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Topic: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

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  1. #1

    Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    I am about to purchase a Mac dual G5 and Logic, as the final step to a
    complete upgrade to my studio. This has me wondering; With the huge
    number of tools included with Logic, and the sound quality of it's better
    plugins supplimented with the manditory (for me anyway) Waves suite, Is
    PT really needed for anything other than compatibility these days.

    I know in years past, the PT platform afforded higher track counts and
    provided lower latency, but I have to think that with a Dual G5, that
    becomes more of a non issue.

    I work mostly on recording synths and vocals and then mixing. Mostly
    orchestral new age, and dance (yeah, some combination!). Compatibility
    is not an issue for me because all projects are started and finished
    in house with some minor exceptions, and they have Logic.

    For the last 5 years I have used PARIS for most of my projects, and am
    actually still keeping that platform active for some projects, but I really
    want to do more Virtual Synth/Sampler stuff. As I have been out of the
    market for a long time, what are some of the better Audio cards for such
    a setup?

    Also, what MIDI interfaces provide the tightest timing for a setup like this?


    Thanks,

    John Fairmont

  2. #2

    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    I agree with everything the esteemed Mr. Blaske says.

    But I'd add that I was contemplating giving up Pro Tools, since my MIX hardware has been EOL-ed and will never run on a G5 (and I plan to move to a G5 pretty soon). This week I worked on an animation project that made me realize what a terrible idea it would be giving up PT.

    The project involved a sound-alike, which I did in Logic, but we also had to do the sfx. Fuggeddabout Logic for that. Pro Tools is *so* much faster for editing that it's not even close. You can spot fx, jump around the regions, apply Audiosuite processing to individual effects, apply fades...it's become second nature after all these years. Pro Tools stays.

    Logic for composition. Pro Tools for production and audio editing. I haven't yet decided whether I'm going to switch over to Logic for large-scale mixing projects; it would be more convenient not having to bounce to PT, but PT is very good for mixing.

    ...which is not to say that Nuendo and other programs aren't also in the running.

  3. #3

    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    Thanks guys! This is exactly the info I was looking for.

    Actually, I didn't realize that I could create a kind of server-farm of
    Macs running Logic. That sounds like something I really want to look
    into. It also makes me glad that I made sure we constructed a separate,
    air conditioned, room for computers in the new studio!!!

    I think I will go with trying the native solution first, and seeing how things
    go.

    Thanks again,

    John Fairmont

  4. #4
    Senior Member
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    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    I'm on the other side of the coin. I've been pining for Pro Tools for like 3 years now, but since G5 Dual came out and seeing vast amounts of native plug-ins online and available with power to spare I thought less of how I was going to afford a $30k-$50k system and more towards samples and native plug ins. Waves is very hard to beat, but again those plug ins are also available in native format.

    Not trying to compare a $50k system with its much cheaper alternatives, but there's a lot to be said about some of the new aftermarket options available to UAD PCI (like the Precision Limiter and Cambridge EQ, along with precise emulation of the Tektronic LA-2A) as well as to TC Powercore Compact Firewire (Sony Oxford EQ & Mastering Suite). Add an Apogee 8-channel 192kHz Rosetta A/D/D/A converter and a UA 2-610 to the signal chain and a Mackie 8-Channel Logic Control Surface (with 100mm Touch-Sensitive Motorized Faders & HUI programming) and you're on your way.

    Frederick Russ
    Sanctus Angelis

  5. #5

    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    I agree with everything people have said. I sold Protools and went Logic/Native completely with a Dual G5 and have pretty happy. I don't think latency is too much of a concern anymore with native. You can record sessions with live players with no trouble. The 3 things that irk me about not having Protools anymore are :

    1. no audiosite processing - yes there are ways around it in Logic but being to apply FX offline was hard to do without.

    2. no Spot mode - being able to spot a track in Protools to a specific SMPTE code was easy - I haven't figured out an easy way in Logic.

    3. opening a Logic session on another computer or at another studio is kind of a disaster - in Protools it's simple.

    So, if you're working by yourself and don't have to move sessions around, I think you'll be plenty happy with Native.

    Jeff

  6. #6

    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    I agree 100 percent with Nick. I need and use both. even protools LE is faster and more intuitive than Logic for audio production and picture sync. My wet dream would be for Logic to develop a protools emulator window set where the software behaved just like protools. My nightmare is that digidesign will abandon the Mac platform and go PC.

    In addition to audio editing, when I need to record real musicians, ProTools is simply faster and easier. So, I use PT for that too. Futzing around with synths, midi and softsynths/samplers, Logic is the choice.

    Like Nick, I had a small project recently where, in addition to music, I had to do some sound design and voice overs, and thought I'd try to do the whole thing with Logic. What a nightmare!! Never again.

  7. #7

    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    Just to put a finer point on it, Mr. Frederick, that's not the issue. Logic is great for music, no question. Tracking in Logic is fine, there's no real issue with plug-ins (other than a couple of TDM ones I'd really miss, like Access Virus Indigo and the Sound Toys ones)...that's why I was considering doing without Pro Tools.

    It's when you want to move stuff around a lot - other than comping vox, which Logic is very good at - that PT is indispensible. Plus Audiosuite, which Logic doesn't do properly in OS X. (File-based processing makes much more sense for individual sfx than real-time processing; you want to change the file and move on, rather than using automation to bypass plug-ins.) And also in-position time-stretching, which you're constantly using for sfx. (DP can do that, actually.)

    The list goes on and on. What it comes down to is that Logic's system of clicking in the time ruler rather than the waveform works great when you're working with musical divisions (i.e. to a Grid), but you want to click on the waveform when you're doing the kind of editing I use PT for.

    Some of this is just a matter of working styles, but the interfaces are just fundamentally tuned to different applications.

    So it's not that you're on the opposite side of the coin, it's that you're only talking about one side.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
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    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Batzdorf
    So it's not that you're on the opposite side of the coin, it's that you're only talking about one side.
    Yep - that's cause I don't have the other side or the 30k to comment firsthand. (Nick, want to help a poor musician? lol) I don't see PT as being replaced by Logic by any stretch of the imagination - but for those of us doing productions with economy in mind, we make Logic work, however inconvenient (and from what I can see very inconvenient especially to those used to working with PT.)

  9. #9

    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    It's only $15K, not 30.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
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    Re: Getting Logic 7, Is Pro Tools Needed anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Batzdorf
    It's only $15K, not 30.
    Wow that is a bargain!

    *Frederick holds out pencil jar, waits for Nick's generous donation to the PT cause - heck its only $15k - no problem! *

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