• Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 10 of 10

Topic: A Second Choral Attempt

Share/Bookmark
  1. #1
    Senior Member Tom_Davis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Ellendale, ND
    Posts
    1,486

    A Second Choral Attempt

    This literally is an "out-of-the-box" attempt at vocalizations. The only major technical problem is that I have somehow inserted a preset - I have know idea what or where - that has negated all the tempo changes. The dynamics, however, seem to work. The project is done in Finale 2014 with the ARIA engine loaded with Garritan GPO and the Eastwest Symphonic Choirs with the PLAY engine. Yes, they work fine together in Finale.

    From the Missa Brevis in Eb, the 5th movement "Agnus Dei."

    Instead of using the traditional Latin:

    Agnus Dei qui tolis pecata mundi
    miserere nobis, dona nobis pacem
    Agnus Dei qui tolis pecata mundi
    miserere nobis, dona nobis pacem
    dona nobis pacem.

    I used the votex entry system:

    anus deii qii toliis PEiKata mundii
    miiSEirEirEi nobiiS, dona nobiiS Pac!em
    anus deii qii toliis PEiKata mundii
    miiSEirEirEi nobiiS, dona nobiiS Pac!em
    dona nobiis Pac!em

    https://app.box.com/s/z2xj8vtb89uc43k6ucoe

    Tom

  2. #2

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    This was a great second attempt, Tom! The choir is sounding more like a choir. I haven't tried using the choir builder in Finale 2012 in a while. It hasn't worked at all for me yet. I need to get back to it, but have too many other things to do before the end of October (including my piece for the Christmas CD) I am going to have to wait.

    Gary
    Serenity Musician Productions (Gary A.)

    Lenovo ThinksStation S30, Windows 10 Professional 64-bit, 20 gig ram, 2 terabyte hd., M-Audio Fast Track, Finale25, Sonar Professional

  3. #3
    Senior Member Silh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    355

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    Sounds like it's coming along nicely.

    I don't know about what may be causing your tempo issue... however one thing I did notice is that sending a tempo change midi event breaks PLAY/wordbuilder (hanging notes/syllables stop being produced, sometimes sending the proper reset CC's will fix it for when you restart the song, sometimes only restarting the entire program seemed to work). So, you may need to stick with a fixed tempo after all (well, there are somewhat kludgey ways around it, I guess)...
    -- Matt Wong

  4. #4
    Senior Member Tom_Davis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Ellendale, ND
    Posts
    1,486

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    Quote Originally Posted by serenitymusician View Post
    This was a great second attempt, Tom! The choir is sounding more like a choir. I haven't tried using the choir builder in Finale 2012 in a while. It hasn't worked at all for me yet. I need to get back to it, but have too many other things to do before the end of October (including my piece for the Christmas CD) I am going to have to wait.

    Gary
    Thank you, Gary. It is a laborious project, but each time a it gets a bit closer bit closer. I don't think it will ever get to the point of replacing a choir, (at least not without major software improvements) yet it does help clients understand where a project is going. Virtually all of my contracted music is prepared for live performance, so the virtual examples are literally samples.

    As you may recall I made a simple try a few weeks (months?) ago, but then I had a total computer crash and lost everything (not the completed music files, but the programs themselves) and had to start all over again.

    In that rebuild I found that I definitely prefer the "Dark Abby" setting in Symphonic Choirs and match it with the "Large Cathedral" effect in GPO. Of course that would not work with all types of music, but the combination seems to smooth out the choir.

    Anyway, when you do get some time I believe you will enjoy playing with the software. Every once in a wile it really surprises me.

    Tom

  5. #5
    Senior Member Tom_Davis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Ellendale, ND
    Posts
    1,486

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    Quote Originally Posted by Silh View Post
    Sounds like it's coming along nicely.

    I don't know about what may be causing your tempo issue... however one thing I did notice is that sending a tempo change midi event breaks PLAY/wordbuilder (hanging notes/syllables stop being produced, sometimes sending the proper reset CC's will fix it for when you restart the song, sometimes only restarting the entire program seemed to work). So, you may need to stick with a fixed tempo after all (well, there are somewhat kludgey ways around it, I guess)...
    You mentioned "sending the proper reset CCs will fix it when you restart the song." Ummm - how does one do that?

    Tom

  6. #6
    Senior Member Silh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    355

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    Sending a 127 for CC 20 is the message for wordbuilder to reset to the beginning of the text, so I stuck that at the beginning of every track.

    *flips through the wordbuilder manual* ... huh, I should take advantage of the different attacks they've recorded too...
    -- Matt Wong

  7. #7
    Senior Member tedvanya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Canada,winter Mexico
    Posts
    1,006

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    I am not as lucky as you guys to have EW choir, but enjoy anything choir.
    Your second attempt is great, it maybe my failing ears or my headphone, but to me it is amazingly close.
    I just got a piece of mine to be performed live in November, had to produce a score, and found that SonarX3 has a very poor printed score, so in desperation I downloaded Sibelius ( The conductor has Sibelius) free for 30 days, and had to learn the hard way to use it. It is amazing how much improvements were made in teen years,when I struggled for a while with Allegro, now I was able to use Sibelius after completing 3 suggested projects. I have even more admiration for you guys using scoring programs and then making it sound this well.
    Thanks Tom and keep working, but don't get too demanding on yourself, you are doing very well...

    Ted

  8. #8
    Senior Member Tom_Davis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Ellendale, ND
    Posts
    1,486

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    Quote Originally Posted by tedvanya View Post
    I am not as lucky as you guys to have EW choir, but enjoy anything choir.
    Your second attempt is great, it maybe my failing ears or my headphone, but to me it is amazingly close.
    I just got a piece of mine to be performed live in November, had to produce a score, and found that SonarX3 has a very poor printed score, so in desperation I downloaded Sibelius ( The conductor has Sibelius) free for 30 days, and had to learn the hard way to use it. It is amazing how much improvements were made in teen years,when I struggled for a while with Allegro, now I was able to use Sibelius after completing 3 suggested projects. I have even more admiration for you guys using scoring programs and then making it sound this well.
    Thanks Tom and keep working, but don't get too demanding on yourself, you are doing very well...

    Ted
    Thank you for the kind words. If I didn't enjoy it I wouldn't do it. And as long as I keep selling a piece (from time to time) I'll always enjoy it. Of course my favorite pieces will never sell because - well, because they are different.

    I tried Sibelius for a while, but found it unfriendly - at least to me. Now I use Finale and am having much better luck with it.

    Now off I go to find out how the heck to send CCs.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Silh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    355

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    Well, I don't have Finale, but did find this with some googling:

    http://www.finalemusic.com/usermanua...e/MTSENDLG.htm

    Looks like you can select Controller, just put 20 in the first box, 127 in the second, and that should do the trick.

    Not sure where in Finale you would access this though!
    -- Matt Wong

  10. #10
    Senior Member Tom_Davis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Ellendale, ND
    Posts
    1,486

    Re: A Second Choral Attempt

    Quote Originally Posted by Silh View Post
    Well, I don't have Finale, but did find this with some googling:

    http://www.finalemusic.com/usermanua...e/MTSENDLG.htm

    Looks like you can select Controller, just put 20 in the first box, 127 in the second, and that should do the trick.

    Not sure where in Finale you would access this though!

    Thank you for that approach. There is yet another way which establishes the original parameters:

    1. Choose the Expression Tool
    2. Go to the rit. expression, right-click on the marking's handle, and then choose Edit Text Expression Definition.
    3. Click the Playback tab
    4. Uncheck the "Match playback to metronome marking text".
    5. After that, change the Type drop-down to "None". Click Ok to apply the changes.

    The playback definition will no longer be as a tempo mark and Human Playback will be free to control the tempo. Test the playback and the tempo should slow down as expected. Please feel free to respond to this case if you have any further questions about this issue.

Go Back to forum

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •