! It's a way to make complex rhythmic synth sounds, but different from #1. Again, several of us dinosaurs watching started kicking ourselves.

There were some other nice tricks as well. My favorites were:

3. Eric pulled up "Pink Noise" on Atmosphere, then ran it through Guitar Amp (a Logic plug that sounds like a . . . uhhh . . . well . . . guitar amp!) and "Scanner Vibrato," which is a Leslie simulator plug in. The resulting sound was like one of those weird reverse guitar film soundtrack cues. Very nice and it will save me the trouble of recording guitars, reversing them and doing a lot of editing because the timing wasn't working right. With Eric's way, I can play in realtime!

4. Atmosphere "Bowed Vector" through an insert "Super Trigger" which is a free plug-in from something like smartelectronics.com But that ain't it because the website isn't valid. Anyone know this one? I can't remember what the result was, but I put a star by it, so it must have been cool. :o

5. There's an electric piano patch in Trilogy. It's Jaco Fretless True Harmonics EP. Sounds nice.

6. Take an acoustic bass guitar patch (Eric used Ac Bass Gtr Full Range) and pitch it up by two octaves. Note this is different than just playing two octaves higher. What Eric did was actually having all the individual samples tweaked up by two octaves. This made a really nice destinctive acoustic guitar patch. I wonder how it would work on upright bass. Even if it doesn't sound like an acoustic, it could be a useful "new" sound.

In fact, that's what I really learned from Eric's demonstration. I get so used to using presets as is that I realize I've stopped experimenting. For that, I'm glad I caught the demo (twice!) and it's why I thought it worth sharing here. :)

- Mike Greene

dpasdernick
01-23-2006, 03:48 PM
Mike,

Thanks for the info! It's great to hear these "power tips" from you. Man, Eric makes great sounding software. Atmosphere is ancient in terms of "software years" yet holds up better than alot of the newer synths. Like the Minimoog, good sound never becomes obsolete. Plus, when you go through the patches in Atmosphere, there are very few that don't come across as keepers. This man has great ears.

My only complaint when it comes to Spectrasonics software is that there isn't enough of it!

Thanks again Mike!

Darren

PS Can anybody describe the "sidechain gate thingy" in regards to Cubase?

KingIdiot
01-23-2006, 04:06 PM
Eric is still one of my heros

P de Caumette
01-23-2006, 04:39 PM
Good stuff Mike,

thanks for sharing some of Eric's magic tricks :cool:

Doug Wellington
01-23-2006, 06:22 PM
4. Atmosphere "Bowed Vector" through an insert "Super Trigger" which is a free plug-in from something like smartelectronics.com But that ain't it because the website isn't valid. Anyone know this one?SupaTrigga...

http://bram.smartelectronix.com/plugins.php?id=6

Doug

Syncopator
01-23-2006, 08:42 PM
Thanks to Mike for this detailed info.... Mike wrote:


The RMX loop is bussed into the sidechain input of a gate, which is an insert effect on the Atmosphere track.

For the benefit of those of us who have never used a "sidechain input," could someone explain how, physically, one "busses an RMX loop into the sidechain input of a gate"?

Inserting a gate on an Atmosphere track is clear, but what is the literal procedure for bussing RMX into it's "sidechain input"?

Thanks!

FredProgGH
01-23-2006, 08:57 PM
Not all gates/compressors have a sidechain input. Many hardware units do but i don't know what software units actually even have one. If you do have one you just connect to it.

Hawkes
01-24-2006, 12:02 AM
I've been having a lot of fun using rmx to trigger synths using the demo of this sidechain gate/compressor:
http://www.db-audioware.com/dB-D-dynamics-processor-more.htm

It's working great in Sonar, and is easy to set up - just add an instance of it in the fx bin of rmx and one in the fx bin of a synth, then set the rmx one to send and the synth one to recieve.

Syncopator
01-24-2006, 12:03 AM
Not all gates/compressors have a sidechain input. Many hardware units do but i don't know what software units actually even have one. If you do have one you just connect to it.

Thanks, Fred. Mike, do you have any idea what gate Eric was using? Or at least whether it was software or hardware? Thanks.

Nick Harvey
01-24-2006, 03:33 AM
For the benefit of those of us who have never used a "sidechain input," could someone explain how, physically, one "busses an RMX loop into the sidechain input of a gate"?

Inserting a gate on an Atmosphere track is clear, but what is the literal procedure for bussing RMX into it's "sidechain input"?

Thanks!


In Logic this is how it's done.

1. Put your RMX on Instrument track 1 and Atmosphere on track 2.

2. Make sure track 1 (the RMX) has its output set to no output and its bus 1 sent to anywhere between -6 and +6 and that there is no insert effect and no ouptut on the bus 1 channel.

3. Insert a gate (in this example Logic's noise gate) as an insert effect on track 2 (Atmosphere) and put its side chain to bus 1.

4. Record a pad with Atmosphere and a beat with RMX.

Hey presto!

Cheers,

Nick

-----------------------
www.messhead.com

Syncopator
01-24-2006, 10:35 AM
In Logic this is how it's done.

1. Put your RMX on Instrument track 1 and Atmosphere on track 2.

2. Make sure track 1 (the RMX) has its output set to no output and its bus 1 sent to anywhere between -6 and +6 and that there is no insert effect and no ouptut on the bus 1 channel.

3. Insert a gate (in this example Logic's noise gate) as an insert effect on track 2 (Atmosphere) and put its side chain to bus 1.

4. Record a pad with Atmosphere and a beat with RMX.

Hey presto!

Cheers,

Nick

-----------------------
www.messhead.com

Much simpler than it sounded. Thanks a million!

Mike Greene
01-24-2006, 12:18 PM
If you don't want to use the sends, you also have the option of setting the output of the RMX track to Bus 1&2 (the output is normally set to "Output 1&2, or in Nick's example: "No Output".)

I often do it this way because I often forget to turn up the send (it usually defaults to -infinity.) Laziness on my part. Nick's method is generally better.

I usually start with bus 9, by the way, just in case I did something with the first 8 in the autoload that I forgot.

Eric's demo was in Logic and he used mostly Logic's plugin effects. I don't know which of the two Logic gates he used.

One other thought: I've been playing with this a bit and it's a little time consuming to find RMX patches that work really well (they need to be fairly sparse and have short sounds.) I didn't see which ones Eric used and it makes a big difference.

So it's easier for me to just go ahead and sequence a basic synth to play the rhythm I want, like what I described at the beginning of the thread. The tone or pitch is unimportant, so long as the sound has a hard attack and fast release.

I'd be interested to know which RMX loops are working well at this.

- Mike Greene

Patthoven
01-24-2006, 02:20 PM
I think the thing for me to do, is to bring a blanket and pitch a tent in front of Spectrasonics booth. Just Kidding :o)

I love alot of other people's stuff, cause its great!.

But for obvious reasons, I just can't get enough RMX, Atmosphere and Trilogy.

I never get sick of them becuase they are infinitely flexible(depending on my creativity and depth of knowledge), but I continue to learn something new every day about RMX and Atmosphere especially.

And the more I learn, the more I realize new potentials. I simply find the sound and technology exquisite.

I wish more developers would follow suit insofar as their releasing their stuff in RMX Native Format,..... like Kyle and the guys at NineVolt Audio. What a treasure their stuff is!

So, next year, if you see security dragging away some strangely dressed lunatic for pitching a tent in front of Spectrasonic's booth, its probably not the guy from National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation( Uncle Lester or something)... but rather just a silly musician trying to better learn how to play shmere the queer with Atmosphere.

Journeyman
01-24-2006, 02:25 PM
I wish more developers would follow suit insofar as their releasing their stuff in RMX Native Format,..... like Kyle and the guys at NineVolt Audio. What a treasure their stuff is!


You really should start a separate thread about this to get developers attention. I concur!

P de Caumette
01-25-2006, 02:55 PM
In Logic this is how it's done.

1. Put your RMX on Instrument track 1 and Atmosphere on track 2.

2. Make sure track 1 (the RMX) has its output set to no output and its bus 1 sent to anywhere between -6 and +6 and that there is no insert effect and no ouptut on the bus 1 channel.

3. Insert a gate (in this example Logic's noise gate) as an insert effect on track 2 (Atmosphere) and put its side chain to bus 1.

4. Record a pad with Atmosphere and a beat with RMX.

Hey presto!

Cheers,

Nick

-----------------------
www.messhead.com (http://www.messhead.com)

Could anyone that has been successful using this effect with Cubase SX care to describe how to go about it?
I don't understand how to set RMX to no output. Also I am using a Waves C1 for the SC compressor and I do not see how to assign its output to Bus 1...:confused:

Thanks!!

dkgross
01-25-2006, 10:18 PM
If you don't want to use the sends, you also have the option of setting the output of the RMX track to Bus 1&2 (the output is normally set to "Output 1&2, or in Nick's example: "No Output".)- Mike Greene

Hi..new guy here. Saw Erics thang at NAMM as well. The thing that intrigued me the most is that he used Seperate Outs within Logics RMX Environment Multi-Instrument to do this.

I'm waiting for a video, or at least a few How To screenshots from Eric just for clarification (but I'll experiment anyway.)

Nice to be here. Cool place!

dave gross
helldogmusic.com

Tim Kiel
01-26-2006, 07:27 AM
Could anyone that has been successful using this effect with Cubase SX care to describe how to go about it?
I don't understand how to set RMX to no output. Also I am using a Waves C1 for the SC compressor and I do not see how to assign its output to Bus 1...:confused:

Thanks!!

AFAIK Cubase doesn't support sidechaining like Logic does. If you have a TC Powercore or other TC plugins you can use the TC sidechainer and Filtroid to do something similar - although when I tried this morning it didn't sound too great, so maybe I'm missing something.

Best

Tim

PS. To send RMX to no output, go to VST Connections (F4), create a new output bus called Nowhere (or similar) and set its outputs to "Not connected". Then simply route RMX to the Nowhere out.