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Topic: Here's a technical question that ...

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Styxx's Avatar
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    Question Here's a technical question that ...

    I'm not getting anywhere elsewhere.
    Looking to get rid of my SoundBlaster Audigy 2 Card. I am trying to understand how the Delta 1010 and or the Presonus Fire Pod work. Can one burn to disk and or grab from disk audio? How does play back work?
    I feel like a dumb blond (in my case, gray haired old fart)! Anywayzzzzz, ignorance is abound hear and I am not getting the answers from the companies when requested.
    Thought some of you pros could straighten me out.
    Styxx

  2. #2

    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    Generally speaking, different cards aren't going to allow you to do more things with your computer (unless they're bundled with new software), but it will improve sound quality, and give you better options for getting audio captured (numbers of inputs, pre-amps, etc).

    You should already be able to burn to/rip from disk with available tools. Aside from recording live audio, your workflow shouldn't have to change one bit.
    - Jamie Kowalski

    All Hands Music - Kowalski on the web
    The Ear Is Always Correct - Writings on composition

  3. #3
    Senior Member rwayland's Avatar
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    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Styxx
    I'm not getting anywhere elsewhere.
    Looking to get rid of my SoundBlaster Audigy 2 Card. I am trying to understand how the Delta 1010 and or the Presonus Fire Pod work. Can one burn to disk and or grab from disk audio? How does play back work?
    I feel like a dumb blond (in my case, gray haired old fart)! Anywayzzzzz, ignorance is abound hear and I am not getting the answers from the companies when requested.
    Thought some of you pros could straighten me out.
    Perhaps you should state what you want your Audigy to do that it does not do. Then try to discover what the Delta 1010 (or other card) can do which your Audigy can not do. I have not yet tried the mic input, but all else seems to work well on my Audigy. For my needs, the Audigy 2 ZS is adequate, but if I were to change, I would give serious consideration to the Delta.

    Richard

  4. #4

    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    The Firepod is not GSIF compatible, but sounds great on the formats it supports. Significantly, thoguh not dramatically, better than my Echo indigo. Had to return it, tho, the card MUST be GSIF compatible (for my uses) and their tech support said it's not in the future plans.
    Dasher
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    It's all about the music - really. I keep telling myself that...

  5. #5
    Senior Member Styxx's Avatar
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    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    Quote Originally Posted by thesoundsmith
    The Firepod is not GSIF compatible, but sounds great on the formats it supports. Significantly, thoguh not dramatically, better than my Echo indigo. Had to return it, tho, the card MUST be GSIF compatible (for my uses) and their tech support said it's not in the future plans.
    Could you please explain what GSIF compatible means? Thanks.
    Styxx

  6. #6
    Senior Member Styxx's Avatar
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    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    Quote Originally Posted by rwayland
    Perhaps you should state what you want your Audigy to do that it does not do. Then try to discover what the Delta 1010 (or other card) can do which your Audigy can not do. I have not yet tried the mic input, but all else seems to work well on my Audigy. For my needs, the Audigy 2 ZS is adequate, but if I were to change, I would give serious consideration to the Delta.

    Richard
    I am not able to obtain a higher buffer rate. I cannot have two or three instances of GPO and audio plus effects without the sound dropping out, skipping, popping or just plain quitting. If is very frustrating to try to obtain a tutti ending with all instruments with the sound going crazy. I was told by a few people it was a buffer issue. Plus, I have never been able to get the latency to a level where I could play in without some sort of delay. I have given up completely trying to do music on the PC first. I have to do it on my MC-80 then save it to SMF01, load to CubaseSE and work on it from there. I was told the Creative SoundBlaster Audigy 2 card can't handle a big orchestration and so far that's been quite apparent. So, I've been searching. Most frustrating situation.
    Styxx

  7. #7

    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    Styxx, GSIF compatibility only matters if you're trying to use Gigastudio.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Styxx's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Burrell
    Styxx, GSIF compatibility only matters if you're trying to use Gigastudio.
    Yes, I found that out tonight from a support tech. Can you believe it? The question looms though, what if I decided to try Gigastudio or more importantly, is this important to have for Full Kontakt?
    The tech is looking into it more and will get back to me tomorrow. Your help has been perfect as usual. If it weren't for you and Kevin I would have never known to ask those specific questions. As it turns out they were happy I did. In turn, I am very grateful for you guys and the knowledge you possess! Anything I can't stand is spending money on something that doesn't work to the fullest of expectations.
    Styxx

  9. #9
    Moderator/Developer Brian2112's Avatar
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    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    Styxx,

    A solid solution for me has been the Gina card from Echo. Even the MIA is no slouch. They have GSIF and ASIO support and work perfectly with everything I have. Even if you never need GSIF, the Echo cards are real solid performers and are reasonably priced.
    GSIF is not needed for Kontakt. It is exclusively for Giga but it costs no more to have it. Might as well get a solid card that has it in case you need Giga - even if you don't need Giga, Having GSIF doesn't add to the price.

    ...2112
    "So what if some parts of life are a crap shoot? Get out there and shoot the crap." -- Neil Peart
    Hint:1.6180339887498948482 Φ

  10. #10

    Re: Here's a technical question that ...

    I'll cast a vote for the Delta 10/10. You'll need those 10 inputs should you ever want to mike your drum kit. Latency with that model as far as ASIO is supposed to be really good. I have the 1010LT running my home theater system and it sounds fantastic.

    The soundcard really works at the ends of the signal chain going in and out of your computer. For recording purposes, it takes the analog signal from your mixer, converts it to digital, and then passes the result to whatever program (Sonar, Cubase, etc.) is interested in it. For output, it takes the final digital signal from the program, converts it to analog, and sends it out to the monitors, an ADAT, or whatever piece of hardware is going to end up with it. Notice that the soundcard is not involved in the process of rendering the digital signal (that's what GPO creates with all those instruments and instances). The "latency" word that gets tossed around is really a measure of how fast the soundcard can convert all the digital information to analog so you can hear what GPO is producing.

    Reading from, and writing to, the CD is done digitally by the CDROM device, so the soundcard doesn't get involved there either. The only time the soundcard would be used is when the digital signal needs to be "heard," i.e., converted to analog. Here's an example of a CD playback signal chain that starts with the CDROM device and ends with the PC speakers:

    1) Put John Tesh CD in drive tray. CDROM short circuits self rather than suffer the indignity.

    2) Go to CompUSA, get new CDROM.

    3) Put Clapton CD in CDROM

    4) Windows Media Player starts on PC.

    5) WMP receives digital information from the CDROM, which in this case happens to be the live version of "Layla." (playing as I write this, incidentally)

    6) As it gets the information, WMP does whatever processing of the digital signal it needs to (volume, EQ adjustment, etc.) and then passes the result to the soundcard drivers (the pesky software things that never seem to work right and always need updating).

    7) The drivers manage the stream of digital data going to the soundcard itself, making sure that things like the digital clock/sample rate are set correctly and the data stream is getting processed without backlogs.

    8) The soundcard runs the digital information through the DACs (Digital-Analog Encoders. One would think they would be called DAEs, but I guess DAC sounds cooler).

    9) The analog signal that pops out of the backside of the DACs gets routed to the soundcard's output ports, which are hopefully connected to some powered speakers or a tape deck or something.

    So in the end what you should be considering when you get a soundcard is:

    1) How fast it can render digital->analog and analog->digital signal paths. For sampler-based applications like GPO (Kontakt player) faster is better, meaning lower latency and more instruments playing at the same time.

    2) The quality of the converters (both directions - digital->analog and analog->digital). Generally speaking, more expensive soundcards use better converters, although this is not always the case. The product website (or online reviews) traditionally have information on this. If the manufacturer is using top shelf converters, they usually go out of their way to let you know.

    3) How stable are the software drivers. Go to a place like www.avsforum.com and do a search on the soundcard you're interested in. Those guys are pretty damn picky, so if they're having problems with the drivers (they don't work, they don't install nice, they give off some kind of noxious fumes), the whole forum community will hear about it. This is important because if your drivers don't work, your soundcard will not work.

    4) Converter architecture, namely whether or not the converters are located on the card or in a separate breakout box. The idea here is that if the converters are on the card, then signal noise from the CPU among other things can "leak" into the signal path, causing little artifacts that may change the resulting sound. Note that whatever artifacting occurs is most likely to be very, very subtle or probably inaudible, because quite frankly any soundcard manufacturer that produces a sound card that embeds screeches in the signal chain every time you move the mouse won't sell many soundcards. The breakout box is not always a surefire guarantee, though. If you're concerned about your particular brand of soundcard, usually some magazine or online website has done a professional review of it, so they will have some idea on whether or not the soundcard will suffer from this.
    -E

    "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson."

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