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Topic: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

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  1. #1

    Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

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    Sin = no income
    Heaven = income
    I shop therefore I am


    seriously is this what Capitalism comes down to in the end, or am i missing something

  2. #2

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    If you are missing something..as long as your credits in good shape I'm sure we can get it back for you.

    ed

  3. #3

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by charles
    Sin = no income
    Heaven = income
    I shop therefore I am


    seriously is this what Capitalism comes down to in the end, or am i missing something
    It's almost right...

    Hell = no income
    Purgatory = working for income
    Heaven = making income while you sleep

    I own property, stock, bonds, liquid assets, and sit on a number of boards, therefore I am more powerful than you are

    -JF

  4. #4

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    As long as we're speaking in formulas (er, formulae):

    American Style Capitalism <> Capitalism

  5. #5

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    True laissez-faire Capitalism:

    Sin = initiation of force (including taxation*)
    Virtue = rational self-interest, productive work
    Everyone is an end in themselves, not a means to the ends of others.

    * In the short-term, laissez-faire Capitalists are willing to live with fair taxation until it can be replaced with more voluntary methods of funding the government. However, taxation for the purpose of the redistribution of wealth must come to an end.

  6. #6

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Brady Wright
    However, taxation for the purpose of the redistribution of wealth must come to an end.
    No It MUST NOT.


    However I should clarify. I don't for a moment think that such a tax system exists. Taxition totay is not there to re-direct wealth from those that have it to those that don't. This is an odious faleshood spread by those in favour of a flat tax. But if you earn more money you pay more tax (unless you earn a hell of a lot and then having really great accountants kicks in) Which strikes me as very fair......as long as the celling is reasonable. I would say never more than 40% at the highest bracket . I think this countrys Tax system is too complicated and needs to addressed and some of GWB more insane laws repealed , but basically it seems pretty fair.

    ed

  7. #7

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    These two messages highlight an issue I was planning to post about, so thanks for the opportunity and my apologies for highjacking this thread.

    I'm excited about a book I recently finished reading by Muhammed Yunus, founder of the Grameen Bank and former Professor of Economics at Chittagong University in Bangladesh. He invented microcredit as a means of addressing world poverty. The author's aim is to level the playing field and provide the means to help people help themselves. It would be a disservice for me to try to distill the message, but there are a few points which it may be helpful to list here. Before doing so here's a link to the book at Amazon.

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846

    Perhaps the most important point is that poverty can be eliminated worldwide by offering people the means to lift themselves out of poverty. Most programs to aid the poor do not aid the poorest and are usually usurped by those at higher income levels (we've seen this in the US in agricultural aid). The fact is government solutions to aid the poor are badly managed and generally do not actually aid the people who need it most. One of the authors more controversial statements is that credit should be a right. Yet the Grameen Bank is now a worldwide organization that despite requiring zero collateral has an enviable track record with regard to bad debt.

    The author is equally adamant that true laissez-faire Capitalism is not the solution either. The Grameen Bank's programs for offering credit to the poor involve significant support both from the Bank and peer groups. There is also the necessity of government involvement in providing funding and amending laws. For example in the US welfare recipients tend to be reluctant to become entrepeneurs if it means giving up their welfare benefits. There has to be the opportunity to continue benefits until their business is off the ground and/or prorate benefits based on self employed income.

    The website for the Grameen Foundation USA has much more information. I invite anyone interested in addressing the problem of worldwide poverty to visit there and get better information than what I've posted here. Here's a link.

    http://www.gfusa.org/

    Perhaps the most important point I can make is that Dr. Yunus's organization was built over a quarter of a century from first hand experience in trying to address the problem of poverty in Bangladesh. What he's found is that human nature is similar worldwide, but cultural differences make a "one size fits all" solution impossible. There are thus necessary differences between what works in Africa and what works in the USA, but many aspects of the program are applicable everywhere. By far the most important factor in helping the poor is an intent and commitment to do so.

    Cheers,

    Steve Chandler
    http://www.audiostreet.net/stevechandler
    http://www.soundclick.com/stevechandler

  8. #8

    Smile Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by JonFairhurst
    It's almost right...

    Hell = no income
    Purgatory = working for income
    Heaven = making income while you sleep

    I own property, stock, bonds, liquid assets, and sit on a number of boards, therefore I am more powerful than you are

    -JF
    Hey Jon do you want to be a pope?

    if so i will join your church.

  9. #9

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by pantonality
    Perhaps the most important point is that poverty can be eliminated worldwide by offering people the means to lift themselves out of poverty. Most programs to aid the poor do not aid the poorest and are usually usurped by those at higher income levels (we've seen this in the US in agricultural aid). The fact is government solutions to aid the poor are badly managed and generally do not actually aid the people who need it most. One of the authors more controversial statements is that credit should be a right. Yet the Grameen Bank is now a worldwide organization that despite requiring zero collateral has an enviable track record with regard to bad debt.

    The author is equally adamant that true laissez-faire Capitalism is not the solution either. The Grameen Bank's programs for offering credit to the poor involve significant support both from the Bank and peer groups. There is also the necessity of government involvement in providing funding and amending laws. For example in the US welfare recipients tend to be reluctant to become entrepeneurs if it means giving up their welfare benefits. There has to be the opportunity to continue benefits until their business is off the ground and/or prorate benefits based on self employed income.

    The website for the Grameen Foundation USA has much more information. I invite anyone interested in addressing the problem of worldwide poverty to visit there and get better information than what I've posted here. Here's a link.

    http://www.gfusa.org/

    Perhaps the most important point I can make is that Dr. Yunus's organization was built over a quarter of a century from first hand experience in trying to address the problem of poverty in Bangladesh. What he's found is that human nature is similar worldwide, but cultural differences make a "one size fits all" solution impossible. There are thus necessary differences between what works in Africa and what works in the USA, but many aspects of the program are applicable everywhere. By far the most important factor in helping the poor is an intent and commitment to do so.

    Cheers,

    Steve Chandler
    http://www.audiostreet.net/stevechandler
    http://www.soundclick.com/stevechandler
    Hi Steve

    How does the aims of this foundation relate to regions of the world like for example the Middle East and Iraq in particular, where the root cuase of the problem is that the countries are tied in struggles of power politics?
    Is this foundation critical of the forces of globalisation?
    Are they critical of American foreign policy?

  10. #10

    Re: Is American Style Capitalism a Religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by ed buller
    Taxition totay is not there to re-direct wealth from those that have it to those that don't.
    No? What do you call welfare and subsidies?

    Quote Originally Posted by pantonality
    Perhaps the most important point is that poverty can be eliminated worldwide by offering people the means to lift themselves out of poverty.
    Yes, through the uniform protection of private property. Many in the third-world are denied the same recognition of the sanctity of their property and assets that is given to the aristocracy of their country.

    Attempts to solve the problem of poverty by stealing from those who have produced and earned wealth and giving it to those who have not will always fail. What's more, they are fundamentally morally unsound.

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