GRANDIOSO is available

[Michiel Post]

Hi,
The library PMI GRANDIOSO Steinway D is ready. We just returned from the Musikmesse in Frankfurt where we presented our new library both at our own booth and at the TASCAM stand. We had a lot of interest from both customers and press/companies. There will be reviews in the next few months in several keyboard magazines around Europe. We also presented the prototype of our digital piano, called Post Piano, which was very successful. We\'re now talking with several companies about future steps.
The library is available in our on-line store at www.postmusicalinstruments.com (\"http://www.postmusicalinstruments.com\") (sorry for the long URL) and will be distributed worldwide by TASCAM (to dealers in the US and on their own website). I don\'t know when the cd\'s will arrive in the US but you\'ll see them show up in TASCAM promotion soon. One of our first customers is Universal Studios in London and we have several endorsements coming in the next week.

If you want to listen to the demos your invited to listen to the MP3\'s on the website or send us an email and we\'ll send you the audio cd that we made for this purpose.

Have fun and make great music!

Michiel Post

Post Musical Instruments www.postmusicalinstruments.com (\"http://www.postmusicalinstruments.com\")
e-mail: mpost@xs4all.nl

[Bardstown Audio]

Hello Michiel,

Congratulations and Best Wishes!

Kip

[Munsie]

Uggh! Not much of a looker though is it?

This sounds interesting, I guess you could load any .gig file eh?

[Michiel Post]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Munsie:
Uggh! Not much of a looker though is it?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
No?
We\'re making an ultra-conservative classical grand piano-style version (black polished wood) specially for those who prefer oldfashion stuff in their homes. Can\'t show the picture yet, but it\'ll be there.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>
This sounds interesting, I guess you could load any .gig file eh?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
ANY!

[This message has been edited by Michiel Post (edited 03-20-2002).]

[Chadwick]

Michiel,

I think this is a sensible idea, as long as you make the interface as user friendly as possible.

There are a lot of \'mature age\' people who would like a better sounding electronic piano, but who are not at ease with computer technology.

My dad loves the sound of the pianos I have, but I could never trust him on a Wintel system - although I did come really close to setting him up with a Giga laptop connected to his Roland home keyboard http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

If you can make something which sounds like Giga, can be operated as easily as a Yamaha or Roland home keyboard, looks like a nice piece of furniture, and has a price in the ballpark of the competition, I think you have a product which will sell.

I\'m looking forward to a picture of the \'real\' prototype. I agree with Munsie, the 3d illustration looks kind of squat and chunky, but I\'m sure you\'ll make the real thing very elegant http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

It\'s a big project - Good luck!

[Jake Johnson]

The specs look great.

Will it have a CD-Rom drive for loading other samples? (No mention of one on the spec sheet.)

The next question is one I probably don\'t want to know the answer to: have you arrived at an approximate price?

[Jake Johnson]

When you mention the prototype for a digital piano, do you mean an actual physical keyboard? I hope so.

Many questions arise here:
Will this have an updatable ROM or the abiltiy to hold more samples (other Gigasamples, for example)?

How much RAM will this have?

Will it include a fast IDE hard drive for samples, or will everything be in ROM?

Does this mean Gigasampler will be in the ROM? With the editing abilities intact or done through connecting to a computer? More info, please.

[Michiel Post]

Hi Jake,

We\'re talking about a real instrument here. Visit this page: http://www.postmusicalinstruments.com/producthtml/postpiano.html (\"http://www.postmusicalinstruments.com/producthtml/postpiano.html\")

You can load your own sounds (giga and Akai, SF wav etc). And yes, there is a fast IDE drive for the samples.
Michiel

[Michiel Post]

We are very much aware that a musical instrument with a PC visible for the user may be difficult. Musicians don\'t like the idea that the PC might crash. Some musicians are afraid their audience might think the PC is playing and not the musician. Some musicians don\'t want to use any digital stuff at all. Some don\'t like the design of the cabinet.
Well it\'s hard to make everybody happy. We just designed this system to adress to composers and professional musicians who want the best piano sound (and other sounds) and who know a pain it can be to make your own system work. We\'re also targeting at studios and educational use. We had a lot of requests. Every component is selected with care to avoid weak links in the chain. When you compare the sound with standard Yamaha or Kawai digital grands there is simply no discussion: our piano sounds a lot better. The difference is huge. We had several potential buyers at the Messe that we\'re now talking to. Several companies want to help in marketing and distribution. We have a couple of well known artists (amongst them famous solo pianists) who consider endorsements, so things work out pretty well.
We don\'t have a US strategy that I can make public but we\'re working on it. All advise is welcome. The price in Europe (where we sell directly to customers is around $ 13.000). When we can produce larger quantities you\'ll see the price drop I expect. When we have to sell using dealers you\'ll see a higher price.

And yes the PC has all standard components including a CD-RW drive.
Michiel

[Duncan Brinsmead]

Have you tried putting the digital piano next to the original(or similar) and comparing? I don\'t mean for someone listening in the audience, but for the person playing. If you are primarily after a piano simulation, one could do clever things with the speaker setup. I suppose a holy grail might be to bring in a very skilled pianist blindfolded, sit them down at both keyboards and see what the subjective preference is. Any thoughts on how far away we are from such a Turing test?

Duncan

[Duncan Brinsmead]

Another thing I was wondering about. Sampling instruments like a Steinway may not bother the original instrument maker when the copy is distinctly inferior from the original. However if one can create an instrument that is the equal of a Steinway for concert performance by using a recorded copy then I would think they would be rather upset.. especially if this digital copy was much cheaper and competed with their sales. As I doubt Steinway has a patent on the waveform characteristics generated by their instruments is there any action they could take to protect themselves?

Duncan

[Michiel Post]

We had the Grandioso libary (in the POST PIANO) side by side with a Steinway C grand during a marketing interview in the city theatre hall in AMsterdam. Everybody was asking the same question: can the two sound alike? The answer is ..NO. The real thing has the real sound. The Sample sounds pretty amazing but is a recording of the real thing being played back over speakers.
THAT is the difference. When you record the real Steinway and compare that (eyes closed) side by side with the POST PIANo there is no difference! Actually, the samples are recorded and optimized, the recording of the real grand will be unprocessed. So the GRANDIOSO sounds better. We did that comparison also and people fell of their chairs.
I like the sound of the real Steinway D but I must say it\'s a pain in the neck to record it. A real Steinway has so many benefits over a sampled instrument. Not only the non-struck key resonances and so on, but the whole instrument (its smell, the grandeur, the wood and steel) and the price...are superior. That\'s why I sampled it.
Steinway has never showed any complaints about what we do. My stand was next to the Baldwin stand at Musikmesse and they came by and praised the Post Piano sound and then begged me to sample their Baldwin grand piano as soon as it arrives in the UK. They like the sound of their bass octaves better than the Steinway bass sound and they would love to have it sampled.
So far for copyright...

Michiel Post

[Duncan Brinsmead]

It\'s no surprise to hear it can sound as good or better when in a recording. I think that someday, however, we should be capable of duplicating the live sound. Lets say one recorded a piano in a dry setting using say.. ten mics positioned in a hemisphere about the instrument in an attempt to capture the propagating 3D wavefront, perhaps even putting some underneath the instrument.
On a stage one then could position 10 speakers pointing outward at the same positions as the mics and play the 10 channel recording. Perhaps this might sound more natural.

One has to ask.. with your reproduced stereo signal what is missing that was in the live instrument? Are there harmonic distortions or frequency biases added by the mics and speakers? Or is it the problem of stereo crosstalk (i.e. where sound from the left speaker reaches the right ear and visa-versa) cancelling out the spacial characteristics of the sound?

Something I found that made my home setup sound more natural was to add a small pair of computer speakers on top of the keyboard.. in addition to my Mackies. I route the dry sound to the computer speakers and the wet sound to the Mackies.

Duncan

[john g]

\"One has to ask.. with your reproduced stereo signal what is missing that was in the live instrument? Are there harmonic distortions or frequency biases added by the mics and speakers? Or is it the problem of stereo crosstalk (i.e. where sound from the left speaker reaches the right ear and visa-versa) cancelling out the spacial characteristics of the sound?\"

Well, not to dismiss the issue, I take Post\'s point--one that is too often overlooked: what is chiefly missing between a sample and a live piano is that the sample MUST be heard through speakers! That\'s a HUGE difference right there. Any piano THROUGH LOUDSPEAKERS cannot equal the real thing.

So what\'s the relevant comparison? The piano sample VS a live RECORDING of a piano, of course.

Can the best RECORDED live pianos be equall ed by any of the sampled pianos out there? I\'m not sure. I\'m waiting to hear reviews of Post\'s Grandioso. As I\'ve said already, his mp3\'s suggest (to my ears) that we may have the most accurate sampled piano on the market. But I would need the SAMPLE itself to verify that hypothesis for myself.

I\'m probably going to purchase the sample. Just not sure when.

John Grant
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/42/john_lewis_grant.html (\"http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/42/john_lewis_grant.html\")

------------------


[This message has been edited by john g (edited 03-21-2002).]

[Z6]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michiel Post:
My stand was next to the Baldwin stand at Musikmesse and they came by and praised the Post Piano sound and then begged me to sample their Baldwin grand piano as soon as it arrives in the UK. They like the sound of their bass octaves better than the Steinway bass sound and they would love to have it sampled.
So far for copyright...

Michiel Post<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I find this astonishing. Are piano makers really so out of touch with what\'s happening?

If they were so amazed, that suggests that the whole concept of high-quality sampled sounds (such as yours) is relativly new to them. That is not to denegrate your work in any way; the demos of your new grandioso sound quite marvelous.

Instrument makers apparently don\'t try to license the sounds that their instruments make, but it is the product of their physical instruments that people are really buying (you may have to \'house\' your new \'piano\' inside a piano-like casing to make it acceptable to the target market, but buyers don\'t usually opt for a Bosey over a Steinway because they prefer the physical design).

These guys should wise-up a little. Right now, they\'re tickled by the idea of sampling, but surely they have not considered the long-term implications of such.

I don\'t understand why they wouldn\'t just say \"Michiel, you have the Baldwin license.\" Then they could at least share in any gains.

So we have some sample developers actually forbidding certain individuals to profit in certain markets from their samples, while the other end of the scale sees the piano makers believing their market is impregnable and forever?

Couldn\'t the piano makers just as easily slap a license agreement onto every piano? If they don\'t get their acts together, they will end up ruly snookered.

It is only a matter of time before the sampled piano will become \'superior\' to the orginal (your post indicates that this has already happened in certain aspects).

Already, if I go to John Grant\'s page, I can\'t tell what\'s \'real\' and what\'s not (of course the music is real and John\'s renderings are superb).

Anyway, good luck with the piano - great idea. I wish you every success with it and the Grandioso.

[Jake Johnson]

It sounds like a wonderful keyboard. It seems a bit steep, though. Please understand that I deeply appreciate all efforts to create a keyboard with an excellent piano sound. On the other hand, $2000 can buy an excellent computer these days, and a weighted keyboard can be found for under $1000. The samples add some to the price, but under a $1000. Am I misreading?

[Michiel Post]

John,
A stereo recording (or 10 chanel multi chanel recording for what that\'s worth) played back over loudspeakers will never sound like the actual source sound. Like a picture (or 3D image of a real object) will never be the same as the real object. Until we overcome the major obstacles imposed by reality. Sound is a very subjective experience and it needs a space and the best instruments to be translated into our perception. When the listening experience of the Concertgebouw Orchestra playing in the Concertgebouw hall in Amsterdam is compared to the very best recording of the same orchestra in the very same hall and the same piece, you will never be fooled to believe you are in the Concertgebouw when listening to the recording. When you listen to a person talking to you in the room you percieve more than 3 dimensional information. You have audio clues about the location, the direction, the objects in the room and the reflections of movements of the speaker. All these clues get lost when recording takes place, even when 10 chanel multichanel recording is performed. You ears are far better instruments for audio perception than microphones! When we get better transducers than we have nowdays and loudspeakers get more dimensions upon playback we may see things change.
Off coarse there are A-to-B comparison tests with a real piano and a recorded piano playback that have fooled large amounts of people. Even 10 years ago I witnessed a scenario where CASIO rented the Concertgebouw and had a concet pianist play (behind a courtain) a grand and a CASIO. Guess what? Some 50% of the audience couldn\'t tell which was real and which was fake! That is no surprise for me. I studied psychology and I learned that perception is a very very complicated subject. None of the people in the CASIO test were really familiar with the actual sound of a Grand Piano to begin with, they were all electronic musical instrument dealers and distributors and press. In general they don\'t listen to a grand piano for more than 5 minutes in their whole life. And when they do, they listen to the musical performance more than to the sound specifics of the grand. So it really easy to fool these people as they don\'t know what the grand piano should sound like in the first place. Further CASIO instructed the player to play the grand piano un-natural soft and even. Then the CASIO was played with more volume (more volume always sounds \'better\') and with more dynamics. Another rule in testing is that there is a high chance that 50%/50% will occur in comparisons when ther subjects are not specific. This means that when the test was performed with concert pianists the result would have been dramaticly different.

Hi Jake
About the price of our instrument: we have selected the best of the best. The computer has a life long service contract (provided there is no pirated software on it\'s hard drives), is tuned for audio use and has superquiet fan, drives and power supply. It\'s well over $ 3.500. And you need that kind of PC to work with when playing in a professional environment. You overlook the speakers (digital bi-amplified 400 W systems with digital remote) (add another 3.000) and the furniture (hand made available in any colour), the software (you know the price of GST and sequencers) and the R&D costs. Shure, everyone can build a system that comes slightly in the direction of what we\'re selling. And shure everyone can sample a grand piano, but you actually have to pay to get the best of the best.

Z6. I don\'t believe BALDWIN is doing anything wrong. On the contrary. They sell good pianos and they sell a lot of them. They sell these instruments because there is an audience for it. People like the sound and the object; a real acoustic piano.
Baldwin looks as a sampled version of their instrument as a tribute to their sound. It is a bit funny that I -as a soundware developer- can watermark my Baldwin samples and thus protect them against copying. Baldwin on the other hand doesn\'t own the sound of the instrument, they own the rights over the fysical instrument but the sound is free. It\'s not protected. This may change in the far future but I don\'t see that happening in the next decade.
I disagree with you that the sampled piano will ever get better than the real one. No voice sample will ever get better than a real voice. The fact that a sample is a recording prevents this. Read the above. I do think that a sampled piano can offer many benefits to the musician that a real piano will never do. Look at sales of acoustic instruments versus digital instruments and you\'ll see a dramatic change that supports my point.
Regards,

Michiel Post


[This message has been edited by Michiel Post (edited 03-22-2002).]

[thesoundsmith]

Michiel,

[quote]
I disagree with you that the sampled piano will ever get better than the real one. No voice sample will ever get better than a real voice.
[\\quote]

I have a very nice 1978 Yamaha G3 6\' grand in my living room, which I bought for my project studio. Right now, in Monterey, I probably have the best live piano in a studio environment. It cost me $9000, and was well worth it.

Until Gigistudio.

The included GS piano sounds SO much better when recorded (and I\'m using a pair of Neumann KM184s into a Mackie d8b/HDR24/96, a VERY good sounding rig...) that almost ALL of my clients choose to play my Kurzweil 2500 keyboard and Giga. Only the older guys (who still believe digital recording is a new-fangled thing that won\'t last, and think the very best recordings were made in the 1940s) prefer the acoustic piano.

In live performance, nothing beats a quality grand. And if I had a real Steinway 9\' grand in a Concertgebouw-like room, with the high-end Schoeps mikes, maybe I would prefer the recorded sound also.

But even the default GS piano runs rings around my \'quite nice\' Yamaha, and the setup time is no more than the boot time for the computer!

I will undoubtedly never be a customer for your hardware piano. But I\'ll certainly pass the word along to my home-market clients that want a $45,000 instrument for under $15,000.

Congratulations on a brilliant idea. (And I hgappen to LIKE the look of the piano, except the legs seem clunky-chunky, kind of 50s-retro.!)

Dasher

[Duncan Brinsmead]

>When you listen to a person talking to you
>in the room you percieve more than 3
>dimensional information. You have audio >clues about the location, the direction, >the objects in the room and the >reflections of movements of the speaker. >All these clues get lost when recording >takes place, even when 10 chanel >multichanel recording is performed.

Yes, although creating an instrument that sounds like a piano, using speakers as drivers instead of strings/resonators, is a more limited form of sound reproduction. The full acoustical environment need not be reproduced as a normal piano does not come with a concert hall built in. Some modern digital pipe organs sound very convincing in a big church... I used to build real pipe organs, and my boss, who had a good ear, was fooled. I\'m curious how big speakers need to be to reproduce the power and bass of a full concert grand when put on a large stage. I would expect that the closer one is to the digital piano, the more the spacial aspects of the simulation become critical. This is perhaps where clever use of speakers would help. If the mics are, as you say, not as good as the ears are and we are thus missing something in the signal (other than spacial aspects of the sound ) then perhaps some subtle processing can help compensate, such as using an exciter(on my old Korg this made the piano sound significantly more live).

I\'m not sure of the effects on tonal quality, but there are also some programs to process the stereo files to try to reduce crosstalk by actively cancelling the signal going to the opposite ear. http://www.sciam.com/2002/0202issue/0202technicality.html (\"http://www.sciam.com/2002/0202issue/0202technicality.html\")

The neat thing is that this would not require any special hardware, only processing of the samples.

Duncan

[Michiel Post]

The whole idea is: don\'t compare our digital piano (or it\'s Grandioso samples) with an acoustic instrument but with the existing digital keyboards and you have a better perspective!

It is very interesting that most people here agree that for live performance nothing beats an acoustic grand. But the recorded sound of the grand is often inferior to a sampled equivalent. Nice.

[Hardy Heern]

I\'m sorry Michiel but I have to agree with the others regarding the styling. I\'ve got nothing against modern as long as it looks good! Your styling will only appeal to the post design taste school...sorry. I hope that you\'re not just \'taking the \'Post\'\' with April 1st being so close? or are you just (wisely) testing the market?

It\'s a pity as I just lerve your piano sound and also your composition abilities as per your Post Demo1 ....such a sensitve and beautiful little theme.

[Munsie]

\"where we sell directly to customers is around $13.000\"

$13000.00!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Found on Michael\'s web site:

\"THE SEARCH FOR PERFECT SOUND IS A TREASURE HUNT.\"

Okay, Im going out on a limb here. I\'m thinking this is a prank. A funny, clever....prank. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

I mean, look at the picture again, 4 white ugly legs, a lap top pc on top. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Then there\'s the issue of the keyboard controller, who\'s going to want to place this tank in their studio when they can just buy the sample library and use their own existing controller and pc setup?

I might be wrong, but it\'s getting very close to April Fools. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

[Jake Johnson]

Hm...I didn\'t see the laptop on top. I thought it was just a roughed out version of the keyboard. We\'ve been had.

It would be nice to have a keyboard that would load gigsamples, though. The problem right now is having to position the controller near a computer. Fine for someone with a real studio. Creates a crunch for me, since I use the computer for other things.

[Michiel Post]

Hi Guys,
We\'re not making an Aprils Fools prank here. The \"tank\" you\'re talking about is obviously not interesting for guys like you who visit this forum and have mastered the obstacle of getting a PC, masterkeyboard, loudspeakers, sequencer and GSt to work in a decent way. If you didn\'t master this task you wouldn\'t be visiting this forum.
We\'re targetting at people who fear the use of a PC and will never learn how to assemble such a set-up by themselves. The price reflects the work we put into this project and is comparable to a Yamaha system that sounds like a paper box (test their piano sound if you can stand a good joke) and doesn\'t have a decent sequencer.

About the design: the white legs are steel and can be replaced by \"Golden\" legs (actually copper). You may believe it or not but the design turned out very attractive for several European customers. They really like it. I guess there is some degree of topograpgical influence involved in the appreciation of the design. We\'re presenting a classical grand design shortly that will be just right for the US taste. Who knows. We\'re just trying out different things here.

By the way the laptop is not what it seems; it\'s actually just a LCD screen and a sperate keyboard that are located near each other. The processor is housed in a 19-inch industrial PC rack below the keyboard. We worked with a laptop but found it to be not stable and not fast enough for what we\'re doing. Therefor we had to use a desktop PC. I think in the future this may change as laptops are getting equally powerful as desktops.

To Hardy Heern: the Post Demo1 is a composition by Chris Nicolaides, who was beta
tester for the GRANDIOSO library. We\'re very happy with his contributions.
Michiel Post

[Techmusicom]

Since the begin of sampled Piano, the best i\'ve found is \"the Steinway B\" From Olivier
Truan (Eastwest)

I\'m disapointed by your MP3 demo.

1.5 Go of samples for a bad result.

This Piano sound like a expander.

Regards,

Olivier

[UKSimon]

I am the fortunate person in London to recieve Michiels new piano samples,(alluded to in his opening post)

I just thought I\'d share my initial findings.
After loading the various programmes, my first thought were one of mild surprise. This was due to the fact that I haven\'t heard any other sample library sound quite like this.

There are many different articulations so in fact it seems like you are getting more than one piano.

I know that everyone has a different view on what a piano should sound like and I\'m no different. I\'ve played many different types of pianos, from Steinway B\'s C\'s and D\'s through to the Bosies and Baldwins. Does this library sound exactly like a Steinway D?
If I were to put a real Steinway D next to these samples, I\'m sure I could tell the difference. BUT.. I really don\'t care whether they are the same or not. I just want a really nice piano to RECORD, that fits in with my style of playing and taste.

All of the programmes have a certain \'space\' around the sound. This is what surprised me, as nearly all the samples that I have heard before sound really close miked.

IMO, the 8 layer with sustain programme is the nearest thing I\'ve heard to be almost identical to a real recorded piano (recorded is the important word). I tried loads of the different programmes with various midi files performances from classical to jazz.

I think there is something for everyone in this library, and if Michiel can support it with even more articulations,(for the lazy/novice edit shy), then I think it\'s a winner.

I\'m sure some people will have a different opinion, but it works for me.

Thanks Michiel, and keep up the good work.

Simon

[Munsie]

Hello Michael,

Well, if I was wrong and it looks like I am wrong, let me bow out of this topic thread gracefully since I don\'t belong here, (My Yamaha S80 and Roland XV3080 do piano good enough for me..) and let me say I apologize if I offended you about the looks of your prototype hardware. No need to respond to my drivel, I will not lurk in this topic again. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

[Michiel Post]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Techmusicom:
Since the begin of sampled Piano, the best i\'ve found is \"the Steinway B\" From Olivier
Truan (Eastwest)
I\'m disapointed by your MP3 demo.
1.5 Go of samples for a bad result.
This Piano sound like a expander.
Regards,
Olivier<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dear Oliver, your negativism and faith to the True-One never ceases to amaze me!
We have an audio cd with recordings of the GRANDIOSO that sound better than MP3 quality. As pointed out before you can drop us an email and we’ll be happy to send it to you. Regards, Michiel Post

[Michiel Post]

Dear Simon,
Thanks for your kind words. We’re having the first update on the website already. It fixes loudness in the upper two octaves that for some people sounded too soft. I’m working on a second update that will include a very smooth articulation that has almost no noticable crossings from layer to layer. Keep in touch.
Michiel Post

[Michiel Post]

We just added another demo: A nice orchestral piece from Bruce Mitchell. http://www.postaudiomedia.com/demos/grandioso%20%20piano/Orchestral1.MP3 (\"http://www.postaudiomedia.com/demos/grandioso%20%20piano/Orchestral1.MP3\")
Michiel Post

[Lougheed]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>IMO, the 8 layer with sustain programme is the nearest thing I\'ve heard to be almost identical to a real recorded piano (recorded is the important word).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you refering to the one described as follows?

\"8 Layer with sustain PostPiano Steinway D Classic: This patch uses 8 velocity groups and has both sustain pedal up and pedal down samples. This patch lacks the release triggered samples to allow for realistic sustain pedal play.\"

Thanks,

Lawrence

[Techmusicom]

Ok Dear Michiel send me a E-MAIL :

FRAPPIER.olivier@wanadoo.fr

And i give you my adress in a private Mail.

I\'m a Piano lover. I will heard your CD.

And i give you my opinion in a private Mail.

::::::: http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif)))))))))))

Regards,

Olivier


you said \"Dear Oliver, your negativism and faith to the True-One never ceases to amaze me!
We have an audio cd with recordings of the GRANDIOSO that sound better than MP3 quality. As pointed out before you can drop us an email and we’ll be happy to send it to you. Regards, Michiel Post \"

[UKSimon]

Lougheed,

Yes that\'s the one.

I\'m not sure about the patches with the release samples, mayby I need to make them less obvious, as they add a presence, (can\'t think of the right word) in a similar vain to a harpsichord. I\'m not saying they sound like a harsichord, just that it\'s a sort of mechanical action sound heard as you release the key.

It\'s most probable that when I\'ve been playing the real pianos, these sort of go unnoticed. I suppose I\'m concentrating on the music rather than the mechanics of the piano.

Cheers

Simon

[Bardstown Audio]

Today I received Michiel\'s Grandioso Steinway Model D piano. I personally have played at least fifteen different Steinway Model D\'s over the last several years, and I can honestly say that Michiel has accurately captured the character of a Steinway Model D. Michiel\'s Grandioso Steinway is a warm sounding piano and would be a good addition to any serious piano musician\'s sampled piano library collection.

Kip
Bardstown Audio






[This message has been edited by Bardstown Audio (edited 03-27-2002).]

[ChrisAxia]

Hi UKSimon & others,

I\'ve found that for the really gentle, emotional playing, the 16 layer works far better. The 8 layer seems to be lacking the PPP layer. I spoke to Michiel a few days ago, and he said he would probably make an articulation file for an 8 layer version which includes the softest layer.

Both the demos I did for Michiel were done with the 16 layer, and in fact when I checked the Post website a few days ago, I think Michiel accidentally uploaded the piece using my midi file, but with the 8 layer piano instead of 16 and it doesn\'t have the right emotion anymore. Michiel will fix the demo very soon I hope!

If anyone wants me to mail them my original \'16 layer\' demo, please contact me at axiamusic@yahoo.com. As I\'ve mentioned before, I far prefer the sound of the mock-up of one of the cues from a forthcoming film I scored part of, to the real recording with a 9\' Fazioli! What\'s very interesting is that most people that have heard both believe the Grandioso version to be the real one!!

I do love this piano.

Chris

[Michiel Post]

Hi Chris,
I rendered your midi file again using the 16 layered patch right after we spoke. Can you check if it now has the right emotional feel you were missing? http://www.postmusicalinstruments.com/demo/Purgatorycreek%20test.MP3 (\"http://www.postmusicalinstruments.com/demo/Purgatorycreek%20test.MP3\")

Michiel Post

[Michiel Post]

Sorry, this is the one:
http://www.postaudiomedia.com/demos/grandioso%20%20piano/DEMO1%20dry%20AXIA.MP3 (\"http://www.postaudiomedia.com/demos/grandioso%20%20piano/DEMO1%20dry%20AXIA.MP3\")

[ChrisAxia]

Hi Michiel,

I just listened to the new upload and compared it to my original. Strangely, it still sounds like the overall velocity is too high, unless I\'m using a different 16 layer patch than you. I think maybe I used the \'16 velocity comp\' patch?

Anyway, it was very interesing to read that for you, Altiverb is better than the Sony 777! Wow, I\'ll have to start saving up for a G4!!

Talk soon,

Chris

[Michiel Post]

The new update is on-line at:
http://www.postaudiomedia.com/updates/update%203%20grandioso.exe (\"http://www.postaudiomedia.com/updates/update%203%20grandioso.exe\")