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Topic: Combining EWQL's release's and VSL's legato - a killer app?

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  1. #1

    Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    ...............

  2. #2

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    The first reason is practical: you\'d have to record the releases from EWQLSO to disk, because they\'re copy-protected - although I suppose you could mute EWQLSO except for its releases and then import VSL into Kontakt.

    But I also don\'t think it would have the effect you want. You hear recorded ambience while the instrument is sounding, not just when it releases, so it would probably sound weird to hear a dry VSL sample that suddenly jumps into a hall when the note ends. Plus it can sound wrong to hear reverb that\'s been excited by a differerent sound - although that\'s not always true with complicated sounds like an ensemble.

  3. #3

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    There are a few on this forum who do and they use it to grand effect. The problem is having the dinaro for it. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

    VSl performance tool is by far what the library has going for it.

  4. #4

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    I think there\'s a good chance people are using both libraries together, Lumpyhead - in fact I know one person who does that *really* well [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] - but layering or mix/matching are two very different things from discarding EWQLSO except for its ambience! Talk about throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

    Also, I wouldn\'t stop there when talking about VSL.

    [edit: I mean I know the person really well, not that he does it really well!]

  5. #5

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    If you ask VSL, they might answer that their Legato tool depends on having samples with very short reverb. Using EWQLSO as a model, I\'m not so sure that would be true - the reverb would ring from the first note, the transition sample, and the destination note - but that\'s been the conventional wisdom. And I don\'t think the Repetition tool would work, since it has to cut into the samples to break them up.

    They might also answer that they prefer the flexibility of letting you add your own ambience.

    But the real reason is that while other people will record orchestral libraries, nobody is ever going to do what VSL has done again. It\'s a huge project. And they\'re still recording samples, as far as I know.

  6. #6

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    It\'s an interesting question, eh Choco?

  7. #7

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    Good thing they weren\'t Mammetesque...

  8. #8

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    when I put my mind to it, I think the problem isnt note to note legato transitions being obscured by abmience tails, its note to note TO NOTE transitions that become problematic.

    a single note to note with sustain , would allow for ambience trails from the \"from note\" to play out.

    but if you play yet ANOTHER note before that trail develops, you cut it off. therefore losing the sense of \"space\".

    So for slower melodic lines, I think it\'d be possible to get legato transitions, but not for a more flexible (in performance) instrument.

    with regards to section instruments. It MAY be possible to fake the ambience trail with a release trigger tho. You\'ll get double ambience, but it might not be too noticable with larger sections. For solo, thats a different story


    About the repetition tool. I think this would be easier to sample with ambience. Using a release trigger to \"overlap\" ambience. Since its the same note it may not be too noticable... but then again it could be jsut that it will work better on sections and not solo instruments.


    thats my 10 cents on the suject.

  9. #9

    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    Originally posted by Nick Batzdorf:
    If you ask VSL, they might answer that their Legato tool depends on having samples with very short reverb. Using EWQLSO as a model, I\'m not so sure that would be true - the reverb would ring from the first note, the transition sample, and the destination note
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">NO!!! This isn\'t true, and everyone around here keeps on perpetuating this myth! Even Nick himself believed this at one time, saying true legato was not going to happen for EWQLSO because \"the tails are too hard to remove from the second note\". Argh!

    Look, EWQLSO legato will totally work.

    The legato instruments get built from two-note legato performances. The first note is chopped off (exactly like VSL). The second note contains the little transition, and the reverb tail from the first. This is how the instrument sounds naturally, and that tail is great. WE WANT THE TAIL. THE TAIL IS GOOD.

    The EWQLSO legato tool would tag together the legato notes with no release tails added, until the very last note. The middle notes already have their inherent tail, and the last gets a full tail.

    Sorry, not trying to be nasty or anything, it\'s just that this is a really harmful myth [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

    As Ashif says, when playing faster lines you might cut off the inherent tail a little soon, but the legato tool could be clever and fade in some extra tail for fast notes. It\'s not that difficult to implement, if NI do a little programming. King: I think it would even work for solo instruments.

    This would be an amazing feature.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Bruce A. Richardson's Avatar
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    Re: Combining EWQL\'s release\'s and VSL\'s legato - a killer app?

    Originally posted by Nick Batzdorf:
    Good thing they weren\'t Mammetesque...
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">Yep. I\'ve seen people get tossed for Stoppardesque.

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