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Topic: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

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  1. #1

    Apple/Intel - any wagers?

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    True or false?

    http://news.com.com/Apple+to+ditch+I...?tag=nefd.lede

    (I sure hope it's false, because it would mean a total replacement of everything.)

  2. #2

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    Yes, Jobs is going to announce that they are working with Intel to come up with a 2-button mouse. They expect the transition to take no more than 2 years

  3. #3

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    Don't tell him I've been using one on my Macs for a couple of years.

  4. #4

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Batzdorf
    Don't tell him I've been using one on my Macs for a couple of years.
    Traitor!

    :-)

    Kind regards.

  5. #5

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    From what I understand, OS X can technicaly already run on Intel type processors, so I doubt you will have to scrap everything.
    I remain solely responsible for the content of my messages, and agree to indemnify and hold harmless northern sound source, and their agents with respect to any claim based upon transmission of my message(s). Rock on.

  6. #6

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    We had to update a fair amount of software just to go from 10.3.9 to 10.4. Believe me, we'll have to update everything.

    This almost certainly won't be Pentium, by the way, it'll be whatever super-dooper chips Intel is making at the time. Pentiums wouldn't be as good as G5 chips, according to everything Apple has been saying for the past two years; even if that's not true, it would require a lot of PR backpedalling that nobody would buy.

    On the other hand, chips should be easier to sell than wars, so what do I know.

  7. #7
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    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Batzdorf
    We had to update a fair amount of software just to go from 10.3.9 to 10.4. Believe me, we'll have to update everything.
    I think that's looking more likely at this point, althought tomorrow and the next few days will make things clearer in San Francisco I believe. Maybe this is to do with speed etc.

    One thing looks inevitable at the moment - Logic doesn't look like going 64 bit anytime soon.

  8. #8

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    Yes, I think many Mac users have long used 2 button or multi-function mice. Makes you wonder why apple never made one? Maybe to protect the aftermarket companies that make them? Or maybe because they just felt having "one" clicker made the mac appear less complicated to your avg user compared to the multi buttons on PC? It's obviously a "choice" on apples part "not" to offer this for themselves. I always wondered "why"?
    If you just want to use "one" button you can. It's not like you "have" to use the other one(s) if you dont' want to.

    Anyway,
    I've spent some time going through a lot of the speculation floating around.
    Some interesting stuff at arstechnica. But, it doesn't make sense to me that apple is going to use intel "processors". Intel makes all kinds of "chips". And some have speculated about WiFI or PCI express, etc.
    It's known for sure that Apple has, in the past and recently, been talking with Intel. Nobody knows what the nature of those dicussions were. There is also the rumor/speculation that apple has long kept a side project of OSX on x86...which would seem more about opening it up to that side of the market..more than replacing their own business market with x86. So, the talks with intel/engineering may have something to do with that. And any announcement that Steve is going to do concerning this...would probably come at such a developer conference..as this would be the appropriate place to do that.

    There are plenty of other things I can think of, that haven't been speculated about concerning a major announcement at an apple WWDC that might be about significant changes with development. One would be..the announcement that classic...is being removed from OSX..moving to a road map of OSX only and full 64bit path. This would mark a milestone for apple, giving up classic support, and would be an important event. But, just in looking at the chips off hand, there are a lot of things that don't make sense to me about a move for apple to Intel chips. First, IBM has always had faster, more advanced chips than apple is using. The PPC 970 G5, borrows from the older IBM Power5. IBM has more advanced "power" technology and even dual cores. They also have the "cell" processing..which is what will be used in both the upcoming Xbox 360 and the new Playstation 3. Intel got passed over for that deal. These are IBM PPC based processors of a new design. So, the problem isn't more speed. That's available. Has been for a while. That's not to mention that the current G5 dual 2.7 is no slouch when even compared to the latest Intel, AMD out today. The big problem here has been apples powerbook and consumer line (mini, etc)..that are stuck with the G4. This is a design/engineering problem. Steve wants slim, light notebooks with good batterylife that won't burn your lap. For whatever reasons, the G5 hasn't been put into apple's powerbooks or mini. Now, that "may" be because it's an engineering problem as speculated. Or it could be in part because apple has a contract with "freescale", the company that now owns and makes the G4, that hasn't quite run out yet. Or someother reason, engineering issue, and other things speculated about.

    Let me end by offering this culled from various responses Ive seen around:
    Even if it turns out to be true..that apple is indeed moving the mac to Intel based cpus/technology...it's entirely possible that it's not going to be "near" as bad a move as most people are speculating it to be.

    First: Your experience , in so far as using a mac..and OSX would not be "any" different than it is now. The mac would still be a mac...same as always. The internal processor isn't going to change any of that. (other than making it faster or more powerful). And it doesn't necessarily mean that apple has to use "x86" as it's architecture. They could verywell, have their own propreitary ROM based MB with Intel technology chipsets and cpu, PCI express, WIFI, etc.

    2nd: Is apple screwing developers over anything new? Please! If the move to OSX didn't get rid of them...I can assure you that this "wont'"...particularly if in the long run..whatever work they do up front..actually makes maintaining cross platform applications "easier" and more streamlined and portable and less costly.

    3rd: this is where the "emulation" technology purchase apple made..is also interesting. Backwards compatiblity with your existing mac apps. But, in that regard...see "First".....regardless...EVEN if we stayed right where we are..withonly OSX currently on G5 revisions..you'd STILL be upgrading your apps, drivers..etc wtihin 2 years..unless you just continued to use what you have (which is also an option that many users, myself included, have been doing). So, even in this regard, it's simply not going to be bad as people envision things. The only sticking point for it would be if developers simply throw up their hands..and refuse to make any changes for it. If you have an emulator...that works seamlessly...even "that" isn't going to be a big problem. Think about the move from 040..to PPC. Your old apps ran in emulation....some for "years". Did that bother you? In that case..PPC processors..were very quickly so much faster than the old 040s..that even under emulation..with an overhead hit...nobody even noticed.

    So, even if these rumors are all true...and within the realm of possiblity...a dualcore intel centrino..would be so much faster than the current G4s in a powerbook..that it could run a software emulator..allowing you run all your current mac apps..just as they are...and even with that overhead..STILL smoke the pants off previous model powerbooks. If you didn't tell anybody it had a centrino in it..you'd never even know it wasn't a new smoking G5 powerbook. The situation for the towers would be different. The G5 duals can hold their own against even the latest Intel has. But, I would guess...a dualcore D Intel would probably run emulation..allowing all your current mac apps to run as they are...at about the speedrange of current top end G5s. And new apps..that are written to run natively on it..would run about 15 to 20% faster. But, given the rumor is..this wont' happen to 2007...my guess is..they would be running whatever "new" processor Intel had out in 07 that would be faster...not the one's available "now". So, it is entirely possible...that this could be done...in a way that you'd not find any signficant difference..as compared to buying a new PPC G5 today with the latest version of OSX and having to update a few drivers, apps..etc for it..

    Anyway..more speculation on the speculation

  9. #9

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    Oh, forgot the links/info about the rumors that have to do with software emulation/backwards compatiblity with apps..etc.:
    It has never been confirmed that the "major company" that was in talks to lic this technology in 2003 was "apple". It could verywell have been MS ...to use in the new Xbox 360..that would offer backwards compatiblity for their previous gen games (ie..than previoiusly ran on Intel based chips in the xbox and now run on cell, PPC from IBM)

    http://www.wired.com/news/technology...,64914,00.html

    http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2005/...25022048.shtml

  10. #10

    Re: Apple/Intel - any wagers?

    Is apple screwing developers over anything new? Please! If the move to OSX didn't get rid of them...I can assure you that this "wont'"...particularly if in the long run..whatever work they do up front..actually makes maintaining cross platform applications "easier" and more streamlined and portable and less costly.
    Impossible. How do you figure they won't lose any developers, just as they did switching to OS X? Of course it's not deliberately screwing them, but it's imposing high costs that not everyone will shoulder, for whatever reason (can't, don't want to, doesn't pay, etc.). Development time is expensive.

    As I posted, the first question is why any company would bother updating a program for a platform that's going to be dead in less than two years.

    This also applies to G5 sales. Would you invest a lot of money in a computer that won't be supported in less than two years? I've upgraded Macs every 2 or 2-1/2 years since the mid-'80s, and even I'd think twice if I knew the machine would be unsupported.

    Apple isn't stupid. They obviously have answers for these questions.

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