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Topic: GPO strings

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  1. #1

    GPO strings

    Hi guys, How do the strings for GPO compare with some of the bigger library\'s. I ve been so impressed with some of the demo\'s on here. But is it possible to get realistic string arrangements that stand out on thier own?
    By the way i like to write adagio pieces
    slow haunting strings [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
    Thanks

    PJstar.

  2. #2

    Re: GPO strings

    Originally posted by PJSTAR:
    But is it possible to get realistic string arrangements that stand out on thier own?
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">I should have one type of answer for you in the next few days. Merry Christmas. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

  3. #3

    Re: GPO strings

    GPO\'s strings (I assume that you\'re doing sections, not solos) have a limited articulation set, but for slow, haunting music, you don\'t really need spiccato, marcato and such, so this isn\'t much of a limit.

    I think the biggest problem you will have is that the samples are fairly heavily looped. This is all too apparent on long sustains.

    I\'ve got KHSS, which are not looped. The sustains feature bow turnarounds. I\'d bet that if I layered KHSS sustains over the GPO sections it would work really well. GPO would fill the room while KHSS would add realism and some bite.

    I\'ll have to give this a try!

  4. #4

    Re: GPO strings

    Originally posted by JonFairhurst:
    I think the biggest problem you will have is that the samples are fairly heavily looped. This is all too apparent on long sustains.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">I think that\'s just plain wrong.

    The loops on the section strings are extrememly well done. I\'ve read that the looped sections are 3 seconds long. With my work on Barber\'s \"Adagio for Strings\" I have yet to encounter a noticable loop. I\'m spending more time with tempo shadings and dynamics, which is my own limitations and those of Cubase SX 2 that I\'m dealing with and learning to stretch. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  5. #5

    Re: GPO strings

    Hi Houston, you may be right.

    The first thing I played with in GPO was the Lush violins patch. I was having bad crash problems at the time (now fixed), so after a boot, I\'d bring up the Lush violins again, audition one or two more instruments and... Crash! Again and again.

    I think that made a bad impression on me. I don\'t like the Lush sound much. The nature of the vibrato wasn\'t what I expected or wanted to hear, and it sounded very looped to my ears (whether it actually is or not).

    Since getting things working, I\'ve been playing in track after track, instrument after instrument, rather than listening to each individual instrument all that closely. GPO is awesomely fast and usable in this regard!

    The other thing that may have prejudiced me is that KHSS has been my main string library before GPO. It\'s extrememly espressive and varied. Of course a solo violin should be expressive and varied, while an ensemble should have a more even, consistent sound. So the GPO strings sound a bit bland to me in general. Again, it may be more due to my expectations and first impressions than anything else. Of course, the main expression is added with the mod wheel, but it can be a bit one dimensional when really exposed. Works great in context though!

    I\'m still interested in layering GPO strings with KHSS. Others have done this with GOS and other ensembles and have reported good results. I\'m hoping that it would offer a nice mix of the ensemble consistency with the individual character that I\'ve come to expect.

    I have limited experience with string ensemble libraries. I\'d be curious what owners of GOS, EWQLSO and VSL think of the GPO string sound - expecially for slow, haunting string arrangements.

  6. #6

    Re: GPO strings

    SHEESH!! People on this forum certainly are buggy about sample loops!

    Come on, this isn\'t the great old days of the Mirage for heaven\'s sake.

    In the context of a composition, I doubt anyone\'s attention would be drawn to the string loops in GPO, they are extremely well done.

    As for articulations, well this seems to be the \'leather bucket seats and blaupunkt stereo\' of the BMW set! If your \'expensive library\' has articulations in abundance, then you can sit back comfortably, secure in the knowledge that you own no simple \'plebian\' library, but a \'Mercedes Benz\' of sampling luxury....

    GPO\'s strings are great for anything you might want to do. If you MUST have articulations spend another $250.00 and buy the GOS Lite.

    ...Btw I have N E V E R been able to achieve a realistic legato before GPO...

  7. #7

    Re: GPO strings

    > \"GPO\'s strings are great for anything you might want to do.\"

    That\'s a bit of an overstatement, don\'t you think?

    I don\'t mean to bash with my posts above, but fawning isn\'t really helpful either. Like all things, GPO has strengths and weaknesses.

    But no doubt it\'s a great value. I don\'t regret buying GPO for a minute.

  8. #8

    Re: GPO strings

    Well, here we go again..I\'m accused of \'fawning\' over what is self-evident from just listening to the demos with an unjaundiced ear, on the Garritan site.

    I think maybe people have just gotten used to the \'juiced-up\' string attacks in so many of the previous libraries, like Kirk Hunter, Roland, and now VSL.

    I know for certain from a friend involved in the sessions that one famous library had a special compression applied to most of the string articulations because the developer was afraid that people (and apparently so) would complain.

    I\'ve been around live string sections and orchestras for years, listening and recording them. I was always disatisfied with the string sounds in previous libraries because of the goosed attacks.

    I remember one particular recording we did with a guest conductor of our local symphony. He has a huge catalog of recordings stretching back 25 years, and he was really into a \'hard\' sound from the strings and had the players purposely hack away on a famous piece. Our local conductor said he must have been used to the many recordings where he employed \'that sound\'.

    I\'ve never cared for \'showy\' string playing and when it comes out of a sampler, the parts just scream \"I am a SAMPLE!!\"

    Of course, if you like that sort of thing, who am I to say anything different?

    My remarks are for people reading this who maybe aren\'t familiar with GPO and are looking for a nice product for \'classical\' music as opposed to stentorian Danny Elfman belicose.

    I guess I\'m so jazzed about this library because it\'s the first (and presently ONLY one) that is ideal for classical music.

    Now somebody tell me I\'m full of it so they can have the last word here and we all can get back to making music and learning this great library.

  9. #9

    Re: GPO strings

    Originally posted by nexus:
    I guess I\'m so jazzed about this library because it\'s the first (and presently ONLY one) that is ideal for classical music.
    <font size=\"2\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">[img]images/icons/confused.gif[/img]

  10. #10

    Re: GPO strings

    > \"Well, here we go again..I\'m accused of \'fawning\' over what is self-evident from just listening to the demos with an unjaundiced ear, on the Garritan site.\"

    Sorry about the fawning comment. We clearly both allow that each us has our own tastes and expectations.

    And to be clear, I don\'t dislike the strings - I think they work really well when the sections are playing together and the mod wheels on each are doing thier own thing. But when a single section is exposed with a long sustain, I feel that the results are a bit static for my tastes.

    I think I know what\'s up for me. It\'s not the attacks. It\'s that when you loop a sample, the end of the loop needs to end up at the same point where the loop began. That means that the rate or depth of any vibrato or tremolo can\'t change, otherwise you would end up with kind of an LFO sawtooth effect. Same for the intensity and loudness.

    Of course, we have the mod wheel to add our own expression. It works great when the sections interact with one another. And it\'s really flexible - we decide when the envelope moves. I like it! But for a single, exposed instrument or section I find that the mod-wheel effect is one-dimensional. And that could be a limitation when doing slow, haunting strings - at least when only one voice is playing.

    On the flip side, articulations with built-in expression can be limiting and repetitive.

    Non-looped, expressive sustain samples don\'t have to be limiting though. They can move freely on their own, and can also be countoured with the mod wheel or expression control. It\'s the best of both worlds.

    Regarding repetitiveness, I like the KHSS solution. It uses 8, 12 or even 16 velocity layers per sample. That means that a subtle change in velocity will play a unique sample, so specific samples don\'t have to repeat.

    That doesn\'t mean I\'d change GPO though. To offer the full orcheatra that fits in 1 GB and costs $250 is excellent. You can\'t meet those requirements and do endless layers and articulations of expressive non-looped sustains.

    Anyway, nexus, I hear you about the juiced attacks. You\'re definitely not \"full of it\". [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

    Over time I expect that we\'ll both find things in the library that are even better than we first expected. And we\'ll also discover some limitations (as well as our own!). It\'s the same for all libraries - and even physical instruments. May the path be a rewarding one.

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