Thinking of buying "Ivory"

[steve martin]

Hi folks,

I have people asking me to do recordings of various hymn improvisations - being a church musician piano player etc. A real piano recording, with the costs on hiring a studio etc, could be expensive...so, I had Ivory reccommended to me as a pretty great piano. Can anyone who owns this library give me some information on it? I've heard the demo's and they are pretty impressive.
I will soon have a double processor cpu computer built, that will have at least, 3 gigs of ram, running windows xp.

Thanks if anyone can help me out with some info here.

regards,

Steve Martin:)

[mattdean]

Get it. It rocks! I love it.

[steve martin]

Thanks Matt for your feedback. It's good to know how positive you feel about this libary.

regards,

Steve:)

[Hans Scheffler]

Another vote for Ivory.
It really has a geat tone and lots of useful features to personalize the sound and optimize it for your own playing style.

*() :|:

[wind]

yes and also try NI Akoustik, it's also very good and even better in the aspekt of sympatic strings simulation !

[ddarwin7]

Hi Steve

Not sure if you've seen this site before.

http://www.playivorys.com/modules.php?name=Piano_compare

But I think another worthy contender is pianoteq, with full piano behavior. I don't have either pianoteq or Ivory yet, but I am still debating between these two libs, and they are about the same price. These I believe are definitely some of the best out there.

Dd

[nikolas]

I love Ivory as well!

It's got 3 pianos, all of which are shining and brilliant!

To be honest there are 3 issues with Ivory that I've not overcome!

* I'm mainly using EW libraries, and I could never ever mix Ivory with them. The difference is huge. In the end I had to ue the Steinway B piano offered with xp pro EW to make the mixing easier, and plus it sounds much more mellow than Ivory no matter the settings! So yes if yoy are going for solo piano music, abolsutly no doubt!

* It is a beast in the hard disk! All three pianos take up 45 Gb! Which is huge considering it's just... a piano. Depends again on what you're using, your computer and everything else.

* It is a beast regarding RAM. It really needs the 2 GB RAM, otherwise you start cutting down the elements that make Ivory so special. Again with 3 GB you shouldn't have a problem, unless have other samples loaded as well, which doesn't seem to be the case with you.

Generally it's a fantastic set of pianos! The sound is the most realstic I've heard from everything (even Ni Akoustik, which I was considering and I'm also a pianist!), and you can customise the velocity layers, to bring it closer to your needs nad playing, which is hugely important for live playing!

More like a general review, than an asnwering post to your thread (as you are very specific to what you want and why...), but still maybe it will come in handy. :)

[steve martin]

Wow guys, that's brilliant feedback! I'd like to say thanks to all of you for all the opinions and help.
thank you again for your help.

best,

Steve:)

[aLfR3dd]

I love Ivory as well!

It's got 3 pianos, all of which are shining and brilliant!

To be honest there are 3 issues with Ivory that I've not overcome!

* I'm mainly using EW libraries, and I could never ever mix Ivory with them. The difference is huge. In the end I had to ue the Steinway B piano offered with xp pro EW to make the mixing easier, and plus it sounds much more mellow than Ivory no matter the settings! So yes if yoy are going for solo piano music, abolsutly no doubt!

* It is a beast in the hard disk! All three pianos take up 45 Gb! Which is huge considering it's just... a piano. Depends again on what you're using, your computer and everything else.

* It is a beast regarding RAM. It really needs the 2 GB RAM, otherwise you start cutting down the elements that make Ivory so special. Again with 3 GB you shouldn't have a problem, unless have other samples loaded as well, which doesn't seem to be the case with you.

Generally it's a fantastic set of pianos! The sound is the most realstic I've heard from everything (even Ni Akoustik, which I was considering and I'm also a pianist!), and you can customise the velocity layers, to bring it closer to your needs nad playing, which is hugely important for live playing!

More like a general review, than an asnwering post to your thread (as you are very specific to what you want and why...), but still maybe it will come in handy. :)


I use Ewqlso and it blends perfectly with it.....The Expressive Concert D patch....

[nikolas]

You could juts quote the first point I made... not the whole post ... :D

Really???

I'll give it a try, but I had real troulbe trying to fit them together and just couldn't... And not in 1 but two pieces with other libraries as well...

but yes, I do take your word... I don't doubt you. I personally find that EW libraries are difficutl to mix with anything really... Because of the realistic reverb they have...

Oh... btw I'm using Gold not Platinum...

[Chinablu]

Ivory beats NI Akoustik, IMHO.

The resonance feature of NI is intriguing, but Ivory remains, IMO, one of the best sampled piano around.

Pianoteq, to me, is a completely different idea of piano, occupies a minimal amount of ram and, indeed, represents a virtuoso work of physical engineering; but I hear lots of synthetic in its output, yet.

If, as me, you can't afford a real C1 (or Bosendorfer, or Steinway or a Fazioli, after the recently released expansion kit), Ivory could be the best compromise.

:)

[kstevege]

I did A TON of research on this before my purchase. The two top dogs right now are Ivory and Akoustik Piano. No BS. Some reviews give the edge to Ivory others give the edge to Akoustik. You can't go wrong with either one. But Akoustic uses a lot less hard drive space because NI managed their samples very efficiently. (Never judge a sample library on the amount of hard drive space it takes up! Smart programming goes a long way! )Anyway I went with Akoustik piano but it almost came down to flipping a coin! Regarding NI, the interface is very user friendly and the boxed convolution reverb sounds great.

[Chinablu]

PS - Akoustik includes a charming vertical Steingraber. I like it.

:)

[cleartrueblue]

Hi Steve, you must check out the Art Vista Virtual Grand:
http://www.artvista.net/Virtual_Grand_Piano.html

Not a few of us think this gives Ivory et al more than a run for the money. Check out the demos, especially the one that Hans improvised. This thing is capable of some very subtle expression, and sounds beautiful.

[steve martin]

Hi Guys,

again, Thank you heaps for all of the ideas and different pianos to try. This is great to have all of this help. I do appreciate this.

best regards to all of you who have posted. I am now whirling around the web sites and pressing demo buttons and listening. It's really a lot of fun!

thanks,

Steve:)

[kstevege]

Hi Steve, you must check out the Art Vista Virtual Grand:
http://www.artvista.net/Virtual_Grand_Piano.html

Not a few of us think this gives Ivory et al more than a run for the money. Check out the demos, especially the one that Hans improvised. This thing is capable of some very subtle expression, and sounds beautiful.


Yep. I researched just about every sampled grand piano out there. Art Vista is good and was on my top 5 list prior to the release of Ivory and Akoustik Piano.

[Ashermusic]

Sampletekk's Seven Seas Grand and TBO are also worthy of consideration
(Yamaha C7). The Seven Seas Grand has become my
"go to" piano because it is extremely versatile, can handle many
treatments of EQ and compression with aplomb, and sits in a mix really
well.

[peter269]

If you're thinking about Ivory, especially if you're going on the road, I've been told (can't confirm this because I don't have the software) that Ivory works tremendously inside a Muse Receptor.

You can read about Muse Receptor here:
http://www.truespec.com/muse-receptor-p-543.html

But you might want to look at www.museresearch.com (http://www.museresearch.com) at some of their videos and endorsements.

Obviously, this is a more expensive way to go, but if you're doing a lot of road work, this might be worth considering.

I have the ArtVista piano, and I find it to be excellent. A test we made for an upcoming instruction book was to see how this keyboard library responded to playing piano MIDI files exported from a notation program. In each piano we tested, we found Hans Adamson's piano gave warmth, life and a sense of naturalness to the tested MIDI files, which were a Grade VI keyboard level.

[Ashermusic]

I have the ArtVista piano, and I find it to be excellent. A test we made for an upcoming instruction book was to see how this keyboard library responded to playing piano MIDI files exported from a notation program. In each piano we tested, we found Hans Adamson's piano gave warmth, life and a sense of naturalness to the tested MIDI files, which were a Grade VI keyboard level.

I love it also. It is very emotional to play but my engineer hates the phasing in it.

[Beethree]

[QUOTE=peter269]If you're thinking about Ivory, especially if you're going on the road, I've been told (can't confirm this because I don't have the software) that Ivory works tremendously inside a Muse Receptor.

You can read about Muse Receptor here:
http://www.truespec.com/muse-receptor-p-543.html

But you might want to look at www.museresearch.com (http://www.museresearch.com) at some of their videos and endorsements.

Obviously, this is a more expensive way to go, but if you're doing a lot of road work, this might be worth considering.

QUOTE]

I can confirm that Ivory runs spectacularly well on Receptor.

[cleartrueblue]

Hi Jay,

I believe the phasing is limited to the Art Vista "Jazz Piano" patch which has sample layers doubled on top one another (unless of course one has the built-in phaser turned on)? I haven't noticed this otherwise in the unprocessed samples.

Cheers.

[cleartrueblue]

Steve,

I'd suggest listening to the demos with your intended purpose in mind. Some developers seem to strive to emulate the experience of sitting down at a piano - to have that sound coming out of the monitors.

What most of us aim for when we use these virtual pianos is to have the sound of a good studio recording coming out of the monitors, which can be different to the above. It's helpful if the developer had this in mind.

Best/Mark

[Ashermusic]

Hi Jay,

I believe the phasing is limited to the Art Vista "Jazz Piano" patch which has sample layers doubled on top one another (unless of course one has the built-in phaser turned on)? I haven't noticed this otherwise in the unprocessed samples.

Cheers.

Well my engineer sure does and complains about it:)

But actually I just loaded the Arthur Rubenstein patch and listened and I hear it too. It doesn't bother me as much as it does my engineer but it is there. In fact, I believe I wrote about it in this forum once before and Hans responded as to why that was.

[gigagagga]

Akoustik Piano is much more playable. I Have them both and much prefer NI's product.

giga...

[Hans Adamson]

But actually I just loaded the Arthur Rubenstein patch and listened and I hear it too.

Jay,

There are just a few patches in VGP with layered samples. They are mentioned in the manual in this quote:

NOTE: A few of the presets require a higher performance of your computer: "The JAZZ PIANO" presets draw twice the polyphony. Presets: "Diana Krall Style," "Arthur Rubinstein Style B," and "Bill Evans Style B" also draw twice the polyphony.

For those who want to make up their own mind, we have demos in different styles:

http://artvista.net/VGP_Demos.htm

Best,
Hans Adamson
Art Vista Productions
http://artvista.net/

[Ashermusic]

Jay,

There are just a few patches in VGP with layered samples. They are mentioned in the manual in this quote:

NOTE: A few of the presets require a higher performance of your computer: "The JAZZ PIANO" presets draw twice the polyphony. Presets: "Diana Krall Style," "Arthur Rubinstein Style B," and "Bill Evans Style B" also draw twice the polyphony.

For those who want to make up their own mind, we have demos in different styles:

http://artvista.net/VGP_Demos.htm

Best,
Hans Adamson
Art Vista Productions
http://artvista.net/

So it is the layered samples that causes the phasing?

Once again Hans I love playing the VG so I will go through the patches again and see if can make my engineer happy.

[Hans Adamson]

Jay,

I don't know exactly what your engineer is hearing. There is inherent phasing in every piano because of open strings between 1200-3000Hz interacting with the overtones of strings in the lower frequencies. There is also always some amount of phasing in every stereo recording of a piano because of the distance between the microphones (unless you use a coincident pair). Any possible phasing that your engineer is hearing in the few patches mentioned above should be attributed to the fact that they are doubled. However, it should only occur at higher frequencies maybe above 5kHz or so.

Different engineers, different opinions - I just recently received this note:

"An artist came into the recording studio I work at to record some tracks. At the studio we have an array of high-end samplers, synths, and vintage pianos. However his PC running Virtual Grand Piano sounded better than anything we had. Needless to say I'm sold..."

We have several world class artists using VGP. I recommend everyone looking for a new piano purchase to make up their own mind by listening to demos. The demo referred to earlier in this thread can be heard here:

http://artvista.net/VGP%20Demos/VGP_Improvisation_Demo.mp3

Demos in other styles are available at our demo page:

http://artvista.net/VGP_Demos.htm


Best,
Hans Adamson
Art Vista Productions
http://artvista.net/

[Ashermusic]

Once again, Hans, I love VGP. Between it and the Sampletekk Seven Seas Grand I have not felt a need to buy either Ivory or Akoustic Grand.

I hate the Kontakt player however. I am experimenting using the VGP in standalone mode with Logic coming in through Logic's External audio instrument so that when I boot up a new song I don't have to wait for it to reload. But after a while I start getting some dropouts and other weird things that simply do not happen if I use EXS24 based sounds.

Folks, I know it sounds like I am always knocking N.I. but I just find that the less N.I. stuff I use the less problems I have.

[musicjon]

I run Ivory on the road using Logic on a MacBook with 2GB RAM and a Firewire drive. I have had zero problems with it, and it sounds wonderful.

[Roel/Truepianos]

Hi,

A very convincing sounding demos.. However I hear a lot of hiss/background noise in the demos, which seemingly seem to repeat themselves at certain notes/chords, which is a pitty.


http://artvista.net/VGP%20Demos/VGP_Improvisation_Demo.mp3

Demos in other styles are available at our demo page:

http://artvista.net/VGP_Demos.htm

[sporter]

Ivory is great, but has anyone noticed the samples seem somewhat crappy an octave or so below middle "C"? The lows and highs blow me away, but that range seems artificial sounding. I hear in it most of the samples, but more pronounced in the Yamaha...

[mal7]

I run Ivory on the road using Logic on a MacBook with 2GB RAM and a Firewire drive. I have had zero problems with it, and it sounds wonderful.

Which MacBook to you use? And do you run it through XP or OSX? Also could you please advise what audio interface and hard drive you are using.

(Last week I bought a MacBook Pro 2.33Ghz and trying to get Ivory working without success to date)

thanks for any advice
Mal

[Kenny Long]

I can't believe no one mentioned the William Coakley pianos. I own NI and Ivory and prefer the WC pianos.

[dewdman42]

Wow... Sounds like many people as picky about their piano as I am.

I've played around on Ivory a bit and it sounds wonderful to me. Better than anything else I have played on, but I haven't tried NI yet, nor the PMI stuff nor some others. I have not purchased Ivory yet because one of my main needs is for live gigging and I really want to fit the piano onto the internal 100GB drive(along with everything else). While I could pick and choose which Ivory samples I use, I think 45GB is just flat out a lot of HD space for a piano.

I could see myself using Ivory at home or in the studio for sure...but most of the time I am doing piano in a mix when I am recording. There are less expensive alternatives to suit that need just fine, that take a lot less HD space to boot.

I just find Ivory to be about the only sampled piano I have ever played that actually made it fun to practice the piano for hours on end without getting digital piano ear fatigue, which all of the others do. It literally gives me more inspiration then all the other digital pianos I've owned or tried......closer to what a real piano does. I don't have a real piano now, but I want one. I might get Ivory just for this purpose alone.

A word about Art Vista. I know a lot of people love it. I tried it and it did not work well for me. The tone is very nice indeed. However I hear clearly some built in early reflection verb in the tone which muddies it up as far as I'm concerned. Or maybe I'm hearing the phasing that someone complained about. I haven't been able to try it in a mix or anything, but definitely just playing it solo, to me it sounded like it was recorded in a just slightly live room and for that reason it doesn't work for me. I'd rather add my own verb.

I have another question, does anyone know of any Mason&Hamlin sample libs out there? This is my favorite real piano in the world and so far nobody seems to have sampled one.

I'd also really like to know what some of you think about the Vienna pianos, PMI pianos, and low HD size pianos that would be suitable for gigging.

[studio64]

Hi dewdman

I have the pmi/EastWest Bosendorfer 290 standalone, which I can also load into Kontakt 2.
This has been my favorite piano, until I bought Ivory this week.
I just can't stop playing Ivory, especially the Steinway.

When I go back a play the PMI/EW 290, it still sounds great, but just missing those finer things.

Sampletek/PMI are virtually giving away the PMI pianos at the moment , and I have Emperor on order and already own Old Lady.
They all have their good points.

regards

[dewdman42]

Yea $50 at Sampletek. That is cheap. What's the rub? Eastwest has something by the same name for $200. What is the difference? Is this the same set of samples but EW includes a sampler player?

[maxiseller]

I've recently tried out Modartt's Pianoteq trial that is available on their website here (http://www.pianoteq.com/) and here (http://www.pianoteq.com/audiodemos) is the examples page of it in use.

It's an 8mb program which is amazing really, and it uses mathematics rather than samples to create the piano sound.

As I say, I've been very impressed with it, and it certainly seems to emulate resonance, peddling and key effect better than any virtual instrument I've seen.