Garritan General Midi GEM

[brooster]

Is the Garritan GEM coming out soon? Any info, demos, etc on it?

[Henry Buck]

A while ago, Gary seemed to be debating whether to release GEM with Kontakt Player 2 or to hold off and port it to ARIA. At this point, I imagine it is being ported to ARIA.

[Michael_uk]

Is the Garritan GEM coming out soon? Any info, demos, etc on it?
Hello Brooster,

Henry is absolutely correct. In the Updates to the Updates section Gary explained that they decided to port to ARIA hence the delay.

I think there are a good few of us looking forward to this one.

[brooster]

I was wanting to use it in Band in a Box.
There hasn't been much happening in the General Midi soundset world.

Band in a Box has a new program called RealBand. It's been out less than a week. Very Interesting.

bruce

[Garritan]

Hello Brooster,

Henry is absolutely correct. In the Updates to the Updates section Gary explained that they decided to port to ARIA hence the delay.

Right, we are porting it to ARIA. But before then we will come out with a GM Refill for Reason (which is in beta).

If anyone has General MIDI files they would like rended in the new GM library, please let me know.

thanks

Gary

[tomotello]

Right, we are porting it to ARIA. But before then we will come out with a GM Refill for Reason (which is in beta).

If anyone has General MIDI files they would like rended in the new GM library, please let me know.

thanks

Gary

It's now 2 years later GM Refill is out, what's about the GM set for Aria Player? I simply would like to use Garritan/Aria as GM Player through VSTi or standalone to Loopback Midi from various Sequencer programs (mostly Cubase 5 for editing and Midi Maestro for Liver performance).
.. or is there a way to create my own GM set with Garritan/Aria?
Thanks, Thomas

[Scaramouche]

Please, excuse my ignorance but, what exactly is Garritan General Midi GEM?.

This thread is two years old and yet, tis the first i have come across this phrase.

Please, enlighten me.


Scar.

[rbowser-]

Last I heard, GEM was put so far away on the back-burner that it can't be seen anymore. It's not lined up for Aria testing yet - it could be a permanently shelved project as far as I know.

Scar - the concept of GEM was for it to be a Garritan produced library for General MIDI. You may know that GM has a strict specification, with each instrument being assigned a specific number. The concept is that MIDI files using the GM spec, and that's most of them, can be played on any GM synth and play the correct instruments. MIDI files are made universally compatible that way. It's a fine thing but of very limited use, and more for general public consumption than for musicians and composers.

Randy

[tomotello]

Last I heard, GEM was put so far away on the back-burner that it can't be seen anymore. It's not lined up for Aria testing yet - it could be a permanently shelved project as far as I know.

Scar - the concept of GEM was for it to be a Garritan produced library for General MIDI. You may know that GM has a strict specification, with each instrument being assigned a specific number. The concept is that MIDI files using the GM spec, and that's most of them, can be played on any GM synth and play the correct instruments. MIDI files are made universally compatible that way. It's a fine thing but of very limited use, and more for general public consumption than for musicians and composers.

Randy

Concerning "... General MIDI ... more for public consumption than for musicians and composers... " I'm aware this is a common mind set but from a commercial point of view it's completely not understandable that musicians and composers would not profit from GM compliance.
My vision was always to have a MIDI File which plays basically on a simple GM Player but has addtional controls which are not recognized from a Standard GM Player to drive different high quality articulations when directing the same MIDI file to my preferred Sampler which make then use of the additional controls. So there is much more reuse of the time consuming work to create good MIDI Music and therefore more returns specially for professionals.
However Sibelius, Finale Sony Avid Pro have done exactly this with their customized Garritan implementations. I'm just looking for the same without depending on another third party product, just as VSTi able to be integrated in any sequencer - in my case MIDI Maestro.
Regards, THomas

[rbowser-]

Hi, Thomas - Thanks for the post.

General MIDI can be of much use to musicians, pro and amateur alike. I meant to just be pointing out that the main use of GM is by consumers. Computers come with a set of GM sounds and that makes it convenient for the average person to hear various MIDI files they find online.

As musicians, we always enjoy having more sounds and instruments in our arsenal. So it's nice to have a set or two, or three of the GM instruments/sounds. The basic instruments of an orchestra are included, piano is in the #1 slot, and there are drum sets and things, along with a standardized set of sound effects (like a Gun shot--of all things!)--

But all of those instruments in a GM module are ones that most musicians are likely to have well covered already in their various instrument libraries. That's why I feel it was never a big, exciting prospect to have a Garritan GM library. It would be nice, but of more interest to the more casual musical hobbyist.

MIDI files themselves have to remain universal and generic in order for them to translate properly. Someone at the Sonar Forum was recently saying they wish audio tracks all set up for Sonar could be included in MIDI files - but that's exactly the sort of thing that isn't possible. As soon as proprietary elements like that are introduced, then the MIDI file has to become a program specific file type, like Sonar's .cwp files.

Randy B.

[susanmusic]

Hi, Thomas - Thanks for the post.

General MIDI can be of much use to musicians, pro and amateur alike. I meant to just be pointing out that the main use of GM is by consumers. Computers come with a set of GM sounds and that makes it convenient for the average person to hear various MIDI files they find online.
. . . . .

But all of those instruments in a GM module are ones that most musicians are likely to have well covered already in their various instrument libraries. That's why I feel it was never a big, exciting prospect to have a Garritan GM library. It would be nice, but of more interest to the more casual musical hobbyist.

. . . . .

Randy B.



Actually, there is a category of professionals who would be very interested in GEM - piano teachers. Educational piano publishers offer standard midi files as accompaniments for teaching pieces. Over the years, I've spent quite a bit on GM modules, hardware and software. I was really looking forward to GEM and I'm disappointed to that it's not even listed on the survey for future libraries. Since there is already a Reason Refill version, I had hoped that an ARIA version would follow. I'd buy Reason just to get GEM but I don't think it would really function as a GM player for quick and easy use during a piano lesson.

[rbowser-]

Hi, Susan - Thanks for your post. A good GM module does have so many uses. I hadn't thought of how useful they are for piano teachers, so thanks for pointing that out.

Over the years you've bought quite a few GM modules - Are none of them suiting your needs now?

I don't know what music software you use, a good guess would be a notation program?

But if you have a Sound Font player of some sort that works with your set-up, like SFZ from KVR Audio, here is The Best GM set of fonts I've ever heard. It's served me well. And just now I looked it up to see if it's still available - It is! The Download link is still active.

So if you have a Sound Font player and would like to try this out, I don't see how you could be disappointed. It's excellent:

UNISON (http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/programs/Unisonwin3/#software_description)


Randy B.

[susanmusic]

Hi, Susan - Thanks for your post. A good GM module does have so many uses. I hadn't thought of how useful they are for piano teachers, so thanks for pointing that out.

Over the years you've bought quite a few GM modules - Are none of them suiting your needs now?

I don't know what music software you use, a good guess would be a notation program?

But if you have a Sound Font player of some sort that works with your set-up, like SFZ from KVR Audio, here is The Best GM set of fonts I've ever heard. It's served me well. And just now I looked it up to see if it's still available - It is! The Download link is still active.

So if you have a Sound Font player and would like to try this out, I don't see how you could be disappointed. It's excellent:

UNISON (http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/programs/Unisonwin3/#software_description)


Randy B.

Thanks for the tip, Randy. Yes, I know how to use sequencer plus virtual cables plus ASIO4all plus VST Host plust Synthfont VST plus sound fonts. But think of the average piano teacher! As I understood it, GEM would have included a GM player and that's all a piano teacher would need.

Besides, where's the spirit of spending more money to help the music industry? Let's support Garritan by buying something.

Seriously, I bought some version of Sonar a few years ago just to get Garritan Pocket Orchestra. I love those sounds. I just know that GEM would sound wonderful. In the meantime, my Ketron SD2 module is great except for WAY too much vibrato in the clarinet and trumpet and a tuba that only plays staccato. Luckily, I can use that Sonar to edit the midi files with substitute sounds from the higher banks.

[rbowser-]

Hello again, Susan

I didn't intend Unison to be a solution for the average teacher, I meant that just as a tip for you, in case you were needing another GM module.

"...As I understood it, GEM would have included a GM player and that's all a piano teacher would need..."

My understanding was that GEM was intended as a GM Library for Aria. It would require at least some basic MIDI know-how to use it.

"...Besides, where's the spirit of spending more money to help the music industry? Let's support Garritan by buying something..."

That spirit is alive and well in this Garritan community, Susan. But we're talking about something that doesn't exist, and may not ever exist, so I wasn't taking business away by suggesting the free Sound Font set.

Since GEM, as I understand it, was intended as a General MIDI Library for Aria, I wasn't anticipating it being any easier for a user to figure out that the Garritan Libraries that do exist. GPO isn't any more difficult or easier than what GEM would have been.

I would suggest teachers use GPO, and in a multi-timbral way rather than through the stand-alone Aria player. A GM set of instruments is just a collection of all the standard instruments, piano, representatives of all the major orchestral instruments, plus things like guitars, drum sets etc. GPO has the orchestra covered better than any GM library could - I think you could encourage your teacher friends to use GPO. Well, I know that Garritan Libraries are used in educational settings quite a bit already.

Anyway - Maybe the company will surprise us and get the previously announced GEM up and running. It'd be great.

Randy B.

[susanmusic]

Hello again, Susan

I didn't intend Unison to be a solution for the average teacher, I meant that just as a tip for you, in case you were needing another GM module.

"...As I understood it, GEM would have included a GM player and that's all a piano teacher would need..."

My understanding was that GEM was intended as a GM Library for Aria. It would require at least some basic MIDI know-how to use it.

"...Besides, where's the spirit of spending more money to help the music industry? Let's support Garritan by buying something..."

That spirit is alive and well in this Garritan community, Susan. But we're talking about something that doesn't exist, and may not ever exist, so I wasn't taking business away by suggesting the free Sound Font set.

Since GEM, as I understand it, was intended as a General MIDI Library for Aria, I wasn't anticipating it being any easier for a user to figure out that the Garritan Libraries that do exist. GPO isn't any more difficult or easier than what GEM would have been.

I would suggest teachers use GPO, and in a multi-timbral way rather than through the stand-alone Aria player. A GM set of instruments is just a collection of all the standard instruments, piano, representatives of all the major orchestral instruments, plus things like guitars, drum sets etc. GPO has the orchestra covered better than any GM library could - I think you could encourage your teacher friends to use GPO. Well, I know that Garritan Libraries are used in educational settings quite a bit already.

Anyway - Maybe the company will surprise us and get the previously announced GEM up and running. It'd be great.

Randy B.

Randy, Do you remember the day, several years ago, when Gary sat by the phone to take calls from users. Well, I got through and took advantage of the opportunity to nag him about GEM. I'm pretty sure he said that GEM would include a GM player.

My thinking about this is that since GEM is already available as a Reason Refill it wouldn't be too much to hope for an Aria version. And is it possible that the Microsoft Songsmith sounds are also the GEM sounds?

Please tell me if there is something I am missing but I think that to use GPO in a piano lesson, I'd have to take the time to choose the sound for each track every time I wanted to play a midi file. I simply could not afford to take that time in the middle of someone's piano lesson. Remember, I don't want to render to audio or save in some Sonar format. I just want to play back SMF's and take advantage of my Roland Visual Music Tutor's features: display of the RH and LH notation, ability to change tempo, mute RH/LH/accompaniment, create practice loops, all with a click or two.

Anyway, I think there would be some market among piano teachers and a much larger market among Band in a Box users who are always asking about good GM softsynths. So I hope the PTB are listening.

[rbowser-]

Hello again, Susan

I completely agree that GEM would be a very good addition to the Garritan line of libraries. No argument. I just haven't heard anything recently about it being developed, and I remember a post some time ago when Gary said the project had an uncertain future. I know nothing more. As I said, maybe he'll surprise us with an update about it - he's certainly surprised us several times in the past!

I don't remember hearing about GEM having a different player than the other Garritan Libraries, but I've probably just forgotten. It's difficult to imagine that after all this time developing Aria, Gary would be developing yet another player, one that just works with GEM--. That doesn't sound very practical, or desirable. Garritan users would want GEM available in their Aria players alongside everything else.

Anyway, I've only been speculating. Maybe someone else has more information about Gem, but I've already related the few things I know.

Randy

[swinkler]

Here are a couple thoughts on the matter.

From a Garritan perspective, most of the GM soundset is made up of instruments that are already a part of Gary's product line. That is woodwinds, brass, strings and percussion which are a part of GPO, JABB and COMB. So in a way it makes sense that Garritan would not develop another GM soundset.

Likewise there are a number of "world" sounds that are part of the GM soundset some of which sound like they'll be included in the upcoming Garritan World product.

So what you're left with are the various lead, pad and sound effects.

One idea, although maybe not too practical, would be for someone to compile a soundset of these "missing" sounds that could be loaded in the Aria player just to keep everything in the same player. It could easily be a download for a minimal charge for registered Aria users regardless of the library they own. The complexity of the programming wouldn't have to be extensive at all; just consistent with the current Garritan products (CC1 for dynamics, etc.)

Just a thought.

Steve Winkler