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Topic: I Am Disappointed...

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  1. #1

    I Am Disappointed...

    I did it... I signed up... I joined the make music Garritan forum. I wanted to give it a chance. By all means Garritan is very special to me. Instant Orchestra is still my favorite library that I own. I have spent lots and lots of money over this last year or so on libraries, but I still love my IO the most. It has everything I need for the type of music I make. So, I really wanted to give MM the benefit of the doubt. Originally, I didn't want to bother joining...

    So, anyways... I posted my first question, "Are we allowed to use other libraries alongside Garritan products in their listening room," on DEC 21 2013. It is now JAN 18 2014 and not one response from any representative who manages the forum or who can speak on behalf of MM. It was a simple question...

    I am not happy with that at all... When I post a question here it is usually answered in less than a day. I am left with sour feelings and thoughts... I really did want to begin sharing music there, but I would like to use a combination of libraries alongside Garritan. Other places such as Soundiron has been great. I posted a few pieces on their main website (with the instruments they sell) mixed with their products and others, and they were more than happy to allow it.

    All I wanted was just yes or no answer...

    Regards,

    Richard

  2. #2

    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    The moderator at that Forum, Fred Flowerday, doesn't visit this Forum, Richard, so he's not going to see your post. Since you want an answer to your question, which was a good one and deserves an answer, what you should do is send him a PM at that Forum. Just nicely point out that you posted the question, and that the answer is important so you'll know if it's OK or not to post your music which uses mixed Libraries.

    Randy

  3. #3

    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    Quote Originally Posted by sururick View Post
    I did it... I signed up... I joined the make music Garritan forum. I wanted to give it a chance. By all means Garritan is very special to me. Instant Orchestra is still my favorite library that I own. I have spent lots and lots of money over this last year or so on libraries, but I still love my IO the most. It has everything I need for the type of music I make. So, I really wanted to give MM the benefit of the doubt. Originally, I didn't want to bother joining...

    So, anyways... I posted my first question, "Are we allowed to use other libraries alongside Garritan products in their listening room," on DEC 21 2013. It is now JAN 18 2014 and not one response from any representative who manages the forum or who can speak on behalf of MM. It was a simple question...
    I understand your disappointment, but if you want to make sure that the forum is useful, you have to wait for the community to grow.
    Regarding your question: it is written in the Forum Policy there, that you can post it, if it's sole purpose is not to advertise or solicit outside products.

  4. #4

    Unhappy Re: I Am Disappointed...

    Frankly, so am I.

    Perhaps my expectations were too high.
    I had thought that we might have seen a little more interaction between Make Music and their customers.
    Maybe some 'announcements' to clarify the current state of ARIA releases and where to download updates from.

    Take a look at the stats in the 'member' pages.
    Randy's posted 215 and Michael 168 times (at the time of writing).
    They have both accumulated some well deserved 'reputation' points.
    However, Admin has posted zero times and earned three reputation points. Eh! How come?
    Fred (the moderator) is there with a grand total of 17 posts.

    One can perhaps understand their low attendance over here, but what's the point of starting a new forum that offers nothing that the current one doesn't already fulfil?

    I did expect a bit more given that it's their own forum.
    Surely they can be alerted about new posts, just like the forum members, and respond to questions in a timely fashion, even if it's a "I'll have to check that out" holding response? (and stop calling me Shirley!)

    Oh well! :-(

    Regards,
    John

    The above post hit the forum whilst I was writing mine.
    My response would be that if MM want to attract more forum members they need to put a little more effort into it.
    Otherwise most long term users with useful experience to contribute will remain here. (IMHO)
    Just my 2d.

    Come on MM, talk to us, just a little.
    Author of MIDI tutorials at http://midi-tutor.proboards.com/index.cgi

  5. #5

    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    Hi, Briff

    Quote Originally Posted by briff View Post
    ...Regarding your question: it is written in the Forum Policy there, that you can post it, if it's sole purpose is not to advertise or solicit outside products.
    There's an uncertainty about what that actually means. Some people have posted the concern that using non-Garritan sounds, which necessitates listing their names, could be interpreted as promoting/advertising those outside products. That's what Richard and some other folks have asked to have clarified. I also feel it's a grey area that conscientious people want more clearly spelled out.

    Meanwhile, there's been a post up there for some time now which is nothing but an ad for another company's piano, but it hasn't been taken down as it should be if the published policies were actually being enforced.

    Hi, John

    Quote Originally Posted by SysExJohn View Post
    ...what's the point of starting a new forum that offers nothing that the current one doesn't already fulfill?
    You're of course accurate that the new Forum isn't very active yet. Michael and I have worked it into our schedules to pop in there a few times a day because there have been quite a few posts from newbies who need help. Even though it's a fledgling Forum with a small membership and low activity, proportionally, there's already a MUCH higher rate of questions being posted there. That's why I've been trying to encourage peole here to start helping out the newbies over there.

    But the point of starting the MM Forum is that they want and need everything regarding Finale and Garritan to be an actual part of the company and under their control. They publicly stated that even though this NS Forum is continuing on, they don't support it, and there have actually been some notices here and there where they warn Garritan users that visiting here could be potentially dangerous because of the flood of attacks awhile back.

    I think their motivation for setting up a Garritan Forum at MM is understandable and even necessary - But the reality is that it will take a very long time for it to be an active bulletin board with a large membership.

    Quote Originally Posted by SysExJohn View Post
    ...My response would be that if MM want to attract more forum members they need to put a little more effort into it. Otherwise most long term users with useful experience to contribute will remain here...
    The point is well taken that it's too bad the moderator and administrators haven't been very involved, representing only a small percentage of the posts put up so far.

    But I feel there's a flaw in what you're saying there, John. That Forum, like this, is meant to be a place where Garritan users interact. It's a peer-to-peer gathering place first, and a promotional site for MM second.

    Back when Gary was still involved at this Forum, the vast majority of his posts were as a user of his own products, offering help and tips to people posting questions. He was interacting just like any other Garritan user, and it was great. And it also underscored the definition of what this Forum was - a place for users to discuss and help each other out.

    So the success of the new Forum rests primarily on Garritan users. We are the people who make it happen. And we can definitely see at this point that if we just sit and wait for MM staff to make the place more lively - that will never happen. There's apparently quite a severe limit to how much time they are willing or able to spend there.

    Before the MM Forum started, whenever the topic of a new Forum came up, the only thing I was worried about was that it would mean the end of this Forum. Several times, in various places, I posted that if having a new Forum at MM meant losing the many years of historical archives here - then I wasn't at all interested.

    But that's not what's happening - The two Forums are co-existing. The only legitimate reason someone has for not getting involved there is if they literally can't arrange their schedules to include some time for posting. To stubbornly stay involved only here out of loyalty, habit - whatever the justification, is illogical. The Garritan line of software instruments are handled by MM. These newbies I've mentioned in this post aren't finding This Forum when they search for answers, they're finding That Forum and posting their questions there. Michael and I are having a good time helping them out, putting Tutorials together, and helping that new Forum become the user-driven location it's meant to be.

    So. Hope to see more people there!

    Randy

  6. #6
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    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    I thought MM would be more involved also although on the SmartMusic forum, they rarely post answers.

    Bravo to Randy and Michael for answering the questions!

    I know that Fred is busy with getting prepared for NAMM so maybe after NAMM there will be more MM presence.

    Jim

  7. #7

    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    Richard and everyone - Fred Flowerday has answered the question about using non-Garritan instruments at the MM Forum, and he's also posted the guidelines in the Media Room there:

    Hey all-

    Profoundly sorry it took so long to answer the post!

    On balance, I do think it's OK to post a piece of music that involves other libraries as well as Garritan libraries. Of course we want to avoid the "vague viola in the background" syndrome and be as fair as possible to all involved. Here's a quick set of guidelines for posting material that mixes Garritan and non-Garritan libraries:

    1) Please use discretion when posting. We would like any piece to predominantly feature Garritan libraries.
    2) It's appropriate to inform in your post that other libraries were used to create the piece if you would like. However, libraries from competitive manufacturers should not be mentioned specifically by name or alluded to in the post.
    3) As a listener, if you would like to know more about non Garritan content in a piece, we just ask that you direct the question to the composer via private message.

    MakeMusic inc. reserves the editorial right to remove any posts we feel violate the above guidelines.

    I'll post these as a "sticky" subject at the Media Room also.

    Cheers

    Fred

  8. #8

    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    Wahooo!!! Thanks! I am no longer disappointed! Thanks for sharing this Randy. That is more then fair! So basically my understanding is that don't list the other products, and make sure the Garritan instruments are heard. Sounds pretty fair to me! I can start posting some new stuff there soon.

    Regards,

    Richard

  9. #9

    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    Quote Originally Posted by sururick View Post
    Wahooo!!! Thanks! I am no longer disappointed!...
    And I'M very happy on a different count - I got email notification about your reply! That's the first email I've had from here in many months. Great! Things are getting better all over.

    Randy

  10. #10

    Re: I Am Disappointed...

    Randy- I had no idea you were still suffering with no notifications.... For myself, it seems to have been fixed the last time PaPa C reset the whole works.

    Wonder if anyone else is still having issues?
    Cheers,

    Kevin F..

    KM Frye- (SOCAN)
    Music Director- Four Seasons Musical Theatre- 2016

    Bella Vista Studios
    Canada

    GPO4, JABB3, Garritan World Inst, REAPER, Roland VS2480 DAW

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