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Topic: Larry Seyer drums shootout

  1. #1

    Larry Seyer drums shootout (Fool In The Rain - John Bonham)

    ...with John Bonham. OK, Larry loses, but listen to this if you will. I attempted to get some of the ambience and vintage squishing going on (didn't quite get there). Update - I'm a little closer now after employing Larry's dark studio room convolution and Waves Renaissance Compressor on the master out, tuned the snare up a step and found a heavier ride bell.

    John Bonham outtake (please excuse John's profanity) -
    Fool In The Rain (this is a snippet from a bootleg - not from a commercially available CD)

    Larry Seyer drums by fizbin -
    Fizbin In The Rain (updated 6-9-05) (performed by Señor Mouse [Microsoft Model: 1007] in the Cubase SX piano roll)

    DFHS final version by FredProgGH
    Fred in the Rain 3

    DFHS version 2 by FredProgGH
    Fred in the Rain 2(Pearl kick and snare, with Sonor toms, Zildian hats and Sabian cymbals)

    DFHS version 1 by FredProgGH
    Fred in the Rain 1(Ludwig kit)

    We're still tweaking these as we go so more is to come for awhile probably.


  2. #2

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    Nice!! I played with this a bit today just to check the general vibe but I didn't have the actual MP3 with me to get the exact part. I might be able to post something tomorrow night...

  3. #3

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    Nice job!

    Bonham has both Señor Mouse and Larry beat, but it's commendable work, so far.

    The main difference with the overall sound to my ears is that the Bonham ambience is deeper, flatter and maybe a bit scooped. It's really a great sound. The ambience that you've chosen for LSAD is a bit higher pitched and resonant.

    Maybe you can go through the audition stuff and find a larger GigaPulse space that matches the Bonham sound a bit better. From there you can play with the perspective, EQ and compression to fine tune it.

    If you can match that Bonham sound, you'll have one killer template. Save it and make backups!


  4. #4

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    Bonham has a different kit, so it's not really an a/b comparison.

    Larry Seyer's set is equally huge-sounding, though, and it sounds real (except that the same thing is repeated). It wants a brighter snare, and that ambience has as much subtlety as a bite in the gonads! Both are easy to fix. I also heard some weird flanging, but that can be fixed too (in fact it may be the mp3).

    What's really missing from the Larry Seyer kit is "facking ell." I don't think you're allowed to use a sample of that.

    His library is pretty amazing, though.

  5. #5

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    The ambience itself isn't bad for this style, by the way, just *way* too long. Most engineers treat it as part of the drum sound, i.e. you don't want the snare or bass ambience overlapping the next hit.

  6. #6

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Batzdorf
    His library is pretty amazing, though.
    What's really got me psyched is the programmability of the hihat. Aside from 3 foot hat articulations there are 20 stick hat articulations. There are 5 degrees of closed to open and for each of those there are 4 different strike placements between the edge of the hat to the bell. The latter are keyswitchable, which is how I programmed them. I believe they are also tied to the mod or pitch wheel, but since I am not a keyboard player at all and do my sequencing via mouse the keyswitch option worked best for me.

    On top of that you have the multiple (16?) velocity layers and every hit is round robin alternated (2 hits) to avoid the machine gun effect. It's pretty impressive.


  7. #7

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    OK, here's my entry with DFHS!!

    Bonham is pretty much impossible to really nail the sound of, but I think if you close you eyes at least this sounds like a pretty natural performance. I was in a rush, and I could definitely tweak the programming with more time.

    Here's what I came up with (it's a Pearl kick and snare, with Sonor toms, Zildian hats and Sabian cymbals):


    This is my first version. It's a Ludwig kit. The toms are better than the other version but the kick is too loose and floppy (and the hats are Sabians)


    So, not too bad, though definite room for improvement. In a final version I'd mess with the snare some more and go back to the ludwig toms.


  8. #8

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    Nice Fred! - I think I'm going to have to revisit my attempt at getting the exact ambience that is in the mp3. It would be better to just let the drums sound more natural or process them each a bit individually if necessary. I'll try to get something better up here tonight. Also, I need to choose a heavier bell ride sound and a higher-pitched snare. Then I'll probably be pretty damned close.

    There is this compressed sound that is in the mp3 where there is a small attack that is crisp and then a little pumping sound in the drums from the short release time/relatively high ratio. I'm not sure if his sound in the mp3 matches what went to record and haven't compared it actually.


  9. #9

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    Quote Originally Posted by fizbin
    Also, I need to choose a heavier bell ride sound and a higher-pitched snare. Then I'll probably be pretty damned close.
    If I remember right from the video, you can tune the LSAD drums. You should be able to choose something close, and dial it in from there.


  10. #10

    Re: Larry Seyer drums shootout

    I think you're on a closer track than me with the snare drum already. The kick is really hard too- Bonzo had a really identifiable kick and that's as close as I'll come. The new add on pack for DFHS (Custom and Vintage) may have something that will work. I did compress mine alot but I don't think it's quite right. There is a nearly gated quality going on in the original track, but it's not really a gate. LS should be able to beat DFHS for ambience with al the myriad convolutions it offers. I think DFHS has a great blend to the overall sound though.

    My final verdict is that they both sound good and anyone that can afford both- should!! At some point I'll definitely pick up the LS.

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