Need opinions on Dan Deans Solo Oboe

[Damon]

I\'m looking for a great solo oboe. Right now I\'ve got Miroslavs and AOs oboe sounds, and I\'m looking for a more expressive better oboe. Can anyone tell me what Dans oboe is like?
Thanks

[Thomas_J]

Although I haven\'t used the Dan Dean oboe, I\'m pretty sure it doesn\'t come close to the expressiveness in the miroslav samples due to the way they sampled it. It\'s basically non-vibrato and vibrato samples at different velocities. I think the miroslav solo oboe is quite nice, although I agree there is room for improvement. There really aren\'t any alternatives when it comes to oboes. It\'s either dan dean, miroslav or AO (the AO one is horrible IMO though) The prosonus oboe is useless.

Thomas

[Simon Ravn]

Bruce, can you please post a demo to convince us about this? I would love to hear the DD oboe and other instruments from DDWW, because frankly the demos that have been done, have only made me certain not to buy the library.

[Thomas_J]

I\'m glad you enlightened us on that Bruce! I hope you didn\'t take my post as negative criticism toward Dan Deans Oboe, because like I said I haven\'t tried it. I\'m still with Simon on this one though, is it possible to hear some decent demos that sounds convincing (All the Dan Dean libraries are severely lacking in the demos department, why can\'t we get a demo from each instrument? like with miroslav vitous?)

Thomas

[Damon]

Thanks for the reply Bruce http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/wink.gif. I would love to hear a little 20 second or so demo of the DD oboe as well. Could you put one up for us?

[mahlon]

I second that (or 4th or whatever). Bruce, if you did have time to put up a little snippet of the DD oboe, it would help. I have Vitous and AO, and like Damon, have wanted to add new woodwinds.


Thanks,
Mahlon

[jubal]

I also own the DD Solo Woodwinds and would agree with Bruce about the expressiveness of all of the instruments in that library. They are amazing.

That being said, in terms of solo oboe samples I think that XSample\'s oboe is in the same league as DD. It doesn\'t have as many dynamic layers, but I find that the samples have more \'personality\'. That is subjective, but I find that if the oboe needs to stand out I would use the XSample oboe first. Note however that the XSample is only has a vibrato sample.

[esperlad]

I also own the Dean Dean oboe, I it\'s the only one is use now. Of all the oboes out there, I like this one the best.
There is another oboe avalible from x-sample, which I have, but I almost never use that one either.
I have a demo with an oboe solo. Go to: http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/271/dh_rottering.html (\"http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/271/dh_rottering.html\")

[Bardstown Audio]

I just loaded up Dan Dean\'s oboe and it is absolutely perfect and right on!

I know very well from experience what an oboe sounds like. An old girl friend from several years ago is a symphony oboist. She plays a Loree oboe. I have heard plenty of oboist and oboe samples, and Dan Dean\'s oboe is the best by far. Many oboist and oboe samples have a \"ducky\" and \"nasal\" sound, which is not a pleasing sound at all.

Dan Dean\'s oboe has a very pure and \"open\" sound which is absolutely gorgeous. Dan\'s english horn has these same wonderful characteristics as well.

Kip
Bardstown Audio www.bardstownaudio.com (\"http://www.bardstownaudio.com\")

[KingIdiot]

It really depends on what you call \"expressive\"

The samples in DD are fairly static, but it has many dynamic layers.

Basically this is great if you have a piece that isn\'t \"sparse\" or doesn\'t have long sustaining notes.

Anyhow. I\'m working on some techniques/instrument editing to get around this, because basic expression control doesn\'t sound all that great to me.

I built a crossfading English horn out of DDSW samples that has some phasing problems but wth reverb doesn\'t sound TOOO bad. Still the character of the louder and higher notes isn\'t my favorite. In fact I\'m kind of disapointed with the higher notes.

I wish it came with Crecendo samples so I could atleast do crossfades with those.. O even better Calibrate my crossfading instrumetns to them

Dan, did you sample any?

Can anyone suggest some good music with long crecendos of the solo instruments that I might be able to calibrate the crossfading to?


EDIT- http://www.musicyouneed.com/yup/ddenghorntest.mp3 (\"http://www.musicyouneed.com/yup/ddenghorntest.mp3\")

this is a comparison of the \"new\" edit and the original DD eng horn. Both performances aren\'t perfect, but you can hear the basic differences. I also added some EG mod control.

i still have one more big trick up my sleeve on building another intrument. but Its going to take ALOT of time and patience and editing..all of which I\'m not sure I want to spend on these samples.....
since tere are so many and I\'m not sure it will be worth while...


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Really...I am an Idiot

[This message has been edited by KingIdiot (edited 09-04-2001).]

[PatS]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by KingIdiot:
Can anyone suggest some good music with long crecendos of the solo instruments that I might be able to calibrate the crossfading to?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The initial oboe line in the Adagio of Mozart\'s Serenade No. 10 in B-flat, KV361 (\"Gran Partita\") would be my first choice. Some of you may have heard the Adagio in the film \"Amadeus\" (Shaffer\'s Salieri comments: \"And then suddenly, high above it, sounded a single note of the oboe. It hung there unwavering - piercing me though - till breath could hold it no longer . . . .\" Actually, the tone wavers a bit and is absolutely gorgeous as a result.) If you don\'t have a recording of the music, you can listen to it at http://www.iclassics.com/iclassics/album.jsp?selectionId=2810 (\"http://www.iclassics.com/iclassics/album.jsp?selectionId=2810\"). Anyone up to sequencing the entire movement? That would be some demo!!!

Pat

[Haydn]

I find most of the Dan Dean Woodwinds are quite smooth in the vibrato samples from note to note making great legato passages. Just add your own expression. Some of the notes could use a little bit more vibrato in the lower velocities. Miroslav samples usually have more vibrato which makes them appear more expressive. Being an oboeist myself, I prefer samples with less vibrato.

[KingIdiot]

thanks Pat,

that would be some demo! http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/smile.gif


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Really...I am an Idiot

[Bruce A. Richardson]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mahlon:
I second that (or 4th or whatever). Bruce, if you did have time to put up a little snippet of the DD oboe, it would help. I have Vitous and AO, and like Damon, have wanted to add new woodwinds.
Thanks,
Mahlon<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, you can listen to either of the Holst demos to hear the NV Oboe in action. I think the brass version has the more transparent mix. Granted that\'s in an ensemble, but the oboe part is audible througout, and it\'s adding a lot of expression to the whole piece.

If someone will privately email me somewhere to post a little snippet, I\'ll put one up...but I can\'t spend a whole load of time doing it. I\'ll just play a phrase or two with the vibrato version and burn it to an MP3.

We\'re talking about a 600 mb oboe here. I could demo it for a week and not hit it all, you know? There\'s a lot there, it\'s chromatic, I\'d say there are roughly 15-20 different mappings using various controllers to achieve various means of expression. Some are filtered so you can brighten crescendos, etc. Some shorten attack times. It\'s a lot of material with a lot of ways to approach it.

I like a lot of what Miroslav\'s oboe does, so I really hate to get into comparisons about musicality. They\'re both musically played sample libraries. Dan\'s is easier to play from note to note \"at will,\" because it has a lot more samples, and you can use the higher velocity samples to propel you through shorter notes in lines. Because Miroslav\'s oboe contains fewer samples, it wants you to follow its expression (to avoid the familiar \"slurpy\" sound), but in many cases that\'s the perfect thing. You cannot force it to \"move\" as much from the keyboard, however. I would say that is the chief difference.

As far as the comparison to AO, that\'s another situation where you don\'t have the multiple samples on each note with which to propel lines forward through sheer force, so it too can get \"slurpy.\"

I guess it boils down to what you need or want. My main purpose in posting was just to correct the impression that this library wasn\'t musically recorded. On the contrary, it\'s easy to tell these are top notch players, and the expression is quite good. The notes always do \"something.\"

[killerbobjr]

I just posted a quick little example of Dan Dean\'s oboe at http://members.home.com/killerbobjr1 (\"http://members.home.com/killerbobjr1\") -- it uses the DD vibrato oboe and the Malmsjo piano.

[Bruce A. Richardson]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Thomas_J:
Although I haven\'t used the Dan Dean oboe, I\'m pretty sure it doesn\'t come close to the expressiveness in the miroslav samples due to the way they sampled it. It\'s basically non-vibrato and vibrato samples at different velocities

Thomas<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thomas and all,

Actually, the Dan Dean oboe is a great deal more expressive overall than the Miroslav oboe, because it has a far wider range of timbres and is able to more closely track musical intention from the keyboard. You dig in, it digs in. You relax, it relaxes.

While no sample is going to read your mind and be the perfect expression for every musical moment, I can say without reservation that the DDSW oboe is the currently most musical choice among the libraries named. I own and use every library being discussed here, and am definitely not just guessing.

I think it\'s very important to speak only about sample libraries one has actually used when it comes to giving this kind of advice. Just surmising something to be true doesn\'t make it true, and often can lead to wrong conclusions. In this case, it definitely did.

And there are FAR more articulations in this instrument than just Vibrato and Non-Vibrato. This is simply erroneous. There are portamentos, staccato, ensemble patches which combine differing velocities on the same sample, etc., all of which offer musical choice.

[Bruce A. Richardson]

Martin Schiff kindly offered web space to post a demo of this instrument. Thank you Martin. http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/grin.gif
http://www.cdsol.com/cdsol/downloads/dan%20dean%20vibrato%20oboe%20phrase.mp3 (\"http://www.cdsol.com/cdsol/downloads/dan%20dean%20vibrato%20oboe%20phrase.mp3\")

This is the slowest oboe line I could remember, for the torture test. I played it in direct to capture with an 88-key controller, loaded it in Vegas and softened a couple of releases and added two swells, added a tiny bit of Renaissance Reverb, and printed it to MP3.

HEY>>>>PHYSICAL MODELING FREAKS http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/shocked.gif

Check out the User Library at the NI site if you\'re a Reaktor 3.0 user. There\'s an ensemble file posted there called \"SteamPipe2D\" that has pipe, flute, guitar, string, and other modeled sounds. Move the Mod Wheel while playing to \"overblow\" the pipes, strings, etc.

Not perfect, but very fun and super expressive.

Can you tell I just discovered smilies? http://www.northernsounds.com/ubb/NonCGI/images/icons/tongue.gif