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Topic: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

  1. #1

    Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks


    verdict: forget about it when running cpu hungry audio apps.

    It emulates only a G3, so all the altivec SIMD acceleration is not available.
    For office-like apps and non real-time apps it's ok but if you
    buy an Intel Mac you will have to hope/wait that your favorite audio app vendor ports their app to Intel Mac.

    Or alternatively recompile the LinuxSampler source code on your shiny new x86 Mac


  2. #2

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    I saw that too, and in all fairness it means precisely nothing. And that has nothing to do with Linux or anything else.

    Emulation doesn't work for real-time programs to start with, but of course it's going to slow things down. Nobody is going to buy Macs if everything is emulated. We know that - the whole point of going with Intel is supposed to be so they can get faster, or at least that's the cover story.

    But the main reason this strikes me as so silly is that they're pretending to give meaningful benchmarks for a computer that won't be released for another year and a half. Given that one computer year is equivalent to 20 human years, that's like trying to give an IQ test to a person who won't be born until 2035.

  3. #3

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    But if your sampler can play the libraries we use and get better performance, I'm certainly not going to be the one to pooh-pooh the idea of recompiling it.

  4. #4
    Senior Member newmewzikboy's Avatar
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    May 2005
    San Francisco Bay Area

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    AWesome BennO!

    Thanks for the testing!!!!

  5. #5

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    Benno, were those your benchmarks?

    If so, I apologize for being such an ~~~~~~~!

    Of course I would have been more diplomatic - or better yet, kept my mouth shut - if I'd thought they were yours.

  6. #6

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    I wonder what`ll happen to applications like Altiverb,
    or other software that uses altivec engine...
    Damn Jobs, he`s really not thinking of the third party developers
    and the users that rely on those softwares...
    I hope the developers are not having a headache about
    converting there software ...

  7. #7

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    This was published on the altiverb yahoo group. I don't think there's any reason not to paste it in here:

    Hi all,

    The news is not as bad as it sounds. The engine of Altiverb is the
    only thing that now hinges on altivec, so that'll need a rewrite, and
    re-tweak to get is as optimal as possible. Intel chips do have an
    altivec pendant: SSE, so performance will be fine.

    Rosetta (the PPC emulation engine) will not be suitable for running
    applications that do real-time tasks, such as audio and video.

    As there is (more than) a year to go before the hardware reaches the
    market, and even longer before all the host applications are ported,
    there's ample time for us to do the work.

    By the time you'll need it, Altiverb will be there. Note that we will
    only port Altiverb 5, so for version 2, 3 and 4 users: the time to
    upgrade is nigh.


    Peter Bakker
    Audio Ease

  8. #8

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    Peter Bakker of AudioEase says:

    "The news is not as bad as it sounds. The engine of Altiverb is the
    only thing that now hinges on altivec, so that'll need a rewrite, and
    re-tweak to get is as optimal as possible. Intel chips do have an
    altivec pendant: SSE, so performance will be fine."

  9. #9

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    And actually it'll be a lot better than it might be under Windows:

    Current thinking is that Apple will lock the operating system to the hardware platform, and therefore to a specific grade of CPU (Or Better), and therefore application writers will be able to RELY on specific features of the Pentium IV model used by Apple hardware computers.

    SSE (Streaming SIMD extensions) started with the Pentium III, if I remember correctly. These extensions to the "normal" Pentium instruction set allow for SIMD operations on four single-precision floating-point numbers in one instruction. With a Pentium IV the same SSE instructions can now work on double-precision floating point numbers, and the SSE2 instructions work on 128-bit quantities like MMX did for 64-bit quantities.

    So I predict that the folks that hand-tuned Altiverb for the Altivec processor, will do the same for whatever Pentium processor stepping (or better) Apple guarantees will be present in their hardware.
    Andy Finkenstadt, WinXP, P4-2.8GHZ, 3GB, Sonar 4 PE, Sibelius 3. Yamaha CVP-79A.
    EWQL: Gold, GoldPro, Choirs, StormDrum. and Galaxy & Bosendorfer 290, and RealGuitar. And an empty bank account.

  10. #10

    Re: Intel Mac "Rosetta" PPC emulator benchmarks

    newmewzikboy, cool down, I did not do anything

    The benchmarks were done by people attending the apple conference running Xbench on it:
    quote from the article:
    "Individuals attending Apple's Worldwide Developer Conference have submitted Xbench benchmark results from Apple's Pentium 4-based Power Mac systems. The benchmarks do not reflect native performance of the 3.6GHz systems, however, but rather provide an indication of how PowerPC-compiled applications will run under Rosetta on Intel-based systems."

    Nick: I agree with you regarding benchmarking a system that will be available in a year.
    With a big probably Intel will hit 4.5 - 5GHz in a year and provide dual core CPUs by default. (Which means it's like having two physical processors, but they are on the same die).

    And at that time major audio application producers will have a working port for Intel Macs. (the intel assembly optimizations of the windows version can be reused 1:1 on the Intel Mac port so the wheel does not need to be reinvented from scratch.

    But I think even in a year there will probably be many smaller commercial audio apps/plugins that get not ported to Intel Macs due to the company not having the ressources to maintain software for multiple architectures (or the company could have been disappeared etc ...).

    What I was saying in my recompiling joke is that if you have an open source application in source code form it will live on forever, regardless of the machine/CPU architecture since even if it was not intended to run on a certain platform it can be ported. While a commercial company would never give out the source code and if the company goes under the source code usually goes under too locking the application, regardless how great it is to a certain hardware/OS combination.


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