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Topic: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

  1. #1

    Question Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    Hi Folks,

    I'm very much in doubt between a Roland SRX-11 expansion board (I have the 02) and the Ivory Grand. Of course, they're not completely comparable, but still...

    When I listen to the Ivory demos (including the aiffs) I often hear a hiss. Could anybody tell (assure) me that this is weird demo-artifact or is it a known problem of Ivory? I would use my new piano both live and on recordings, and I'm looking for the best quality I can get.

    Thank you very much!


  2. #2

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?


    I believe that Xavier can tell us more about Ivory and sympatic resonance/harmonics

    He tried Ivory in a music store this afternoon !



  3. #3

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    Confirmed here.
    As a competing developer I should know better than to answer this for you but there is a considerable amount of hiss in the Ivory samples.

    I have a sound clip here exposing it clearly, no eq, reverb or other "extra's" to hide or emphasis it.
    Sustain noise problem

    That said, I certainly would not loose any sleep over it since all sampled pianos have some amount of hiss.

    Yes even my own pianos have it to some extent!
    Actually every piano recording ever made (for sampling or otherwise) has a clearly detectable amount of hiss. This is a normal thing when you crank up a microphone pre-amp and record a quickly decaying sound. Although the initial attack phase of the piano note has a very high energy level (it will give a "ultra-hot" signal) the decay phase drops down quickly to - 30 or 50 dB, exposing the mechanical noise floor of both the room and the microphone electronic circuit. Ivory was recorded in a silent room, there is not much background noise I can detect, but the signal path must have had a fair amount of noise, which was not removed in post-processing.
    Anyway, hiss should be fairly easy to remove by applying a good quality noise-reduction plug-in in your AU-chain. I did not try that in LogicPro, though.
    Best regards,
    Michiel Post

  4. #4

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    I tried the Ivory in a shop during 1 hour.

    Maybe my ears are tired, but I didn't notice any sympathetic resonance in pedal up, when notes played are harmonics from each others. For example, when I play C3 and C4, the first harmonic of C3 is enhanced by C4. I haven't heard anything like this on the Ivory. Even when you silently play C3 and then play staccato C4, there's nothing when the first harmonic of C3 should be enhanced.

    About hiss : yes, it has some, and can be irritating sometimes. Developpers should add a built-in noise reductor in next update.

    But you can tweak your sound as you want (thin, warm, adjust velocity curve ...)

  5. #5

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    Quote Originally Posted by xav93
    I tried the Ivory in a shop during 1 hour.
    .....I didn't notice any sympathetic resonance...

    Challenge for next sampled pianos: real sympathic resonance (within the release) pedal up when some keys are still down (at 8' and 5')

    Kontakt 2 will open the door !

    And a improved Imidi rules in giga could to this.



  6. #6

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    I have a couple of other recordings made with Ivory but don't feel comfortable making them public here. (Don't want to play with fuel -even when there is no fire )
    There is one thing that bothered me though. Ivory was recorded without sustain pedal down samples. To compensate for this it uses an artificial SUSTAIN RESONANCE effect. I played the above soundclip with the so called "Extra Resonance" setting at +4 dB. This is rather extreme. For phrases it masks the lack of real sustain resonance. But for prolonged chords and exposed solo notes the effect decays way too fast. Listen to this clip of a single note where the resonance is completely gone after just 1,5 second. When you play a dense phrase with the pedal down the short artificial sustain components for each new note will give some impression of resonance but this is far from a natural sound. I think it's too bad that the effect cannot be modified to make it longer since I do like the general generated sustain algoritme that was used. Maybe this is something for the future. Naturally if you don't use the rich harmonic content of real sustain pedal down samples in your music, this is not a problem.

    For the rest I was really impressed with the overall interface. If looks very good. In my opinion this is what most piano players like most about this plug-in.
    We have some nice goodies in the pipeline in this field, no details, but the future is bright!
    Best regards,
    Michiel Post

  7. #7

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    Very surprised and dissappointed to hear that it has no pedal down samples. That kills it for me. Maybe I should be relieved--now I won't have to worry about whether or not buy it.

  8. #8

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    Hmmm. Ivory has some 32 GB total of piano samples but no pedal down samples..?? Anyway, thanks Michiel for the revealing demos.

  9. #9

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    No pedal down samples?!


    You can even re-pedal notes.

    Really, I think people need to listen to the actual VI and not what anyone says - especially negative things. Forget about the demos, even. Just find somewhere to try it.

    Ivory is as good a sampled piano as there is on the planet. And that takes nothing away from Michiel's Bösendorfer Grandioso, which I have in Giga format and really like for a concert sound.

  10. #10

    Re: Ivory Grand Piano: hiss in demos?

    OK, Nick, give us the evidence then.

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