First Impressions of VotA

[KingIdiot]

I like it.

Lots of natural sounding control, lots of tweaker things to do.

Consonants are a little wierd but I found a few things that work to help them other than jsut turning the volume down. It is difficult to build words with them. However I never thought that it would be possible to get \"up close and personal\" results that were believable withut putting htem in a mix with other instruments. However the amount of options might make it possible to layer a few REAL voices on top and get a VERY expressive, impressive, and HUGE choir sound.

Added EG Mod control to the attacks, and they sound great.

Kind of \"iffy\" on my opinion of the release triggers. I think they sound great, but without them I can actually mimic a \"closer\" sound. Which isn\'t to say the distant sound is bad, in fact its wonderful, I just like more options. So I may remove them for alternate instruments...also save me poly.

There are a couple of issues...but I dont think they make the library bad...ust certain character issues I have with certain notes. Mostly consonants. Many of them have \"ah\" sounds that dont mix well too loud with other vowels. Especially \"oh\" in Women\'s because it sounds so much like \"ah\" at higher dynamics. Careful shortening helps this, but its probbly my biggest frustration so far.

Anyhow its, much better than ECC in my opinion. Not as much variety as SoV, but still it seems to be a winner for me so far. Curious to see how Pure choir will be, but VotA is now my first choice for big choir sounds.

Big Thumbs up Nick!


------------------
Really...I am an Idiot

[jubal]

Very nice Nick.

Bottom Line: Worth the price, but not a replacement for SoV.

Since I own Symphony of Voices, I\'ll use it as a reference.

Word Building
-------------
Man this is sweet. As King mentioned, it is not easy to do...but the possibilities are endless if one is willing to spend the time. Some of the consonants do have trailing vowels that you\'ll want to cut/fade out depending on the vowel that follows. Nick, this is a great feature! I have some Hebrew phrases that I want to create, but the gutterals are going to be a challenge.

Non-Vibrato Men and Women
-------------------------
SoV\'s non-vibrato samples come out on top in my opinion. VotA\'s are good, but they lack the same presence. Some of this is probably the processing and cathedral\'s they were recorded in I imagine. A big plus, however, for VotA is that there is hardly any processing done on the samples which gives you a real bright sound by default. Also in the VotA library, in the higher pitched samples, more vibrato appears in the samples. This is probably natural for a singer, but the SoV library is pretty good at maintaining non-vibrato even in higher pitches.

Vibrato Men and Women
---------------------
Another very big plus in the VotA library. Sov doesn\'t have it (on purpose). I am working on an idependent horror/suspense film and these samples make me an extremely happy composer. I like the use of the modwheel in fading between the non-vibrato and vibrato samples.

Small Women Choir (Angels)
--------------------------
Very nice!! Again, SoV doesn\'t have anything like this. SoV does have a solo woman, but nothing like this. Very usable.

Misc
----
Also included is a staccato patch for the men and woman, shouts, and clusters. Not bad, but nothing close to the variety that SoV offers (swells, murmuring, wispering, etc.) Also SoV has Gregorian, Boys, Pop (Enyaish) and phrases. A plus for VotA is that it has a more complete vowel set than does SoV (e.g., the \'ih\' sound).

Well, that\'s just my opinion from about 30 minutes of playing around. For me it is a must buy, but so is SoV. Not everyone will want to spend that much on two libraries, so I would say you would want to base it on the application you are composing for.

I have been extremely pleased with passed Quantum Leap libraries (Brass,Guitar&Bass,Rare) and it seems I have purchased another winner. Thanks Nick.

[Francis Belardino]

\"Added EG Mod control to the attacks, and they sound great.\"

King,

Could you go into more detail about this?

EG MOD?

Thanks

------------------
Francis Belardino
fbelardino@audiovisionsonline.com (\"fbelardino@audiovisionsonline.com\")

Sound Designer
Audio Visions, LTD.
Wilmington, DE.

www.audiovisionsonline.com (\"http://www.audiovisionsonline.com\")

[Nick Phoenix]

Thanks for the reviews. King, maybe you could share some of your programming tweaks so I can include them on my upcoming web pages. I will be making articulation files for VotA available for download soon.
As far as the SoVoices comparison goes, I agree. But, when you start to put VotA into tracks, you will find that the mellower samples sound more like voices than SOVoices samples do. Thats because of a lack of autotuning. Anyway, SOVoices can be really useful for sparse mellow arrangements.
I might as well announce the upcoming release of Voices of the Apocalypse 2. It will be out in a few months (3-5). It will include boys choir and some other things that will blow minds. I kid you not! It is a complementary library. The 2 libraries will be a complete choir resource and then some.

[caveman]

Jubal

You had mentioned word building.

How is this possible? How do you build words wuth SOV?

Share some light please as its dark in here

Caveman

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jubal:
Very nice Nick.

Bottom Line: Worth the price, but not a replacement for SoV.

Since I own Symphony of Voices, I\'ll use it as a reference.

Word Building
-------------
Man this is sweet. As King mentioned, it is not easy to do...but the possibilities are endless if one is willing to spend the time. Some of the consonants do have trailing vowels that you\'ll want to cut/fade out depending on the vowel that follows. Nick, this is a great feature! I have some Hebrew phrases that I want to create, but the gutterals are going to be a challenge.

Non-Vibrato Men and Women<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[KingIdiot]

jubal,

Agree with everything you\'ve said about SoV compared to VotA. I\'d love a \"smaller and up closer\" sound of SoV with the depth of VotA\'s coexpression and consonant features. Mind you ..as an OPTION.. I love th \"huge\" sound that VotA has and of course thats what Nick was relly going for. Nick might be on the ball with smaller ones in VotA 2 tho http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/wink.gif

Francis,
EGMod is a tab in the GigaEditor that allows you to set the control of the attack to aGPC. I set it to GPC 2. On the Piano samples its set to the third \"notch\" and on the forte its set to the 4th. This way you get an \"automatic\" fade from piano to forte with the GPC pulled down (inverted mode), sounds great at about halfway. I also get to move attacks up in between phrases to get different attack variations. Also this sets up teh release triggers to ahve attack control as well. which is great if you want soft quick attacks...so the release triggers dont \"jump in\"

Anyhow, Nick\'s offering art files soon which might have these, if not I\'ll give them to him to put up. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif


Nick,

I just got this sucker today so I haven\'t been able to get the tweaks all perfect. Its mostly left overs tweaks I foudn that worked with other chor libraies and such. They are all working pretty good, but one or to notes here and there are out of whack. I also am considering going in and doign some sample editing. Stretching out the consonants for even more variety and other things. As for your update,...WHEEE!!!

------------------
Really...I am an Idiot

[This message has been edited by KingIdiot (edited 11-30-2001).]

[jubal]

Caveman,

Sorry if I gave the impression that you can build words with SoV, not possible. Although I am now experimenting with using some of VotA\'s consonants with SoV\'s vowels. This is fun!!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by caveman:
Jubal

You had mentioned word building.

How is this possible? How do you build words wuth SOV?

Share some light please as its dark in here

Caveman

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[Francis Belardino]

King,

Thanks for the tips. They would be useful with GOS as well.

\"Hands on\" attacks. Very cool!! I found slowing up attacks on VotA gives me a more mellow sound. I like that.

I believe GOS will have updates soon as well.

Hi Nick,

Any thought on price, just yet, for VotA 2?
Also, the smaller female section is working wonders for me. As you may remeber the sample I sent you... it\'s getting more and more real! http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

PS. King, if you get a second and you are on high speed... check out our completed website for the studio. I would love you feedback.

------------------
Francis Belardino
fbelardino@audiovisionsonline.com (\"fbelardino@audiovisionsonline.com\")

Sound Designer
Audio Visions, LTD.
Wilmington, DE.

www.audiovisionsonline.com (\"http://www.audiovisionsonline.com\")

[Nick Phoenix]

Voices of the Apocalypse 2 will be less of a bread and library. It will be more eclectic and probably 5 disks or so. I will be very thorough with the boys choir. Price depends on many things. I have no idea about the price.

[Francis Belardino]

Fair enough.

Best of luck.

[jubal]

One thing I forgot to mention, although it\'s been mentioned before. The dynamics in VotA are incredible. That is also another differnce between this library and SoV. Whereas SoV has silkier (mellow) sounding samples, VotA can sound mellow, but also rise over the top.

Nick, have you tried composing with both libraries. I am amazed they sound so well together. You\'re right, side by side I can hear the processing on SoV.

[Nick Phoenix]

Yes. I have been using SOV for years. After I finished it, I did a comparison and I was suprised how radically different VotA sounds.

[Francis Belardino]

So, would you say that SOV would be a great choice for a _ haunting undersocre_ effect?

I don\'t have SOV. I waited and waited to get it ($$$) and I was a bit worried about converting it too but, VotA came out and so... here I am.

I have ECC, and I never liked it. That is to say...It is not for me.

I guess the question now is. Should I grab SOV for contrast to VotA or wait for VotA 2?

Thanks Nick,

Once again you made my skull hurt http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

[Francis Belardino]

Sorry to flood http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Hey there, King!

Thanks for the EGMOD tip.

I set attack to full and increased release a touch.

Big difference. Now, the Angels oh/ah are very soft and pad like.

That\'s what I like http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Looking forward to the updates.

------------------
Francis Belardino
fbelardino@audiovisionsonline.com (\"fbelardino@audiovisionsonline.com\")

Sound Designer
Audio Visions, LTD.
Wilmington, DE.

www.audiovisionsonline.com (\"http://www.audiovisionsonline.com\")

[KingIdiot]

http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Last night I removed the release triggers on the angel oh/ahs and put an EG Mod control on the attack and release as well as bumped up the release a tad. Now I can play that edward scissor hands ooooooohhh...wooooohh...ooooooohh. and it sounds pretty golod. I\'m pretty sure if I throw in some glissandos it will sound great. Wish there were some \"eee\" sounds, would add for more realistic glissandos....maybe slight layering of the woman\'s choir might work...

dammit I\'m supposed to be doing other work and rearranging my studio!

------------------
Really...I am an Idiot

[SOD213]

I like it!

Now, who\'s going to write a program for easy word construction? I\'m looking for some heavy sounding semi-harsh choirs ala Duel Of The Fates. I hear it in this library, but it\'s gonna be work. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

Two weeks, and I\'m gonna order up GOS. Good work Nick!

[KingIdiot]

hehee
I was also fooing around with Duel of Fates. VotA DEFINITELY is the library of choice fo something like that.

I also stumbled on what must have been Nick\'s M*****F***** symphony joke with the consonants http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif I swear I am such a oron sometimes http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif My girlfriend just rolled her eyes at me as I chuckled and chuckled about it

------------------
Really...I am an Idiot

[Lance_M]

If you post any demos you\'ve made with it, I\'ll love you until the end of time. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/wink.gif

*saves up money for VotA*

[Nick Phoenix]

King,
What symphony joke?

[KingIdiot]

Nick If I remember correcrtly uou posted somethig about beig almost done with a \"M*****F*****\" symphony or something like that. I stumbled on playing consonants M,V,F,K in a row and creating an explicitive thta just made me chuckle....and chuckle..and chuckle..

I dont knwo which thread, but possibly one of the demo threads. cant remember.

by the way I\'m geting some good glissandos with some attack/release adjustments. I think I may be able to create some \"realistic\" cascading/moving. I still ahven\'t had the time to get into editing consonants. I find that throwing a lot of verb on the consonants, and placing the dry signal way back allows me to place the consonants louder in the mix. When you do boys choir or other voices with consonants, could you possibly sample long \"sustained\" consonants. like \"vvvvvv\" they dont even have to be long, just shorpt loops. They make better for building words IMO. Percussive attacks are great for some word, but not all. This is one of the reasons I\'m thinking of doig some edits to the consonants. In fact I\'m tempted to use Melodyne to try and stretch some of it out. Not to mention also record my own voice a few times over to create sonsonant \"sustains\" that I can mix in.

I still love the character of the samples. This library isn\'t GOS for choir, but its still pretty great. I think I only say that because I like \"power user\" tweaks (this library has some, but just touches on them), which is why I love GOS so much, and which is why I\'m curious about your next choir library. Especially since you say it will blow minds. I\'m fairly excited about it....oh yeah.....My checkbook would like to throw a few expliitives your way http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

------------------
Really...I am an Idiot

[This message has been edited by KingIdiot (edited 12-02-2001).]

[Lance_M]

On second thought, not necessary.

[This message has been edited by Lance_M (edited 12-03-2001).]