And We Thought Composing Film Music Was Hard...

[rikp]

Has anyone seen this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMKrZuUaehI&mode=related&search=


Peace

rikp

[billval3]

I can't believe they actually posted these videos! What a load of crap!

[RobbinsEgg]

Ya! those video "lessons" and about $5 will get you a nice sandwich for lunch. Ridiculous!

[FredProgGH]

You guys are never going to score 1,000 movies a month with that attitude.

[alanb]

Fred!!!!

Whose picture was that in your old avatar?

Sorry for barging in on this thread... I've just been meaning to ask and I've just noticed that his old avatar is gone... :o


Alan

[FredProgGH]

It was a frame grab from some really low budget horror movie but I'm danged if I can remember what now. Ohh, wait, yes I do- Satan's Little Helper!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0380687/

[Houston Haynes]

Man - I got two minutes in and bailed - no way this ends well... library tracks are one thing - a well-seasoned score is entirely another. What a joke.

[Richard Barr]

A few people including myself questioned this idea and were critical of the "final" music that was produced. The composer, who is also a Taxi screener said he was happy with the results and this piece would most definitely be forwarded. Garbage like this is amatuerish and would never make it to air.

All these negative comments have been deleted. So much for opposing points of view.

[Crossingsound]

Library tracks are no easier, Most of them require top notch production and comprable to anything out there on the higher competitive levels. I just love one of the comments, "that any decent composer can crank out 10 library tracks a day." Sure, 10 non produced tracks maybe.

I also like how the composer said this is his first time using garage band, I didn't see him push a button at all to begin with, the other guy did

[Will Roget]

Yeah it is kinda strange to see someone who's in charge of screening being that lenient towards production quality. I was about say it's also strange that he's making it seem like any 10 year old child with a free program can get their music on TV, but then I remembered about TAXI's signup fee ;). So I guess it's within his best interests to make it seem easy, and get as many people signing up as possible (more $$$ in TAXI's pockets) - and then just continue to forward music only from more established submitters.

But, on a less cynical note, I think he could also be coming from a different angle. Maybe he's really just saying that a shotgun approach is more effective in this particular situation. That is, it's better to make a library of 1000 30-sec tracks for a hundred scenarios/styles that are produced just barely at the professional level, than it is to take forever making 10 lengthy "masterpieces" and just hope and pray that some situation will call for them.

[rikp]

A few people including myself questioned this idea and were critical of the "final" music that was produced. The composer, who is also a Taxi screener said he was happy with the results and this piece would most definitely be forwarded. Garbage like this is amatuerish and would never make it to air.

All these negative comments have been deleted. So much for opposing points of view.


I also find it interesting that the negative comments were deleted as I posted one, and it never came up. :p

What kind of experiences have folks on this forum had with Taxi? Mine have been interesting. I have had many things forwarded with no follow up and no $$. Guess I just need to work harder!

Peace

rikp

[rikp]

Thanks for the insights Ern:)

Peace

rikp

[etherjab]

all I know, is that I would love to see a video tape of myself during my scoring "process".... its certainly nothing like that!

yeah these guys are definitely oversimplifying things... but I applaud their efforts...

broadcast quality? I think not... those strings sounded hideous... and they didn't even talk about mixing and engineering... yeah sure you could take those two tracks to capital records and they'd make them sound amazing, but those guys aren't capital...

[tradivoro]

First, i just wanted to say, that I definitely agree that the whole process is being WAY too oversimplified. However, recently I took one of these couple of hour "classes" at the learning annex, being taught be a couple of music supervisors, all of who had good credits... anyway, in class, they were praising this one student's track that was basically a bad pop song with bad production... They were saying how great this is for some commercials and stuff... Other tracks played from other students also were written by people with not a hell of a lot of experience writing music... And here again, they were speaking favorably about it, although it really wasn't that good.. And all the music supervisors musical experience was either as songwriter, or listener...

I'm just mentioning this because the ideology being promoted in this video might be more commonplace and accepted across the board than we think... Not that I agree with it..

[Houston Haynes]

I can't tell you how many time's I've knocked out a vibe-alike track in an hour - and gotten notes back that "it's too on the money" from the music supervisor.

Oh, the irony.

:D

[Randyp]

Gotta love the music biz)(~

Randy

[tradivoro]

Oh believe me, the comments these guys were making... I mean, there was nothing about them that would make you think they had great musical taste or anything... But they were all working, which is always the case with guys like these... It's not about what you know, it's who know.. :)

Not to metion my own personal bias, that I think that most of these guys are just dilettantes that got on somebody's good side, and since then have been working that as a "music supervisor" and is now the person for making decisions as to whose music gets on a project... It's all too sick...


I can't tell you how many time's I've knocked out a vibe-alike track in an hour - and gotten notes back that "it's too on the money" from the music supervisor.

Oh, the irony.

:D

[Chiseen]

Dear all,

I live in Hong Kong and these sort of cues are exactly the type of thing you hear on TV every day.

Infact any daily soap opera has exactly this kind of content. 'Neighbours' et al.

It's a shame because the audience grows up listening to this sort of 'durge' and rarely develope a sense of taste.

I don't want to disrespect Hong Kong TV too much as there are a number of very high quality programmes (The Hong Kong speciallty, Kung Fu Drama's for instance).

Chinese, Korean and Japanese productions often have beautifully written, live recorded scores even for TV dramas and Cartoons, so it seems possible to produce great cues on a strict deadlines.

Broadcast quality? Yes... for many many TV channels!

Chiseen

[GigaLove]

huh...what for a fresh and never before used chord progression...~|

[Andrew Aversa]

Ah the world of library music. Will is mostly right - you will make more money if you have 1,000 "OK" tracks than a handful of masterpieces. Libraries like dealing in bulk, and it's always easier to sell a full CD of tracks than go for direct placements unless you're already really established. Michael Laskow knows what he's talking about as well.

But TAXI itself is not a scam and they're really not out to line their pockets. If you follow the boards, talk to the company, and talk to the members you'll see they do a LOT of stuff that actually causes them to lose money, but they do it anyway to benefit the artist. I've personally had about 15 tracks forwarded and I'm a relative nobody. I personally know several people who have had dozens of forwards & multiple deals in various categories - in many cases, their first actual $ deals in the biz.

With regards to the person who said it's not for the "serious" composer... I'm fairly sure Matt Hirt would beg to differ, as he makes a very healthy income for himself just about entirely through Taxi doing film/TV music.

[Crossingsound]

I am not sure what libraries you guys are reffering to when you say that 1000 ok tracks will make it. Music libraries have very stiff competition, and some excellent composers and usually the production is TOP notch, it has to be. Unless it is a new library or a low grade one looking to fill thier library with tracks, usually they will be picky about what they select, specially if there is money up front. the libraries that don't offer money up front probally will take more tracks from the start, but it doesnt' mean they won't be picky. You can't just come up with a hundred 30 second tracks and expect to get them placed and making money in the music production library world. Most of them require full length (at least 1:30-2:00) with broadcast edits and production that is record label par.

Library music is no cake walk, it takes top notch skill and prodution value. I have yet to use a library track that is not well produced or written.

[Richard Barr]

I am not sure what libraries you guys are reffering to when you say that 1000 ok tracks will make it. Music libraries have very stiff competition, and some excellent composers and usually the production is TOP notch, it has to be. Unless it is a new library or a low grade one looking to fill thier library with tracks, usually they will be picky about what they select, specially if there is money up front. the libraries that don't offer money up front probally will take more tracks from the start, but it doesnt' mean they won't be picky. You can't just come up with a hundred 30 second tracks and expect to get them placed and making money in the music production library world. Most of them require full length (at least 1:30-2:00) with broadcast edits and production that is record label par.

Library music is no cake walk, it takes top notch skill and prodution value. I have yet to use a library track that is not well produced or written.

Well said. This is a very competitive business and poor written or produced tracks will not be accepted by any decent library. Many of the libraries that Taxi deals with are low end online libraries where you make no money worth mentioning or new companies that are trying to fill the pipeline and have a long way to go before making any money for anyone.

Also, being forwarded by Taxi doesn't mean a hell of a lot. They seem to guarantee that by having music go through them, the composer/producer will get a listen by the people that matter in the company. This is very misleading. In talking to many publishers/libraries, I have been told that they are so overwhelmed by material that much of the Taxi music (and I'm sure other submissions as well) just doesn't receive any attention and eventually gets tossed. This is where I have a major problem with Taxi's marketing. If they were to say that by joining Taxi, you have a chance of being heard, not a guarantee but a chance, that would be the reality. But I guess if they said that, nobody would join.

In reality, anyone can go to the Taxi website and peruse the list of companies they deal with and go direct to any of those libraries. You will receive the same treatment and have the same chance of success.

[monkeymike]

To play devils advocate- sometimes if I have a whole day to write 3 minutes of music I can't do it- when I only have 30 minutes- I seem to at least get something out. It may not be perfect- but you can at least get the ball rolling. Sometimes I only have 30 minutes in the day to write. That being said- I don't like their mickey mouse approach to it all. I guess a creaters, we'd like to think that even if we write a tune in 30 minutes, it's all those years of experience that make it happen

Mike

www.nuanceinsound.com

[Crossingsound]

I am not sure they are sending the right message too. I mean saying how simple and easy it is to do this job, heck anyone can do this in 30 minutes. Simple, give us lots of money for our very easy art.

I mean even if someone was able to write something great in a short amount of time, which does happen from time to time when the ideas are just coming, why would you tell your clients how simple it was and yet expect them to pay you good money? Bad marketing, and also discrediting their judgement as well. Music execs are usually not stupid, and they usually know good production, so this advertising how easy it is seems like it would make the industry respect taxi's judgement even less.

[Richard Barr]

I am not sure they are sending the right message too. I mean saying how simple and easy it is to do this job, heck anyone can do this in 30 minutes. Simple, give us lots of money for our very easy art.

I mean even if someone was able to write something great in a short amount of time, which does happen from time to time when the ideas are just coming, why would you tell your clients how simple it was and yet expect them to pay you good money? Bad marketing, and also discrediting their judgement as well. Music execs are usually not stupid, and they usually know good production, so this advertising how easy it is seems like it would make the industry respect taxi's judgement even less.

I think the company started off with good intentions but it's obvious that with this new marketing campaign of how "easy" it is to do music for TV they have crossed the line into misrepresentation, luring in more and more folks to shell out $300 for a chance at the brass ring. It's a very unprofessional presentation that takes advantage of people' desperation to succeed in the music business.

[Andrew Aversa]

Um, that would be me, Andrew. Let me rephrase that --- "A composer of concert music." I know Matt through the Taxi boards, and he's VERY serious about what he does.

Notice I said Taxi is a good company and that I benefited quite a bit from them. But I've had run-ins with them about orchestral music. They'll run a listing for "classical" music when they really want "classical-SOUNDING," (i.e. cloned) classical music --- NOT serious classical music. There's a big difference there, and they don't seem to be aware of that.

Hope this clears that up ---

Ern :|: :samurai:

Ah, I didn't even notice your username... I'm "zircon" over on the Taxi boards. OK, my bad for not reading carefully :)


I am not sure what libraries you guys are reffering to when you say that 1000 ok tracks will make it. Music libraries have very stiff competition, and some excellent composers and usually the production is TOP notch, it has to be. Unless it is a new library or a low grade one looking to fill thier library with tracks, usually they will be picky about what they select, specially if there is money up front. the libraries that don't offer money up front probally will take more tracks from the start, but it doesnt' mean they won't be picky. You can't just come up with a hundred 30 second tracks and expect to get them placed and making money in the music production library world. Most of them require full length (at least 1:30-2:00) with broadcast edits and production that is record label par.

Library music is no cake walk, it takes top notch skill and prodution value. I have yet to use a library track that is not well produced or written.

True that it is no cakewalk, and not "easy" per se, but I have written a decent number of library tracks which earned me upfront cash. I've also done direct licensing stuff. I'm not exactly earning a comfortable middle class salary yet, but considering I don't have a lot of time to write music (I'm 19 & a full time student) it seems easy enough. At least, compared to finding scoring gigs that pay the same amount!