West Side Story [Archive] - Northern Sound Source

Styxx

06-13-2006, 09:54 AM

Wow, with all of the random topics in this forum and in the chat, I could make an hour long documentary called "When composers are bored"
I'm trying to entice a conversation on the score. OK, how about; how many of you performed or conducted West Side Story? Or, What's the big deal about West Side Story? Or, When will they do a sequel to West Side Story using today’s street gangs "East Side Story". OK, it was out of boredom that I open this score and started playing a bit of it on piano (which was a total joke), and prompted me to post this thread.
By the way ... when can we expect your documentary? :D

C J Pro

06-13-2006, 09:59 AM

The documentary will be released June 31, 2006.

I have heard of this musical, but I have not seen it nor heard any music from it that I know of. Most I know about it is that it is a modern day version of Romeo and Juliet and that it was mentioned in the script for the 1980s Little Shop of Horrors.

PaulR

06-13-2006, 10:17 AM

I'm trying to entice a conversation on the score. OK, how about; how many of you performed or conducted West Side Story?

I used to play America when I was in a rock band. Does this count?

:D

Hermitage59

06-13-2006, 10:39 AM

I used to play America when I was in a rock band. Does this count?

:D

That was Neil Diamond, Spartacus.
Showing your age now!

:D

linwood

06-13-2006, 10:46 AM

....and I liked the D.Grusin West Side Story dvd. For the music/arrangements and all the film of the sessions. I like seeing how they mic stuff. What they choose/where they put it.

Styxx

06-13-2006, 10:58 AM

linwood. Love the (your) web site!

wilx

06-13-2006, 11:14 AM

I second that. It is beyond genious.

"Delicious food - and atmosphere...makes everyone feel wecome here..."

Da da da, la la ooh...

A surefire cure for feeling sad. :)

linwood

06-13-2006, 11:41 AM

Yea...I'm jingle hack. But a working/busy hack.

Hermitage59

06-13-2006, 11:56 AM

Yea...I'm jingle hack. But a working/busy hack.

Classy website, Linwood.
And you're not the only only enjoying himself writing jingles (among other things). There's a lot of work here too. Just the job for a quick turnaround, and little hassle.
Sharpens up the melodic writing too!

Regards,

Alex.

linwood

06-13-2006, 12:12 PM

Hi Alex,
Thanks. I come here and lurk and listen/learn. The talent here blows me away. I've kind of found a niche that I can comfortably do in this jingle business, but I wanna learn to do other things musically. I started to study with someone and hopefully that will help me do some other types of things in the next few years. But most everything that I do is small market radio, retail ad work. Budgets are getting smaller and smaller it seems. But hey...How lucky are we that we can make music for a living? We should all be on our knees thanking the heavens.

wilx

06-13-2006, 12:15 PM

Absolutely. And you're already a fair way into the business, especially compared to people like me - who's just about to start. Making a living doing what you love - is there any better way of working?! :|:

C J Pro

06-13-2006, 12:34 PM

Yes, it's called supervising.

BermudaFlyer

06-13-2006, 12:45 PM

Hi,

I've had the pleasure of playing percussion in a high school production of WWS. It was an interesting challenge, but very fullfilling, musically.

Styxx

06-13-2006, 12:45 PM

Hey linwood 'ol rascule ... :D I think I'm on my way to Coco Bello's! Was it the intention of the singer to sound somewhat like Dean Martin? I listen to all the Jingle demos. Quite impressive! Just as they should be.

OK, now where was I in the score ... America! I like to be in America ... :D

Styxx

06-13-2006, 12:49 PM

Hi,

I've had the pleasure of playing percussion in a high school production of WWS. It was an interesting challenge, but very fullfilling, musically. Yeah! Cool, did you multi percussion? I played trap set in one production. As far as percussion and set playing goes, WSS is a blast! But, my favorite to play is Les Mis. Love multi percussion in Les Mis!
To add - This score has a price tag on it of $100.00! Hm, I may borrow it and attempt to render with GPO and JABB. No, maybe not. I might get people upset and cause uproar. Then again, for my own personal pleasure I could program everything in except set and play along just for grins! Maybe not, I can see the papers in the mail now to appear on the Judge Judy show. Eh, what the heck.:D

linwood

06-13-2006, 01:05 PM

yea, I wanted Dino and I wanted to hear the cocktail in his hand.

qccowboy

06-13-2006, 02:39 PM

wow!
am I getting this right?
almost no one who's posted so far has seen WSS?

it's the first "musical" to incorporate 12-tone writing, jazz, classical...
it has a score by Leonard Bernstein (I mean, THAT alone is a reason to lsiten to it)
it has a libretto by Stephen Sondheim (major reason number two for listening to it)

these two collaborators are probably two of the greatest musical/theatrical minds of the 20th century.

The film version is "meh"... a lot of the numbers are abbreviated (like "A Boy Like That/I Have A Love" and the order of the numbers is changed to suit the film's sense of pacing. Also a lot of the lyrics were changed to suit the order and character changes ("America" is now sung by guys and girls, while the original is only the girls), and some of the lyrics were toned down as well.

WSS has some of the most complex music in any Broadway show ever staged. It's also probably the only one with a jazzy, quazi-atonal fugue in it.

The quintet that ends act one is phenomenal, bringing together many themes from the first act in an incredible tour de force of counterpoint.

ok, is that what you wanted as discussion?
can you tell I love WSS and Bernstein and Sondheim?

Frodo

06-13-2006, 05:11 PM

Useless bits of musical trivia:

In the film version of West Side Story, Natalie Wood's (Maria's) singing was actually dubbed in by a woman named Marni Nixon. Marni Nixon also dubbed in portions of Rita Moreno's (Anita's) songs in the same movie, so in places where Maria and Anita sing together, Marni is very likely singing a duet with herself. Marni also dubbed in the singing parts for Audrey Hepburn in "My Fair Lady" and for Deborah Kerr in "The King and I". Although Deborah's voice was somewhat lower than Marni's normal singing range, Marni was able to pull the part off because she had a cold at the time the soundtrack was being recorded. Marni herself can be seen in the movie "The Sound of Music" as one of the extras in the chorus of singing nuns...

BTW I agree with qccowboy--the Quintet is a very cool piece...similar in some respects to the quartet in Sondheim's "Johanna, Marry Me Sunday" from Sweeney Todd. Sondheim rocks.

qccowboy

06-13-2006, 06:12 PM

Hey I knew about Natale being dubbed... but I'm surprised that parts of Rita's songs were dubbed. It seems so strange since she sang the part on Broadway! If I were her I'd be insulted!

I believe most of the film cast (except the two leads) actually performed in the stage version? my Broadway trivia isn't the strongest.

I also particularly like how all the adult roles are speaking roles, while the "kids" sing. A bit like how the white people in Porgy and Bess are all speaking roles. I find that approach intriguing.

Oh, and that quartet from Sweeney is AMAZING! I had the pleasure of conducting Sweeney a couple of years ago with a VERY fine young cast, and that quartet always brought tears to my eyes. It's not sad or anything, not even particularly emotional, but the MUSIC! it's so amazing.

rwayland

06-13-2006, 07:26 PM

Well, when I first saw the movie version, in Germany, in 1962 or so, I did a simultaneous translation for Rosl who did not understand much English. It was a rough and ready translation. There is not much time to pause and mull over the best translation. Even now I am mildly shocked at how I translated the part about Rita Moreno (I think) carrying on about how her boy friend was a better lover after a rumble. But she got the idea.

Richard

fastlane

06-14-2006, 12:32 AM

West Side Story, Oklahoma and Kristina Fran Duvemala are my favorite musicals.

CallMeZoot

06-14-2006, 07:52 AM

I have seen it many, many times in the theatre and on the screen, and (stage) directed it twice. I haven't music-directed it yet, but I would absolutely love to--I'm getting a bit tired of beating out the same old cut time patterns in every other musical on earth.

I think WSS is abso-freaking-lutely brilliant. The book, the lyrics, the choreography, the music. Right down to the way the characters talk, it creates its own little world and pulls the viewer in. I have only a handful of musicals that I genuinely and unreservedly love, and West Side Story is miles above them all.

The concert suite is pretty amazing too, if you want to appreciate the music in its own right. I'm not a huge Leonard Bernstein fan in general, but I consider WSS a great work of art that stands up with the great, classic operas. (I think it's better than his "legit" opera Candide, which is also pretty good).

The music is just amazing and unique, the story is powerful, the characters are 3-dimensional, the ending is haunting. It's one of the more deep and emotionally poignant musicals there is, without esorting to cheap heartstring-pulling tactics and saccharine lovey-dovey-ness.

chris.

Frodo

06-14-2006, 12:18 PM

Hey I knew about Natale being dubbed... but I'm surprised that parts of Rita's songs were dubbed. It seems so strange since she sang the part on Broadway! If I were her I'd be insulted!

Oh, and that quartet from Sweeney is AMAZING! I had the pleasure of conducting Sweeney a couple of years ago with a VERY fine young cast, and that quartet always brought tears to my eyes. It's not sad or anything, not even particularly emotional, but the MUSIC! it's so amazing.

Yep, I understand Rita Moreno did sing parts of some of her numbers herself in the film, but she was helped by Marni Nixon and another singer named Betty Wand.

Regarding "Johanna, Marry Me Sunday" from Sweeney, I can see that--very thrilling piece of musical theatre. In a musical I've been working on for several years now I was inspired by and modeled my eleventh o'clock number to some degree on that very piece. Interestingly enough, I just remembered...the leading female who sang my eleventh o'clock number just a couple of weeks ago told me it reminded her of the Quintet from West Side Story. Perhaps if I get around to orchestrating it with my Finale/GPO toys I might post it in the listening room. :)

Inkfingers

06-14-2006, 01:24 PM

The film version is "meh"... a lot of the numbers are abbreviated (like "A Boy Like That/I Have A Love" and the order of the numbers is changed to suit the film's sense of pacing. Also a lot of the lyrics were changed to suit the order and character changes ("America" is now sung by guys and girls, while the original is only the girls), and some of the lyrics were toned down as well.

I admittedly haven't seen a stage production of WSS, but I have to disagree that the film version is "meh." It's one of the most fantastic movies I've ever seen. Everything from the quality of the music production (sound quality, performance, conducting, etc.) to the singing, acting, costumes, direction, sets, cinematography, and especially the choreography is amazing.

I like how the numbers were ordered for the movie. Placing "Cool" before the rumble and "Officer Krupke" after it seems like a very bad idea. I think it was one of the best decisions of the filmmakers to reverse these. And having heard the original, very "meh" Broadway cast recordings, having "America" sung by the men vs. the women was another brilliant move. You could cut the sexual tension in that scene with a knife.

--

I too concur that WSS was a stroke of brilliance in musical theatre. No other musical I've seen comes anywhere close to its level.

wst3ae

06-14-2006, 11:41 PM

I'm not a big fan of the traditional Broadway Musical, but I do love West Side Story, and Wonderful Town, another of his masterworks!

I played Bass in a production of Wonderful Town, but never had the priviledge of working on West Side Story.

Trivia - West Side Story started out with a different title... anyone know what it was, and why they changed it?

rwayland

06-15-2006, 12:25 AM

Trivia - West Side Story started out with a different title... anyone know what it was, and why they changed it?

Yes and no!

Richard

SteveMitchell

06-16-2006, 12:07 AM

After seeing all forms of WSS, I have to say the one that I enjoy the most is the 1985 DG recording with Lenny conducting Te Kanawa, Carreras, Troyanos, and of course Kurt Ollmann.

I guess I've always appreciated the work mostly for it's libretto and OF COURSE, the music. I recently got the DVD of the recording sessions, and I am in heaven.

I also have the West Side Story Conductor Score that incorporated the changes that Lenny made for this session. I really don't know why I bought it, but I guess at one time I had fantasies of sequencing some of the songs, but it was just too darn difficult for me to do. Plus the fact that I couldn't post the work because of copyright issues.

Lenny is my fav, and rules everywhere!

Steve

PaulR

06-16-2006, 05:26 AM

Alright, I'm forced into my top 3:
2.) My Fair Lady
Why!? Because of MELODIES!
Melodies Rule!
Ern :|: :)

Why? Come on Ern - it's Audrey! :D

For swingalong memorable melodies and rousing tunes I love Guys & Dolls. And Jean in a red uniform of course. :D

Sit Down You're Rocking the Boat - I love that tune with Stubby Kaye is it?

Journeyman

06-16-2006, 07:55 AM

Dave Grusin's adaptation of WSS is wonderful! But where has he disappeared to lately? The last I heard of him was as producer of the last James Taylor Christmas CD. Dave, you out there??

Styxx

06-16-2006, 08:42 AM

I'm back. I've been taking care of matters after my wife's car was slamed in the rear of while waiting at a stop sign. Anyway, this thread needs revision.

Haydn

06-16-2006, 06:12 PM

Steve,

I saw the same video of the 1985 DG recording of West Side Story when sitting in on one of my wife's music appreciation classes when she was in college about 16-17 years ago. This was a very fascinating video. Went out and bought the CD a little while later.

Jim

Richard Berg

07-06-2006, 01:52 AM

Jun Yamamoto

07-06-2006, 09:56 AM

I'm into this score BIG TIME! :) Cool....:cool:

The best musical I know. The music is superb. One and only.

Bruce A. Richardson

07-06-2006, 11:26 AM

Indeed, an amazing score. Never forget the first time I was counting rests in the pit and realized that the "Cool" theme is a tone row...

Has anyone on Northern Sounds done a sample/synth rendition I should listen to?

Man, that would be a job, woudn't it?

I agree with you guys on West Side Story. There really has never been a musical like it before or since. I like Candide as well. I had the opportunity to conduct that overture once, and it's one of those pieces that is just a total blast to do (and with which you can definitely put a group's collective danglies on the stomping block). I love the way he took that Brahms theme, reset it in seven, and made it soar so much. You can hear the love and respect in it.

I think Bernstein's mark was that he wrote music that he would love to conduct. It's some of the most unabashed emotionalism in all of music, but he had a knack for doing it with such taste, smarts, and style that you just want to drink it up. Its audacity is its charm.

I personally have always approached more mainstream projects by using the same artistic filters I'd normally use in a totally no-rules project, then I sand off the edges that are too rough. Thinking about Bernstein's approach, it seems to be the opposite; that he took very broad, commercial strokes, but then pushed it through a filter of modernism, adding corners and spikes instead of sanding them away. It makes me want to consider giving that approach a try, because it really worked.

jonray

07-06-2006, 01:51 PM

PaulR

07-06-2006, 03:23 PM

Styxx

07-06-2006, 05:51 PM

Here's a short piano duet of "America". Not my arrangement, but I'm having fun playing it with my pupils at the moment.

America (http://my-mp3s.music-4-schools.co.uk/America (piano duet).mp3)

It's GPO steinway. Cheers :)
Jon A ha! Wonderful! You started at 50 in score or is this where your piano score begins? I was waiting for the very beginning Claves and Guiro "Moderato, Tempo di "Seis" to Rosalia entrance. See, that is what I get for being so unkind and expecting (if you know what I mean.) You must finish! The dance sequence is exciting and powerful! Ah, I miss the theatre!
Bravo and thank you so much for posting!
:)

Steve_Karl

07-07-2006, 01:16 AM

Styxx

07-07-2006, 07:34 AM

I got yelled at by my high school band director for riffin' on "Maria" (trumpet then) in 1968 in the instrument storage room.
He said "Hey ... do you always warm up like that!!!"
He must'a had a hangover. :-) Wish you had taped (recorded) your playing.
Most band directors / music teachers do not like to hear something embellished like Maria. Me, I used to encourage using your mind to break boundaries and experiment with traditional music as long as you don't pull the stunt during rehearsal or a concert. I believe it expands your limits and strengthens your growth and talent. You may have thought you were just "goofing" off but I believe you were encouraging yourself to try different flavors within traditional boundaries.
Now, I would have encouraged you to do more naturally on your own time.

Infinite5ths

11-22-2006, 11:58 PM

...played the Symphonic Dances from West Side Story in Tulsa at the beginning of the month. I love the score and the whole production. Listening & checking out the piano/vocal arrangments don't come close to a really playing it with full orchestra.

I consider Leonard Bernstein to be the greatest musician America has ever produced. Yes, we've arguably had better or more talented specialists (violinists, pianists, conductors, composers, etc.). But nobody had it ALL like Bernstein.