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Topic: Piracy...

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  1. #1

    Piracy...

    Hi...

    I am just merely curious on how developers take action on software pirates especially in Southeast Asia... Every time when I drop a visit at some shopping malls around my place I see all sorts of libraries being cracked - from VSL, Spectrasonics, Steinberg and etc.

    Of course I'm ashamed of this and the fact that it's so rampant all over. I've read some rather disturbing views of some members at another forum that believe cracked softwares actually do a bit of good and calling legitimate buyers as "rich kids". The fact is, it's all over the world, and some people could be earning lots of money by making music and using illegal software.

    Are there any actions taken so far regarding on curbing, and perhaps suing companies who sell these products illegally (from another country)? Would it be too expensive to carry out or perhaps no cooperation from the local authorities? And have they scanned through and checked any music produced in my country for example, are totally legitimate? By using what method if applicable? Digital Watermark? Does it work at all?

    I welcome any developers for some insights on this.

    Thanks,


    Peter
    Peter Wong
    NEXUSCREATIVE.COM
    MUSIC . SOUND . MULTIMEDIA DESIGN

  2. #2
    Senior Member
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    Re: Piracy...

    Quote Originally Posted by nexuscreative
    Hi...

    I am just merely curious on how developers take action on software pirates especially in Southeast Asia... Every time when I drop a visit at some shopping malls around my place I see all sorts of libraries being cracked - from VSL, Spectrasonics, Steinberg and etc.

    Of course I'm ashamed of this and the fact that it's so rampant all over. I've read some rather disturbing views of some members at another forum that believe cracked softwares actually do a bit of good and calling legitimate buyers as "rich kids". The fact is, it's all over the world, and some people could be earning lots of money by making music and using illegal software.

    Are there any actions taken so far regarding on curbing, and perhaps suing companies who sell these products illegally (from another country)? Would it be too expensive to carry out or perhaps no cooperation from the local authorities? And have they scanned through and checked any music produced in my country for example, are totally legitimate? By using what method if applicable? Digital Watermark? Does it work at all?

    I welcome any developers for some insights on this.

    Thanks,


    Peter
    I wouldn't be embarrassed at all. At least some of the driving force for piracy can be laid at the door of wealth imbalance in the world. USA and European pricing just doesn't make any sense in many parts of the world.

    The USA and Europe shouldn't really be embarrassed about the imbalance, either, as we're all working in the same world, roughly, so we have created our wealth over a number of generations.

    When cultural conditions are right then the other parts of the world will have the money and we'll be doing the pirating. The change over is happening now!

    Right now it's an intractable problem as the pricing system can't sensibly be regionalised. Just go with the flow...........

    Frank

  3. #3
    Senior Member Tom Crowning's Avatar
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    Re: Piracy...

    Quote Originally Posted by nexuscreative
    Are there any actions taken so far regarding on curbing, and perhaps suing companies who sell these products illegally (from another country)? Would it be too expensive to carry out or perhaps no cooperation from the local authorities? And have they scanned through and checked any music produced in my country for example, are totally legitimate? By using what method if applicable? Digital Watermark? Does it work at all?

    I welcome any developers for some insights on this.
    Thanks,
    Peter
    If I would be a developer I'd answer 'Yes, ALL music produced with my
    library is watermarked and can easily be tracked down' no matter what
    protection scheme I'm actually using

  4. #4

    Re: Piracy...

    Quote Originally Posted by Hardy Heern
    The USA and Europe shouldn't really be embarrassed about the imbalance, either, as we're all working in the same world, roughly, so we have created our wealth over a number of generations.
    Frank
    ...and our wealth is originally created by exploiting some major continents to exhaustion. Not exactly ethically defendable (very OT I know..I just couldn't keep it to myself ;-)).

    /Daniel Beckman

  5. #5

    Re: Piracy...

    Hi all, some interesting comments you've put in...

    I do agree in many ways that the price applied to some countries are way out of bounds. Like here for instance, our exchange rate is 3.8. So while something cost USD399 here it's already 1500+, and our living standard here is quite high, but I don't think it's an excuse to go for piracy.

    My main concern is that piracy is not only affecting the money factor. What's really losing its ground is the belief of intellectual property rights.

    By not understanding one can easily assumes everything is free and thereby taken for granted that he does not need to go for the extra mile to get something done (just a simplified scenario). For example, if I want to tender a project to impress my clients I can easily rip someone else's CD and images to enhace the presentation and chances are I might get the project and earn lots of money... and what are the costs? Music? Free. Images? Free. Who would know or even remember? It's just a one time presentation!

    If we don't appreciate or respect someone else's work we hold no value to that product. It would be merely disposable. What we can't take, we'll take something else. We do this until we find something that is "takable".

    Why go to this direction when we could think otherwise, like what we can't take, we do something totally new and then we can use it for ourselves?

    Another example, our movie business here in Malaysia is so bad is because video piracy is such a big problem it drove film studios out of business. It's sad to hear our own people complaining movies produced in our own country is of "poor quality" or low budget, couldn't even compare 1% of Hollywood's standards. What they didn't realize, is that when they bought these "poor quality" locally made movies from pirated vendors, they are killing the industry themselves, hence the reason why it's low budget in the first place! Otherwise how could these studios could get back their investment?

    This same applies to sound developers. I read a thread somewhere that Eric (from Spectrasonics) said he only sold a single licensed copy of Heart of Asia in China! Imagine if everyone in China who has a copy actually bought it from him, I reckon he should have already released Heart of Asia 10!

    In summary, it is the idea of piracy itself, the idea of taking things without asking and the idea of taking short cuts in life that is killing the behaviour to innovate and to be creative in other things of life. Also, it cultivates irresponsibility.

    Lastly, if it is so easy to check whether a piece of music is using licensed samples or not, I welcome the authorities to do so a thorough check here in Malaysia, and at least the people would appreciate the technology they own and by supporting the developers instead of pirates!

    Nothing is cheap, I started composing at very low wages and slowly worked up from there. I didn't own tens of thousands of dollars worth of plugins by just a snap of my finger. All were hard earned money.

    I might be blowing things out of proportion... so please correct me if I'm wrong
    Peter Wong
    NEXUSCREATIVE.COM
    MUSIC . SOUND . MULTIMEDIA DESIGN

  6. #6

    Re: Piracy...

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldhrimnir
    ...and our wealth is originally created by exploiting some major continents to exhaustion. Not exactly ethically defendable (very OT I know..I just couldn't keep it to myself ;-)).

    /Daniel Beckman
    ...........so my copyright/patent/intellectual property should be stolen because I'm not from the thrid world?........I think not.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
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    Re: Piracy...

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldhrimnir
    ...and our wealth is originally created by exploiting some major continents to exhaustion. Not exactly ethically defendable (very OT I know..I just couldn't keep it to myself ;-)).

    /Daniel Beckman
    It's not great Dan, but I believe that any others, at the time, would have done the same. It is defensible in that sense. Otherwise I agree. Times change, standards change, scruples and morals change too.

    Frank.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
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    Re: Piracy...

    Quote Originally Posted by nexuscreative
    Hi all, some interesting comments you've put in...

    I do agree in many ways that the price applied to some countries are way out of bounds. Like here for instance, our exchange rate is 3.8. So while something cost USD399 here it's already 1500+, and our living standard here is quite high, but I don't think it's an excuse to go for piracy.

    My main concern is that piracy is not only affecting the money factor. What's really losing its ground is the belief of intellectual property rights.

    By not understanding one can easily assumes everything is free and thereby taken for granted that he does not need to go for the extra mile to get something done (just a simplified scenario). For example, if I want to tender a project to impress my clients I can easily rip someone else's CD and images to enhace the presentation and chances are I might get the project and earn lots of money... and what are the costs? Music? Free. Images? Free. Who would know or even remember? It's just a one time presentation!

    If we don't appreciate or respect someone else's work we hold no value to that product. It would be merely disposable. What we can't take, we'll take something else. We do this until we find something that is "takable".

    Why go to this direction when we could think otherwise, like what we can't take, we do something totally new and then we can use it for ourselves?

    Another example, our movie business here in Malaysia is so bad is because video piracy is such a big problem it drove film studios out of business. It's sad to hear our own people complaining movies produced in our own country is of "poor quality" or low budget, couldn't even compare 1% of Hollywood's standards. What they didn't realize, is that when they bought these "poor quality" locally made movies from pirated vendors, they are killing the industry themselves, hence the reason why it's low budget in the first place! Otherwise how could these studios could get back their investment?

    This same applies to sound developers. I read a thread somewhere that Eric (from Spectrasonics) said he only sold a single licensed copy of Heart of Asia in China! Imagine if everyone in China who has a copy actually bought it from him, I reckon he should have already released Heart of Asia 10!

    In summary, it is the idea of piracy itself, the idea of taking things without asking and the idea of taking short cuts in life that is killing the behaviour to innovate and to be creative in other things of life. Also, it cultivates irresponsibility.

    Lastly, if it is so easy to check whether a piece of music is using licensed samples or not, I welcome the authorities to do so a thorough check here in Malaysia, and at least the people would appreciate the technology they own and by supporting the developers instead of pirates!

    Nothing is cheap, I started composing at very low wages and slowly worked up from there. I didn't own tens of thousands of dollars worth of plugins by just a snap of my finger. All were hard earned money.

    I might be blowing things out of proportion... so please correct me if I'm wrong
    Forget exchange rates. Look at take home pay versus the product cost. That's all that matters. These countries can't afford this stuff even if they wanted it AND I can assure you that they don't, generally, as they have FAR more important priorities on mind eg, where are they going to get food and a roof over their heads.

    You are making the common mistake of imposing western conditions onto the East or South. Generally, these folk couldn't afford this stuff so there are no sales lost anyway. So we need to get of our high, idealistic, horse and try and understand.

    Your arguements are of purely academic interest.

    Frank

  9. #9

    Re: Piracy...

    Quote Originally Posted by animix
    ...........so my copyright/patent/intellectual property should be stolen because I'm not from the thrid world?........I think not.
    Hehe absolutely not. As I said, I was OT:ing...my comment had nothing to do with piracy, but with the previous statement that western countries should not "feel bad" for its wealth...again...OTOTOT


    Quote Originally Posted by Hardy Heern
    It's not great Dan, but I believe that any others, at the time, would have done the same. It is defensible in that sense. Otherwise I agree. Times change, standards change, scruples and morals change too.
    Alright...I won't go deeper into this...but yeah...I mostly agree with you too. I just had to raise my voice at your post in defence of all the wannabe politically/morally correct people out there

    Cheers!
    /Daniel Beckman

  10. #10

    Re: Piracy...

    It's a question, which seems to arise a good few too many times. Piracy... I don't like it, even if I've used pirated stuff (knowingly OR un-knowingly in the past), let's all be honest, we've all used something pirated... if you haven't, then... good on you, but for a start, it's a vital part of our society... if it suddently ceased to exist, millions of people would be out of a job... and so much funding to things which ultimately fund other things, even legitamite, have come from dirty sources. Anyway, to cut a long story short... I don't think it's the right "path" (if you can call it that, even though that sounds somehow religious... and I'm an open minded and non religious man by nature) but it's a fundamental part of society at the moment. Just think of how awful the world would be if all the petty crimes were eliminated... we'd be forced to face up to the fact that people's beliefs are so different and so stuck sometimes... and people would end up fighting, with nothing else to concentrate their attention to; a radical suggestion, of course, but... everywhere I go I seem to see pirating as something that's wrong... and as someone who is, right now, completely legitimate in every sound library and song, etc. that I ow, I think people go over the top to try and appease someone who isn't listening; some kind of authority. If anyone didn't understand something I said, feel free to PM me... I'm quite, quite bored!

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