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Topic: Cymbal Playing Techniques

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  1. #1

    Cymbal Playing Techniques

    I'm trying to determine the playing techniques used for the GPO Cymbals. The crash cymbal and the choke cymbal sound to me as though they have been hit with a beater as opposed to clashed together. Can anyone help?

    Cheers

    Mike Gill

  2. #2
    Senior Member Styxx's Avatar
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    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Gill
    I'm trying to determine the playing techniques used for the GPO Cymbals. The crash cymbal and the choke cymbal sound to me as though they have been hit with a beater as opposed to clashed together. Can anyone help?

    Cheers

    Mike Gill
    It would be hard for me to imagine them using a beater or mallet for crash cymbals in orchestra. However, there are numerous ways in which a percussionist can achieve the desired effect for the given composition using mallets, sticks or certain strikers. Not to mention class, size, and thickness of the cymbals recorded. I would guess that there was considerable thought into which effect they would present in GPO. Taking an educated guess I would say they used the standard strapped cymbal crash technique for the given effect. This is only my best estimate not being there at the recording process.
    But you have sparked me to listen closer to the samples later on and possibly give you a better reply.
    Styxx

  3. #3
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    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    There are both crash cymbals and suspended cymbals. The suspended cymbals are heat with a stick.

  4. #4

    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    Quote Originally Posted by Styxx
    It would be hard for me to imagine them using a beater or mallet for crash cymbals in orchestra. However, there are numerous ways in which a percussionist can achieve the desired effect for the given composition using mallets, sticks or certain strikers. Not to mention class, size, and thickness of the cymbals recorded. I would guess that there was considerable thought into which effect they would present in GPO. Taking an educated guess I would say they used the standard strapped cymbal crash technique for the given effect. This is only my best estimate not being there at the recording process.
    But you have sparked me to listen closer to the samples later on and possibly give you a better reply.
    Styxx,
    I'd assumed that the crash cymbal was using the standard clash techniqe, but it does sound different to other orchestral percussion libraries I have (I can't 'hear' the second cymbal). It probably won't make much difference in the context of a loud tutti passage, but I was just curious to see if anyone else had noticed anything.

    Cheers

    Mike

  5. #5
    Senior Member Styxx's Avatar
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    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    (I can't 'hear' the second cymbal).
    I am a little confused? What second cymbal are you refering to?
    Styxx

  6. #6

    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    The cymbal you're referring to is a cymbal hit with a mallet. The manual refers to it as a 'crash cymbal.' I actually use this as the release/let ring/latter half of the mod-wheel controlled suspended cymbal roll.

    The crash cymbals you want are in the piatti cymbals. One of those is the "smashing of two pieces of metal together" sound that you're looking for.

    I would have offered note names, but I'm at work...and should be working...

    Styxx, since you're a percussionist, why do they call it piatti cymbals? What is piatti? It sounds delicious... Like a dessert pizza with gelato and cinnamon.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Styxx's Avatar
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    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    Quote Originally Posted by jmc
    The cymbal you're referring to is a cymbal hit with a mallet. The manual refers to it as a 'crash cymbal.' I actually use this as the release/let ring/latter half of the mod-wheel controlled suspended cymbal roll.

    The crash cymbals you want are in the piatti cymbals. One of those is the "smashing of two pieces of metal together" sound that you're looking for.

    I would have offered note names, but I'm at work...and should be working...

    Styxx, since you're a percussionist, why do they call it piatti cymbals? What is piatti? It sounds delicious... Like a dessert pizza with gelato and cinnamon.
    CYMBALS (Fr. cymbales; Ger. Becken; Ital. piatti or cinelli)
    Styxx

  8. #8

    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    Mike,

    The piatti cymbals are mapped to C5, C#5, and D5. The C#5 is the one where you can clearly hear the two cymbals meeting. The other two are more abrupt and less revealing of the dual cymbal nature of the strike. By the way, don't overlook the possibility of using more than one of these at the same time. You can adjust both timing and relative levels to get some interesting effects. Try especially the C#5 and D5 together. The D5 can add definition to the attack while the C#5 gives the distinct impression of the two cymbals meeting. Adjust the level of D5 to taste. There are many other layering tricks if you separate them by MIDI channel and apply volume envelopes in your sequencer's graphic MIDI controller window (assuming MIDI volume has been activated in the GPO Options menu). This applies to virtually all of the cymbals. Experiment.

    Tom

  9. #9

    Re: Cymbal Playing Techniques

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Hopkins
    Mike,

    The piatti cymbals are mapped to C5, C#5, and D5. The C#5 is the one where you can clearly hear the two cymbals meeting. The other two are more abrupt and less revealing of the dual cymbal nature of the strike. By the way, don't overlook the possibility of using more than one of these at the same time. You can adjust both timing and relative levels to get some interesting effects. Try especially the C#5 and D5 together. The D5 can add definition to the attack while the C#5 gives the distinct impression of the two cymbals meeting. Adjust the level of D5 to taste. There are many other layering tricks if you separate them by MIDI channel and apply volume envelopes in your sequencer's graphic MIDI controller window (assuming MIDI volume has been activated in the GPO Options menu). This applies to virtually all of the cymbals. Experiment.

    Tom
    Tom,
    Thanks for the detailed advice. Layering the crash (mallet) and one or more of the piatti should do the trick! I guess I was expecting a 'traditional' loud sustained clash, but this way we get the best of both worlds!

    Once again thanks.


    Mike

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