Multitrack editor?

[Jeff Hurchalla]

I\'m researching a new sample libary possibility, and one thing I may need is a multitrack sound editor for the samples. I\'d like to do multiple (probably 4) stereo microphone locations, and while it\'s easy for me to record 8 tracks in Cakewalk or something similar, I may need to make simultaneous edits to all 8 tracks when I\'m separating the individual samples. Soundforge was pretty good when I did some standard stereo sampling - using autoregion and some remove silence routines I was able to automate a lot (though not all) of the separation. So what I\'m looking for is something like a Soundforge multitracker. Maybe I\'ll be able to get the separation to work perfectly in Soundforge this time round, but if I\'m having to do manual edits after I apply whatever automatic separation I can in Soundforge, it\'ll save me an incredible amount of time to be able to apply those edits to all 8 tracks at the same time.

[This message has been edited by Jeff Hurchalla (edited 10-14-2001).]

[ursatz]

How about CoolEdit? It\'s got a batch processing feature. It\'s a little clunky to set up, but it works.

[KingIdiot]

It Really Depends on what you are doing. If the samples need to be in sync even when played back through the sampler ally our silence edits need to be in sync as well. If this is the case....
And idea would be, use Vegas and Sound Forge. Do your Auto regioning on one file out of the 8 tracks, Export *ALL* of the regions (including seperated silence regions), go to the explorer in Vegas, drag all the files/tracks into the main window onto seperate tracks expcept the \"regioned file\", select all the exported regions from the explorer at the same time, drg them to one track, they should all line up on one track and be in sync with the other tracks. Now you can double click on the regin that you want, and eport just that section in a mix of all tracks or just a few tracks.

NOW if you want to do more with this, you can select the silent extracted regions, holdshift, and select all the audio tracks and hit the Delete key, and you\'ll delete the same region silence on all the tracks.

you can also, (after deleting silent regions) select each good region in one track and set up \"gobbl\" regions in vegas, now you can export each track with region data that corresponds to one track, and export all regions to seperate files.

viola 8 seperate tracks files that will ahve the same \"number\" from region extracting and will still play in sync if all triggered seperately from a sampler (or four stereo)

Mind you this should work in theory I haven\'t tried anything so extravagant myself yet, but I\'m sure if this doesn\'t work somethig similar would work.

I haven\'t gotten dep into Wavelab\'s Montage editor so I\'m not sure if its a viable option...but I somehow think it would work the same, ... if not better since its integrate to an actual audio editor

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Really...I am an Idiot

[james vb]

Jeff,
I agree there is a need for such a tool. I have not yet found a tool that will do precision sample separation/extraction without damaging the delicate attack transients, or without causing jitter from one sample to the next.

For the interim, we have created an in-house tool which will do sample accurate, multichannel sample seperation on 16/24/32 bit mono/stereo files. It has different types of threshold settings to let you dial-in the amount of transient pre-attack, and apply the settings from a master mono or stereo channel to any number of slave channels for phase accurate seperation on all channels. It\'s an \'in-house\' Beta tool and it works well, but not currently planned to be productized for commercial release.

Meanwhile, if anyone knows of a commercial tool which will let you treat one channel as many, that we be nice to know about.

[Chadwick]

James,
When you say \'in house\' - in who\'s house?

oh yeah.. don\'t you mean \'treat many channels as one\'?

It\'d be a VERY cool piece of gear for sample library developers.

[Jim Van Buskirk]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Chadwick:
James,
>When you say \'in house\' - in who\'s house?

>oh yeah.. don\'t you mean \'treat many channels as one\'?

>It\'d be a VERY cool piece of gear for sample library developers.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hi Rick,
TASCAM R&D. It\'s just an internal tool right now. In addition to the above description, it can also optionally \'De-pop\' the attack and release and/or optionally add the unity note info for automatic chromatic keymapping. You\'re on the Beta, right? Do you want to try it?

HA! You got it, yea man! A little 2a.m.dyslexia, waiting for my batch job to finish...

Yea, I\'m never happy with just a single mic perspective - only works for one isolated case or two.


[This message has been edited by Jim Van Buskirk (edited 10-18-2001).]

[LHong]

Try the Awave-studio tool, in the audio-processing wizard feature. I\'m not sure that helps exactly what you try to do, but it can takes multiple hundred waveforms at one task.

[donnie]

Is anyone else confused?

Donnie

[This message has been edited by donnie (edited 10-18-2001).]

[KingIdiot]

Donnie,

Pretty sure tehy are the same guy. Could be a home omputer and a work computer. Also cookies that save the log on info so he doesn\'t ahve to remember passwords and stuff http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

About the tool...He did say its an \"in house *beta* tool\" s well he said not \"currently planed to be productized\" ...so with both of those statements I dont really find it confusing that its being offered to Jeff........tho....Maybe I AM confused...people always tell me I am.

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Really...I am an Idiot

[This message has been edited by KingIdiot (edited 10-18-2001).]

[Jim Van Buskirk]

KingIdiot,
if enough people find good use for this in Beta and it indeed fills a unique need for sample developers, then I can present a good case for giving it out. First we need to get a few Betas to acknowledge that, and so far only two developers are using it with no reports coming back just yet.

Is there a public tool that you are aware of, or is there a need to put this up? What do you think? It partially depends on how many folks are doing multichannel sampling with multiple mic placements. I have tried a number of commercial tools for precise sample extraction, but so far nothing gets it out cleanly or preserves the attack transient with any consistency.

[This message has been edited by Jim Van Buskirk (edited 10-21-2001).]

[KingIdiot]

I personally dont know of a tool taht will do multichnnel editing across multiple files and spit out the edited files as an end result....in an automated task.

I do believe developers of libraries could use this to a GRAT advantage. Huge libraries with different mic placements could be offered. Sepereately or as a package. Surround sound libraries can be offered. Multiple edits of a live performance for loop libraries with syncd edits/loop tempos.

It goes on and on.

I DO know it can be done if the developers does some sort of trickery like I stted above. I\'ve achieved good results with Wavelab\'s auto split. Doing the Vegas trick would be tedious but would work. And gives the end user the option of mixing into one track for a \"lite\" version of a patch....without the poly hogging http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

gonna do that myself with Dan Dean Brass soon http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif Ensembles eat up poly like crazy http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif..and then there is layering portamento ens patches or Staccatto...bah I\'m going MONO! http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif

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Really...I am an Idiot

[Jeff Hurchalla]

I just noticed my last post here never seems to have made it on - it could be I neglected submit ... Anyway, thanks very much to King and to Jim for the suggestions. And Jim thank you for the kind offer to allow me and others to try the wave splitting tool. I\'m definitely intrigued, and it sounds like a helpful tool. Could you send me an email to jeff @ marblesound.com? As to whether automating multiple track wavesplits will be feasible, I think both you(Jim) and KingIdiot have provided great suggestions.

Jeff