Wish I had a library like this... [Archive]

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tob

04-14-2002, 01:21 PM

Made a very short demo out of 3 snare hits and one bassdrum. Wish i had a library with this kind of samples. unfortunately i only these hits in one velocity layer.
http://www.geocities.com/tralltrallalall/tobsnare.mp3 (\"http://www.geocities.com/tralltrallalall/tobsnare.mp3\")

/Tobias

Thomas_J

04-14-2002, 01:29 PM

Wow that sounds incredible, Tobias! I want that as well! Can you do this with LOP?

Thomas

tob

04-14-2002, 01:48 PM

I made one more short demo. Remember, these are just 5 samples. No reverb added http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/wink.gif

tob

04-14-2002, 01:49 PM

and heres the link:
http://www.geocities.com/tralltrallalall/tobsnare2.mp3 (\"http://www.geocities.com/tralltrallalall/tobsnare2.mp3\")

tob

04-14-2002, 02:31 PM

and here even a working link for both clips.
http://www.audiohelp.nl/tobias/ (\"http://www.audiohelp.nl/tobias/\")

donnie

04-14-2002, 03:23 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Thomas_J:
Wow that sounds incredible, Tobias! I want that as well! Can you do this with LOP?

Thomas<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

yes...
http://www.dssoundware.com/sounds/BIGDRUMS.mp3 (\"http://www.dssoundware.com/sounds/BIGDRUMS.mp3\")

tob

04-14-2002, 03:36 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by donnie:
[B] yes...

Cant help it but it sound like loads of digital reverb to me.. where are those snares from?

donnie

04-14-2002, 03:43 PM

LOP....where are yours from?

donnie

04-14-2002, 04:51 PM

PS...how did you get that sampled roll to play in time? It\'s pulsed very heavily so it couldn\'t work in any other tempo than the one it\'s in. Are you sure it\'s not a phrase?

[This message has been edited by donnie (edited 04-14-2002).]

donnie

04-14-2002, 10:06 PM

Hey man where did you go?

tob

04-14-2002, 11:22 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by donnie:
[B]LOP....where are yours from?

I sampled 4 hits from a filmscore. They were separated in a cue so I felt i just had to do that..hehe. Im playing the roll and i guess that pulsating is because i just have those 4 snare to work with.

donnie

04-14-2002, 11:31 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by tob:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by donnie:
[B]LOP....where are yours from?

I sampled 4 hits from a filmscore. They were separated in a cue so I felt i just had to do that..hehe. Im playing the roll and i guess that pulsating is because i just have those 4 snare to work with.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It\'s not just 4 hits...there is obviously two different \"roll\" samples being played. They alternate in the demo....1 then the other, two times.....where is the roll sample from?

tob

04-15-2002, 12:09 AM

No man, I promise you. Give me your mail adress and Ill send you the samples and the midifile. Unfortunately I mapped them to a Halion patch but if you got it installed you can get my tiny session http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

donnie

04-15-2002, 12:23 AM

cool....I\'ll be really interested to check it out! What did you use to trigger the sounds...a drum kat or something?

donnie@dssoundware.com

PS...I have Halion also

[This message has been edited by donnie (edited 04-15-2002).]

tob

04-15-2002, 01:03 AM

The files have been sent to you. I used my keyboard to play and when you look at the midi you will see its not that well played http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Plundrik

04-15-2002, 05:32 AM

Sounds nice, tobias. I don\'t know how you pulled that off with such a tiny set of samples. How\'bout sharing it? http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif hehe...
Plundrik@hotmail.com

tob

04-15-2002, 06:06 AM

Ill send it to you. Remember, these samples are from a filmscore so if you wanna stay legal dont use them.. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/wink.gif

A_Sapp

04-15-2002, 06:09 AM

haha, tell Thomas that. He likes to rip off .0000000003 seconds nuances from orchestral recordings. He uses them quite nicely.

tob

04-15-2002, 08:29 AM

For everyone whos interested all files are posted on: http://www.audiohelp.nl/tobias/ (\"http://www.audiohelp.nl/tobias/\")

Thanx Emano for letting me use your space!!

Duncan Brinsmead

04-15-2002, 02:05 PM

Hey... sounds like the drums in the 20th C Fox logo.

Duncan

KingIdiot

04-15-2002, 02:40 PM

ok

T0b mentioned this one a lil bit ago. So I took the challenge

I did a few different things to try and tweak to get this sound.

I\'ve come to the conclusion that the impulses I have aren\'t all that great , so someone needs to go out an make some better ones http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

anyhow the link it
www.musicyouneed.com/perc (\"http://www.musicyouneed.com/perc\")

All are LOP in some form, and impulses are from Acoustic Mirror

snarebass = LOP ensemble snares and Bass drums no tweaking

fx = EQ-impulse-EQ

fx2 = EQ-Limiting-Impulse-EQ-limit-tape saturations (I hate this one, dunno what I was thinking)

fx3 = same as 2 but with diffferent EQ and a different impulse

Snarehitstest is a different story. than the others

Its made with four hits from the Black Beauty snare in LOP. Each hit was individually, Eqd, Pitch shifted/harmonized, impulsed, EQd again, pitch shifted/harmonized again, light reverb, and limited with the same settings.

Then mapped to fit T0b\'s MIDI file.

I used T0B\'s bassdrum in this last one as well.

I might have recieved better results starting with a different snare. Its definitely the impulse thats the problem in all of this IMO. They are \"hollow\" sounding and not warm enough.

I ahve some other ideas, but not enough time to get into them yet.

------------------
Really...I am an Idiot

tob

04-15-2002, 02:48 PM

This is getting fun http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif would be interesting to hear \"far mics\" only from LOP. They might sound exactly like what we want!! Donnie, what do you think?

PatS

04-15-2002, 04:05 PM

The King has entered the building. Welcome back, Ashif.

Pat

composer22

04-15-2002, 04:26 PM

About time King! Welcome back!

KingIdiot

04-16-2002, 12:04 AM

hmmm...

what no one have any comments on the sounds?

I personally think the snarehitstest is a fantastic leap in the right direction. And is one that blows my mind considering it started with a sample of a SINGLE snare drum. Not to mention its not one of the \"beefiest\" sounding snares in the bunch. Its my favorite cuz it has power, but the bottom isn\'t as thick as others in the LOP library.

I just want to thank tob for this little \"test\" shows you how far you can really get these samples to go.

------------------
Really...I am an Idiot

tob

04-16-2002, 02:18 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by donnie:
Hey man where did you go?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Where did YOU go? Did you listen to those sanples? Im curious about what you think and if you have any plans of making \"big hall\" versions of your existing librarys or develop a new percussion library with a more traditional big filmscore sound?

/Tobias

donnie

04-16-2002, 04:50 PM

Tobias,

LOP was recorded in a hall. The beauty of the samples is that they are spacious (ie. not close mic\'d) and they also let you apply your own reverb to them to make them bigger as King did above.

Donnie

tob

04-17-2002, 12:36 AM

Seems like i have to record my own percussion library or wait for Maartens \"True Strike\" lIBRARY http://www.maartenspruijt.com/truestrike (\"http://www.maartenspruijt.com/truestrike\") if i want more of the natural hall. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

donnie

04-17-2002, 01:44 AM

yeah nice plug BUT....LOP was recorded in a symphony hall.....did you read that??? how much more \"real\" can you get???

tob

04-17-2002, 02:16 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by donnie:
yeah nice plug BUT....LOP was recorded in a symphony hall.....did you read that??? how much more \"real\" can you get???

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, i red that and what ive heard from the LOP demo the sound quality seems to be 100% professionel. Theres no doubt about the \"realness\" in your samples, i just prefer more of the natural reverb and longer reverb tails. Probably you made some research of what people want before you started to record so i guess it matches peoples requests. I heard what King did and it sounds good but not perfect and not natural. Thats why i prefer real hall reverb and alot of it. Those snares samples I sampled from the Volcano score sounds exactly like what i want. Too bad it was just a few hits.. and too bad i dont have the rights to use them http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/wink.gif. All this is just my personal opinions and thoughts. And again, its nothing wrong with your samples its just a matter of taste.

/Tobias

Maarten Spruijt

04-17-2002, 03:39 AM

It\'s not about the type of hall here, but the amount of hall recorded in the samples.

LOP has in my opinion a great general ambience and breathing in its samples, but the idea for my samples is to go a little further. Some more distance even. And ofcourse experiment with that a little.

tob

04-17-2002, 04:56 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Maarten Spruijt:
It\'s not about the type of hall here, but the amount of hall recorded in the samples.

LOP has in my opinion a great general ambience and breathing in its samples, but the idea for my samples is to go a little further. Some more distance even. And ofcourse experiment with that a little.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yiiihaaa, thats the spirit!!! http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/grin.gif

Joris de Man

04-17-2002, 05:26 AM

Hey all,

I think the samples you did sound great, Tob, but I also think you\'re making a mistake.
You\'re asking for samples that sound like ones in a fully post processed, mixed and mastered soundtrack; but you want them to sound like that straight out of the box.
In my experience, it doesn\'t work that way.
I like the fact that with LOP, the samples contain enough room information to give them distance, but they\'re not too far away to lose focus and become cluttered in a mix. If I want more verb, I\'ll add it. (Let\'s not get into the close versus far thing; I think it is agreed on this forum that samples with a healthy dose of room/far micing are more useful than close mic\'ed ones).
A lot can be done with good mixing, careful eq\'ing and good reverb.
I don\'t know who mixed volcano, but I\'m sure his abillity and experience added a lot to the final sound.
For example, I\'m pretty sure I\'ve never heard those kind of snaresounds on a Wagner or Holst recording, since in classical recordings the orchestra is recorded \'as is\'.
With filmscoring however, there\'s a whole post process behind of adding sounds, making a mix and mastering it; producing it as it where.
It\'s a major difference. It\'s a difference people like Zimmer, Goldenthal and Elfman understand pretty well http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Cheerio,

Joe

tob

04-17-2002, 06:38 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Joris de Man:
Hey all,

I think the samples you did sound great, Tob, but I also think you\'re making a mistake.
You\'re asking for samples that sound like ones in a fully post processed, mixed and mastered soundtrack; but you want them to sound like that straight out of the box.
In my experience, it doesn\'t work that way.
I like the fact that with LOP, the samples contain enough room information to give them distance, but they\'re not too far away to lose focus and become cluttered in a mix. If I want more verb, I\'ll add it. (Let\'s not get into the close versus far thing; I think it is agreed on this forum that samples with a healthy dose of room/far micing are more useful than close mic\'ed ones).
A lot can be done with good mixing, careful eq\'ing and good reverb.
I don\'t know who mixed volcano, but I\'m sure his abillity and experience added a lot to the final sound.
For example, I\'m pretty sure I\'ve never heard those kind of snaresounds on a Wagner or Holst recording, since in classical recordings the orchestra is recorded \'as is\'.
With filmscoring however, there\'s a whole post process behind of adding sounds, making a mix and mastering it; producing it as it where.
It\'s a major difference. It\'s a difference people like Zimmer, Goldenthal and Elfman understand pretty well http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Cheerio,

Joe<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

As i said, its a matter of taste. For symphonic music i like when the percussion is a bit unfocused. I like it when i almost can see the percussionist in the rear of the hall. I dont wanna get a feeling of having a percussion player in front of the violins. Exactly the same thing with brass samples, I like it when they sound more distant than the strings. And in my opinion that distance is impossible to fake with any reverb. I get your point when you say \"healthy dose of room/far micing are more useful than close mic\'ed ones\" but when you want to fake a big hollywood score it would be alot easier with percussion sampled with only far mics, alot distance and perhaps some processing. Right now theres no percussion library like that availible. Im listening to the LOP demo again and i must say it doesnt sound big to me. I compared it to \"Double platinum drums - Disc two (Room Ambience)\" which is a pop/rock library and honestly, DPD had at least the same amount of room as LOP.

I really have to record some snares here so i can proove im right, hehe..

/Tobias

Rach3

04-17-2002, 07:53 AM

I don\'t see why orch perc samples cannot be processed. Many dance drum/perc samples are heavily processed and are meant to be used out of the box. I see nobody complaining that they are not \"raw\" enough.

I think if a processed orch perc sample can make a midi mockup sound real and nice, why not give it a try? Developers have been developing raw/dry orch samples for years, and, to be honest, they are not very much helping the users to create the ultimate virtual orchestra. I\'ve heard many good midi orch pieces, but usually once I heard the percussion part (esp snares), the whole thing becomes so fake. So if a sample CD contains perc samples that resemble those heard in film scores (no matter how they\'ve been processed) I\'ll definitely buy it without any hesitation.

donnie

04-17-2002, 12:01 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Rach3:
I don\'t see why orch perc samples cannot be processed. Many dance drum/perc samples are heavily processed and are meant to be used out of the box. I see nobody complaining that they are not \"raw\" enough.

I think if a processed orch perc sample can make a midi mockup sound real and nice, why not give it a try? Developers have been developing raw/dry orch samples for years, and, to be honest, they are not very much helping the users to create the ultimate virtual orchestra. I\'ve heard many good midi orch pieces, but usually once I heard the percussion part (esp snares), the whole thing becomes so fake. So if a sample CD contains perc samples that resemble those heard in film scores (no matter how they\'ve been processed) I\'ll definitely buy it without any hesitation.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The percussion that usually sounds bad and unrealistic? What have you been using?

check this out....
http://artists.mp3s.com/artist_song/2247/2247101.html (\"http://artists.mp3s.com/artist_song/2247/2247101.html\")

IMHO, LOP is without a doubt the most realistic sounding sample library.

donnie

04-17-2002, 12:08 PM

tob

04-17-2002, 02:07 PM

Wow!! \"In the Darkest Temple\" was impressive! but i must say you look a bit young... anyway, if youre next phase will be big bombastic hollywood percussion Ill be the first to order it http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/wink.gif

/Tobias

Rach3

04-17-2002, 09:55 PM

Donnie,

I do think that your perc samples are realistic enough. There\'s no doubt about it. What I want to say is that traditional orch samples developers\' frame of mind needs to be modified a bit. We all know that raw samples give users maximum flexibility. I totally agree with that. However, as I said, it\'s the trend of sampling orch stuff that needs to be altered to satisfy users\' needs. People are very happy to buy stuffs like BT because they can use the samples and loops straight out of the box to enhance their dance tracks. Those who do film scores and the like will definitely want to be able to do the same thing - get samples that can enhance their film tracks. We all know that film scores usually sound different than classical recordings, that\'s why I think sample CDs with typical Hollywood sounds are neccessary. I hope I\'ve clearly conveyed my opinion.

donnie

04-17-2002, 11:58 PM

Here\'s my stance on this issue.

Once you buy the samples you can do with me whatever you like! http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

The were recorded and progammed in a way to give you the most instruments imaginable, with the most versitility. For example, on just about every instrument the mod wheel contols the amount of release (or percieved room) on the sample. So if you want a super dry snare you push the modwheel to the top and you have it. If you want just a touch of room then you push the mod wheel down just a bit. It\'s just like dialing in a reverb preset....pretty cool actually.

Anyway, LOP, UOP, Ultimate Timpani, and Ultimate Marimba and Vibes, gives any user no matter how big or small the access to hundreds of thousands of dollars of perc. equipment with every articulation imaginable with each instrument.

When we release the drum set, World Percussion, and percussion FX we will have completed our \"percussive\" goals and will be ready to tackle the next phase.

Donnie