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Topic: Assigning MIDI channels

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  1. #1

    Assigning MIDI channels

    Is it possible to assign a midi channel from a second instance of the Aria player to a first instance? For example, can I get channel 2 of a second instance to play, say, channel 6 from the first instance?

    I see an explanation in the Aria GPO4 manual (page 43) on how to assign channels, but I see nothing on what I want to do.

    Thanks.
    Arthur J. Michaels
    https://www.facebook.com/composerarthurjmichaels

    Finale 2000 through Finales 25.4 (currently using Finale 25.4)
    Garritan COMB2, GPO4, GPO5, Audacity 2.1.3
    Core i7 860 @ 2.80 GHz, 8.0 GB RAM, Windows 10 Home Premium x64
    Dell 2408 WFP, 1920x1200
    M-Audio Delta Audiophile 2496
    M-Audio AV-40 monitors

  2. #2

    Re: Assigning MIDI channels

    I don't think you can do what you are asking ARIA to do. I am not really sure or understand why you would want to do that. Can you give an example of what you are intending or want to do?
    [Music is the Rhythm, Harmony and Breath of Life]
    "Music is music, and a note's a note" - Louis 'Satchmo' Armstrong

    Rich

  3. #3

    Re: Assigning MIDI channels

    Quote Originally Posted by gogreen1 View Post
    Is it possible to assign a midi channel from a second instance of the Aria player to a first instance? For example, can I get channel 2 of a second instance to play, say, channel 6 from the first instance?

    I see an explanation in the Aria GPO4 manual (page 43) on how to assign channels, but I see nothing on what I want to do.

    Thanks.
    Hi, Arthur - Now that's an interesting question.

    By default, each instance of any soft synth has its own unique system of 16 MIDI Channels, and never the twain shall meet. BUT I imagine there would be a way for two separate instances to respond to one MIDI track - Notice you don't really want to direct one MIDI channel from an ARIA instance to another one, since the Channel assignment is a passive thing - It's the data in tracks that make it all happen.

    Maybe things like MIDI Yoke, or the Plogue Bidule could set up what you're talking about, directing data in different ways than the default. But I've never looked into that.

    Once in awhile, I've had a situation where what you're asking for would be convenient, so I'm pretty sure I understand why you're asking. When I've possibly needed this, it's been when I was a bit sloppy and random with my instrument assignment. For instance, I'll have written a track for one instrument, and the ARIA instance that instrument is in has been filled up. Later in the project I'll realize that I want to beef up that single instrument with another one, like if I want two flute patches playing the same data instead of one. If I would have anticipated that need earlier in the project, I could have had those two instruments in one instance of ARIA, with both of them set to the same MIDI channel.

    That's the situation I can think of where this could be handy. I add another flute in another ARIA, wish it could respond to the same MIDI track. Of course it's simple to fix that situation - A second copy of the flute's MIDI track is needed, this time with that track pointing to the second instance of ARIA.

    So - to sum up - There probably is a way of directing a track to two instances of a synth, but it's really not a problem to simply make a second copy of a MIDI track.

    Randy

  4. #4

    Re: Assigning MIDI channels

    For instance, I'll have written a track for one instrument, and the ARIA instance that instrument is in has been filled up. Later in the project I'll realize that I want to beef up that single instrument with another one, like if I want two flute patches playing the same data instead of one. If I would have anticipated that need earlier in the project, I could have had those two instruments in one instance of ARIA, with both of them set to the same MIDI channel.
    Hi Rich and Randy. Thanks. That is exactly what I want to do--layer. In a first instance of Aria, I can easy enough assign a couple of different flutes, say, to channels 1, 2, and 3, and then assign channels 2 and 3 to play channel 1. This is basically how it's done in the Aria player, right? Just need to confirm this first for my naive skill set.

    But, as you suggest, the problem occurs when all 16 channels are filled and I want to layer something in a second Aria instance to a channel in the first instance.

    In Finale, I could copy the staff and assign any channel to it. But, boy, does that clutter up a score.
    Arthur J. Michaels
    https://www.facebook.com/composerarthurjmichaels

    Finale 2000 through Finales 25.4 (currently using Finale 25.4)
    Garritan COMB2, GPO4, GPO5, Audacity 2.1.3
    Core i7 860 @ 2.80 GHz, 8.0 GB RAM, Windows 10 Home Premium x64
    Dell 2408 WFP, 1920x1200
    M-Audio Delta Audiophile 2496
    M-Audio AV-40 monitors

  5. #5

    Re: Assigning MIDI channels

    Quote Originally Posted by gogreen1 View Post
    Hi Rich and Randy. Thanks. That is exactly what I want to do--layer. In a first instance of Aria, I can easy enough assign a couple of different flutes, say, to channels 1, 2, and 3, and then assign channels 2 and 3 to play channel 1. This is basically how it's done in the Aria player, right? Just need to confirm this first for my naive skill set.

    But, as you suggest, the problem occurs when all 16 channels are filled and I want to layer something in a second Aria instance to a channel in the first instance.

    In Finale, I could copy the staff and assign any channel to it. But, boy, does that clutter up a score.
    Hello again, Arthur

    It helps to keep terminology straight. There are 16 Slots in ARIA, that's what I like to call them, and those are the places where the instruments are loaded. But the 16 available MIDI Channels can be assigned to any of the slots. In Instant Orchestra, the way some of the big sounds are accomplished is that all 16 slots in ARIA have been assigned to one MIDI Channel.

    So in your first paragraph where you're talking about flutes, you're loading them into Slots 1-3, and then having them all tuned to MIDI Channel 1. What you've described is right, it's just confusing when the place holders for the instruments and their MIDI Channels are both called Channels, I'm sure you see what I mean.

    Finding out into a project that you want to layer instruments from a second instance of ARIA with instruments in the first instance is exactly what I was describing, and to describe my own experience with that, I think it's just bad planning. If you get a complete game plan going from the start, then all your flutes, for instance, would be in that first instance of ARIA from the beginning, and your layering would be easy to do.

    In Finale, needing to make a new staff line playing the same notes as in another one is of course directly analogous to inserting a new MIDI track in DAW software - But in notation programs you can hide anything you want. Why aren't you just hiding the extra lines that aren't actually part of the score?

    Randy

  6. #6

    Re: Assigning MIDI channels

    But in notation programs you can hide anything you want. Why aren't you just hiding the extra lines that aren't actually part of the score?
    I don't do this because I like to keep my scores lean.

    You're right, though--it's bad planning! I suppose it's easier just to swap ARIA slots and reorganize everything. Actually, what I was doing is creating a new concert band template in Finale so that I could avoid this problem. I filled one ARIA instance with all woodwinds, and I did another with brasses and percussion. That worked--two ARIA instances for everything. Then, while reviewing this work, I thought about placing all the "main" instruments in one instance and their layers in their own ARIA instance. I could then easily customize each main instrument's sound--thus, my original question.

    I requested this capability to MakeMusic as something to be added to the Aria player's MIDI channel dropdown menu. ARIA would detect other ARIA instances and in that menu offer the ability to interchange slot assignments.
    Arthur J. Michaels
    https://www.facebook.com/composerarthurjmichaels

    Finale 2000 through Finales 25.4 (currently using Finale 25.4)
    Garritan COMB2, GPO4, GPO5, Audacity 2.1.3
    Core i7 860 @ 2.80 GHz, 8.0 GB RAM, Windows 10 Home Premium x64
    Dell 2408 WFP, 1920x1200
    M-Audio Delta Audiophile 2496
    M-Audio AV-40 monitors

  7. #7

    Re: Assigning MIDI channels

    Quote Originally Posted by gogreen1 View Post
    I don't do this because I like to keep my scores lean.

    You're right, though--it's bad planning! I suppose it's easier just to swap ARIA slots and reorganize everything. Actually, what I was doing is creating a new concert band template in Finale so that I could avoid this problem. I filled one ARIA instance with all woodwinds, and I did another with brasses and percussion. That worked--two ARIA instances for everything. Then, while reviewing this work, I thought about placing all the "main" instruments in one instance and their layers in their own ARIA instance. I could then easily customize each main instrument's sound--thus, my original question.

    I requested this capability to MakeMusic as something to be added to the Aria player's MIDI channel dropdown menu. ARIA would detect other ARIA instances and in that menu offer the ability to interchange slot assignments.
    You're wanting your score lean in appearance, but fat in sound. I know that to get the most oomph out of their notation some power users add all sorts of dynamic detail and even full staves that are hidden, only being in the project file to make for a better recording. I don't see how doing that would make your score any less lean - it would still look as lean as you want--. ?

    But what you're talking about is a MIDI Patcher. I still have my old hardware patcher which was used to harness a group of synth modules together, sending signals out and changing their parameters any way I wanted. MIDI Yoke, MIDI Ox, some other freebies I took a glance at online just now do what you're talking about, but those are DAW software utilities - I'm pretty sure you couldn't tie them into Finale.

    Randy

  8. #8

    Re: Assigning MIDI channels

    Quote Originally Posted by rbowser- View Post
    You're wanting your score lean in appearance, but fat in sound. I know that to get the most oomph out of their notation some power users add all sorts of dynamic detail and even full staves that are hidden, only being in the project file to make for a better recording. I don't see how doing that would make your score any less lean - it would still look as lean as you want--. ?
    You're right. Thanks. I already do the dynamic detail with hidden articulations and expressions. I suppose I should get with the program and do as you suggest--I can hide anything I don't want, and all this started as a result of attempting to refine the sound in Finale/Aria.
    Arthur J. Michaels
    https://www.facebook.com/composerarthurjmichaels

    Finale 2000 through Finales 25.4 (currently using Finale 25.4)
    Garritan COMB2, GPO4, GPO5, Audacity 2.1.3
    Core i7 860 @ 2.80 GHz, 8.0 GB RAM, Windows 10 Home Premium x64
    Dell 2408 WFP, 1920x1200
    M-Audio Delta Audiophile 2496
    M-Audio AV-40 monitors

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