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Topic: Sonar and GPO Studio

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  1. #1

    Sonar and GPO Studio

    Hi All:

    Just purchased SONAR 4 for my PC. I have always been under the impression that GPO Studio was ONLY used with notation programs.

    HOW and WHY is it used with a powerful audio/sequencing program like SONAR 4?

    If rwayland is getting great results using GPO studio with SONAR and others are not because they are not using it, I would appreciate some kind of explanation so I can optimize my chances for success with GPO and SONAR 4.

    I'm one of those guys that understands sequencers, etc. but possesses little knowledge of computer "guru" stuff. Basic things, no problem, but troubleshooting all areas of a problem is a BIG problem for me. Sorry for my ignorance of the machine.

    John

  2. #2

    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    John,
    I'm using GPO successfully as a VSTi in SONAR (3 and 4). I know RWayland has had many difficulties using GPO as a VSTi, but I believe it's preferable to use GPO as a VSTi in SONAR, both from an ease-of-use standpoint (all managed from within SONAR) and from a performance/capacity standpoint--Studio always creates 8 instances of the Kontakt player, uses memory that could be used for samples, etc.

    I'm working on a project in SONAR that loads 9 player instances and has 34 midi tracks...no problems.
    Bill

  3. #3

    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    How? There are several methods....there are some great tutorials on the GPO website. I can't recommend which is best because I don't know what audio card you have (AISO drivers, etc).

    Why? Because SONAR's sequencer, mixer, effects, etc all make it possible to make the most of GPO.
    I remain solely responsible for the content of my messages, and agree to indemnify and hold harmless northern sound source, and their agents with respect to any claim based upon transmission of my message(s). Rock on.

  4. #4
    Senior Member rwayland's Avatar
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    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhap2
    Hi All:

    Just purchased SONAR 4 for my PC. I have always been under the impression that GPO Studio was ONLY used with notation programs.

    HOW and WHY is it used with a powerful audio/sequencing program like SONAR 4?

    If rwayland is getting great results using GPO studio with SONAR and others are not because they are not using it, I would appreciate some kind of explanation so I can optimize my chances for success with GPO and SONAR 4.

    I'm one of those guys that understands sequencers, etc. but possesses little knowledge of computer "guru" stuff. Basic things, no problem, but troubleshooting all areas of a problem is a BIG problem for me. Sorry for my ignorance of the machine.

    John
    To use it is quite simple. Just load GPO studio. Then open Sonar, make sure GPO Studio is listed in devices -- GPO Studio 1, GPO Studio 2,etc. Then you can select them in the same fashion as any other instruments, except that the channel will be the slot number in the appropriate GPO Studio.

    You can add ambience, using Studio. But to use Sonar effects, you must first record your piece, and then play back the audio using the Sonar effects. Using DXi, you can use the effects before actually recording, and demands on computer resources should be less since with DXi you don't reserve memory for all slots of all instances, just what you load.

    Using the DXi plug in, or using the Cakewalk VST adapter, I have had good practice at recovering from crashes, but no useful results. The effects are fine, but crashes and lockups are such a nuisance. I have contacted Cakewalk, and will be working with them. They don't seem to have experienced the problem. So, after a short nap, and lots of French Roast coffee, I am going to spend some time trying to work this out.

    Richard

  5. #5

    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    One other note to add to the mix.

    I'm using Sonar PE 3.1.1 and I use GPO in two ways within a single music file:

    1. I load the DXI and use it solely for the Steinway grand piano so I can use the sustain pedal as normal.
    2. I load other instances as VSTi (sometimes 1, sometimes more than one if I need more than 8 or so instruments) and I used the Cakewalk VST adapter to recognize the GPO VSTi version (you only have to do this once) so that all the instruments in the VSTi's use the sustain pedal to switch the strings (or whatever instrument) into legato mode.

    Sonar works flawlessly so far, HOWEVER, I have noticed (and no offense to the GPO staff) that the very second I load the GPO Ambience reverb plugin, my CPU useage jumps immediately up to about 35% (from about 10% let's say) and while my sequence still plays nicely, this is a bit of a concern, especially if I get real ambitious with some huge sequences down the road. I notice that the Lexicon reverb (which comes with Sonar) hardly uses any CPU at all in comparison to the GPO Ambience reverb. I know this has been talked about in other forum posts, but I just wanted to bring it to your attention so that you don't freak out as you watch your CPU useage go up.

    That said, I feel strongly that the GPO Ambience reverb is perfectly matched to the GPO instruments and therefore I will probably always use it when I'm sequencing with GPO instruments. Similar to this rule, I will probably always use the GPO Steinway when sequencing with GPO strings, oboe, flute, etc., because again, they have matched the sounds and overall "snugness" of the instruments to each other and most likely, any other of my various grand piano sounds wouldn't "mesh" as well with the GPO strings. They really really did their homework and created a full-blown set of instruments that work EXTREMELY well together.

    I have only begun to plumb the depths of the GPO phenomenon!
    Kevin B. Selby
    http://kevinselby.com <-- Public site
    http://kevinselby.com/gpo <--My music catalog FREE to GPO users: username: gpo - pword: garritan

  6. #6
    Senior Member rwayland's Avatar
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    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhap2
    Hi All:

    Just purchased SONAR 4 for my PC. I have always been under the impression that GPO Studio was ONLY used with notation programs.

    HOW and WHY is it used with a powerful audio/sequencing program like SONAR 4?

    If rwayland is getting great results using GPO studio with SONAR and others are not because they are not using it, I would appreciate some kind of explanation so I can optimize my chances for success with GPO and SONAR 4.

    I'm one of those guys that understands sequencers, etc. but possesses little knowledge of computer "guru" stuff. Basic things, no problem, but troubleshooting all areas of a problem is a BIG problem for me. Sorry for my ignorance of the machine.

    John
    Well, I have spent many hours last night and today working on this matter. My conclusions: GPO Studio is by far easiest, the ambience is good, but could be troublesome when using many voices. I currently am working mostly with piano and organ. Now that I have corrected some installation problems, I find that DXi is uses much less of the cpu, and it is easier to use a variety of effects. Using Studio, you can use the capture to audio feature to create your wav files. With DXi, you must use the record features of Sonar, which are slightly more difficult.

    So it is your choice, according to what you expect to be doing. I am not sure which way I will go, but am now satisfied that DXi or Studio is a good way. I am not at all sure that I will ever use the VSt.

    Richard

  7. #7
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    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    My preference is to use GPO straight with Sonar. I found it has a smaller load on my computer than with Studio. Studio loads up 8 instances of GPO from the start. This may not be necessary for the piece your working on.

    The Lexicon Pantheon reverb sounds better than Ambience and as noted has very low CPU usage. Ambience sounds grainier to my ears.

    Only use the VST version as the DXi version has a nasty tempo change bug. When you add tempo changes, the note lengths get all goofed up. This sounds like stuck notes.

  8. #8
    Senior Member rwayland's Avatar
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    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    Quote Originally Posted by Haydn
    My preference is to use GPO straight with Sonar. I found it has a smaller load on my computer than with Studio. Studio loads up 8 instances of GPO from the start. This may not be necessary for the piece your working on.

    The Lexicon Pantheon reverb sounds better than Ambience and as noted has very low CPU usage. Ambience sounds grainier to my ears.

    Only use the VST version as the DXi version has a nasty tempo change bug. When you add tempo changes, the note lengths get all goofed up. This sounds like stuck notes.
    Well, you sure are right about the smaller load. But I have not experienced the tempos change glitch. I have a piece with numerous tempo changes, including series of tempo changes (for accellerando) without tempo problem. However, it may be that the problem does not occur because the piece was orignally done in GPO Studio.

    I am still trying to get comfortable with the VST/DXi versions, as I have used Studio exclusively until the past few days. It is basically just a matter of familiarity, as it certainly is not difficult. The only real thing to learn is a different set of reverb/equalizers.

    Richard

  9. #9
    Senior Member rwayland's Avatar
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    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    Quote Originally Posted by Haydn
    My preference is to use GPO straight with Sonar. I found it has a smaller load on my computer than with Studio. Studio loads up 8 instances of GPO from the start. This may not be necessary for the piece your working on.

    The Lexicon Pantheon reverb sounds better than Ambience and as noted has very low CPU usage. Ambience sounds grainier to my ears.

    Only use the VST version as the DXi version has a nasty tempo change bug. When you add tempo changes, the note lengths get all goofed up. This sounds like stuck notes.
    Well, shucks. I thought I had the VST/DXi all figured out. But, no such luck. Since re-installing, everything works well except the record function. I have no trouble recording using GPO Studio, or Roland JV1010, just can't find a way to record with DXi or VST. Can't arm the audio track and get sound at the same time. I presume I am missing something simple, and will kick myself when it becomes apparent, but at the moment, I am frustrated. Ideas, anyone?

    I sure have carried on a lot about this topic. But it is nothing compared to the time I spent checking out the VST/DXi functions, and I sure would like to resolve the issue and get on with the music. Right now I am going to have some more French Roast coffee and try out my new donut maker.

    Richard

  10. #10

    Re: Sonar and GPO Studio

    Quote Originally Posted by rwayland
    Can't arm the audio track and get sound at the same time.
    As a fellow SONAR user, I sure sorry you're having all this trouble with SONAR and GPO. Kind of chills the music experience, doesn't it.

    If what you're trying to do is to record a midi track (which in turn is driving a GPO VSTi instrument, which is on its own audio track) using an external keyboard, you want to arm the midi track, not the VSTi audio track, to record the midi. And you also need to make sure the "Input Echo" (next to the "R" button on the midi track) for the midi track is "on" so that you can monitor what you're playing/recording. Geez, it's late. I hope I'm making sense.
    Bill

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