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Topic: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

  1. #1

    Cool 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Here's a piece for Herbie Hancock's 70's funk affinados:


    Scarbee finger'n'slap bass
    Scarbee RSP Rhodes
    A Stylus loop revisited
    All other percs from Stylus as well
    RMX for the bongo loops
    Atmosphere for the strings and pads
    A little bit of real guitar...

    I used a Roland GR33 midi guitar to write the keyboard parts
    (with a little bit of editing )

  2. #2

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Cool, good groove. I love this kind of stuff especially Herbie's Thrust Album.

  3. #3

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Great track. Grooves, and stays interesting throughout. Do you have more of these?
    It's all about the music - really. I keep telling myself that...

  4. #4

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Sweet!! The bass sounds super tasty. The Rhodes is spot on. I'm only missing two things- the ARP strings and the vocoder!!

  5. #5

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Yes, I was a huge fan of Herbie around that time (still am, but don't listen to is quite so much these days). You're obviously familiar with the style. I'd say you especially nailed the bass... kudos to both you and Scarbee.

    Only thing I would change, and these are *minor* issues, is I'd like to hear a little more attack on the Rhodes. Get some real bite on some of those notes, really make those tines rattle. It's a little laid back (for Herbie). Only other thing is I would put a little more emphasis on the cymbals on the drum kit. Even when he played "funky" stuff, Herbie almost always used jazz drummers who seemed to spend the majority of their time going ta-ting-ting-ting-CRASH. ;<). Tony Williams come to mind.

    I'm not really saying there is anything wrong with your tune at all... no point in slavish imitation anyway. But you sure took me back... nice work.

  6. #6

    Smile Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Thanks guys! I'm honored

    Yea, I dig Thrust. Cool cover too!


    Hey Dasher, how is it going man!
    I have 2 CDs worth of material that I started writing 12 years ago (fusion/world) and haven't finished yet, with guests such as Richard Bona, Will Calhoun and Ralph Bowen.
    It is a mix of samples and live performances...funk, African, rock, Latin, Middle Eastern, flamenco, orchestral...etc


    it know you'll dig that bass lib. The real jazz bass feel


    yes, a little boost in the mids would sound nice. I realize this sound is smoother but as you mentioned, I took artistic liberty. I couldn't touch Herbie if I tried (I'm a guitarist )

    The drummer thing is disagree. A lot of great jazz drummers played with Herbie but there were also these tracks that didn't have a problem staying in the pocket the whole way...
    It's funky, man!

    Thanks to all for your encouragements. It sustains my drive...

  7. #7

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    S'okay, Patrick. Some points to keep in mind:

    A) I think it's a fine song. I *certainly* could not do it. And there really is no point to slavishly recreating a Herbie sound... where's the fun in that? So, about 90%, I too am giving props. The bass, in particular, kicks [booty].

    B) That said, there is really very little usefulness in a thread where everyone just says "Great tune, Patrick". Maybe that is standard protocol in the music biz, but it doesn't really provide any illumination for those of us who would like to know your thoughts, and why you did things a certain way. In most cases, I guess the answer is just going to come down to "taste", and there is no arguing that. But I'm trying to dig a little deeper, to see whch decisions were made becaue of the strengths and weaknesses of the tools you used, and hope that you'll grace me with a little insight. I dunno... maybe it is too much to hope for, that people will actually discuss "weaknesses" in a forum like this... it might be a bad political move. I can hope...

    So, this tune sounded a little bit more to the "smooth jazz" side than the Herbie I remember (not a lot, just a *little*), and I was curious why that was? One reason could be "what's in the tune was the style I was aiming at". That's a valid answer. Another could be "the EP sample library doesn't really contain any biting mids where you can 'hear the tines rattle'". Or maybe, "it's hard to get that kind of attack when using a guitar as a controller". I wouldn't know, but I sure am curious.

    As for the drums, it seems like the approach you took was an intentional stylistic choice. But maybe "the cymbal thing doesn't play to Stylus' strengths", or "it would require tons of fiddly manual tweaking to get something that sounded natural." So, you went with the in-the-pocket instead?

    I realize that all this may sound a bit pedantic, but I'm actually trying to draw you out a little bit, rather than hissing you off.

    The tune certainly is an effective demo of some of the libraries you used, and I see it has now been posted on the Scarbee site. Congratulations. Listening to the other EP demos on that site, I don't really hear a biting attack on any of them (didn't listen to every last one, though). So, maybe that kind of midrange just isn't a part of the sample library...

    Thanks for any illumination that you might care to shed!

    -- Green

  8. #8

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Hey man,

    I have no problem with your posts.
    I think that criticism, when it is coming from a good place, is very helpful.

    The drums: I definetely wanted something in the pocket for that tune.
    I would have prefered a real drummer but not an option here.
    Ride grooves would be nice. At this point I just don't have enough time to put more hours into the drum programing...
    I think the smooth jazz flavor (I hate smooth jazz) has a lot to do with the drums being looped. I would now use the RMX choas feature to get them to vary over time.

    The bite on the rhodes: as I mentioned, some mids can be added if you want more bite. You want to remember that the rhodes sounded the way it did because of the amp and speaker. Scarbee now has a plugin that is designed to recreate that part of the sound as well. I haven't heard it yet but I bet it might give you the edge you're talking about.

    Thanks for your interest

    by the way, I didn't add an angry face to my earlier post because I was mad at you. I picked the 2 emoticons that spelled your name: green red

  9. #9

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    D'oh!! Didn't catch the green/red part at all. I thought you were happy about part of my comment, and mad about the other part. Oh well....

    Thanks for the info...


  10. #10

    Re: 70's Herbie Nostalgia

    Hey Patrick

    Nice dude, still love that kind of feel

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