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Topic: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Nigel W's Avatar
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    Angry really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    I'm just checking out A.I.R, a pretty decent and useful library, based on Kontakt Player 2.

    But it's not even possible to edit attack and release envelopes!! There are a few preset modulation routings, but absolutely none of the basic editing functions to shape the sound.

    I thought the Kompakt Instruments, with their fiddly browser and almost nonexistent modulation routings, were poorly specified, but this is even worse!

    I mean, is this progress? Every hardware synth I've ever owned allowed you to edit envelopes to shape the sound. We are being forced to remain preset-bashers, because the current libraries in Kompakt (and to some extent Kontakt) are impossible, or so unfriendly, to edit.

    Give me exs24 with its easy tweakability any day of the week. It hasn't had an update for years, but you can do a lot with it, and you don't have to squint to load a patch, either.

    Nigel

  2. #2

    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Yeah, I really gotta agree here. I can't BELIEVE that I don't even have a amplitude envelope in A.I.R.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Nigel W's Avatar
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    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    I know everybody will say "just load the instruments in Kontakt2". Of course, that works.

    But it's *not* a comfortable or fast way to work. Using the players' menu structure is the quickest way to get around that structure. The full Kontakt2 option is no justification for thinly-specced players.

    Besides, it's kind of rude to the customer: "oh yeah, the car you bought only does left turns, sorry- if you want to make a right, you need to buy our Pro Steering Upgrade, it works really well"!!!

    Another thing: Keyswitches. The player could easily display the currently selected Keyswitch. Would save having to look in the manual. There are many, many small improvements which could be made, but when I look at the "new" Kompakt player, it's even less flexible than the Kompkat instruments!!

    I think NI is a great company: FM7, Absynth, you name it. But these Kompakt & Kontakt players are just a cheap way to copy-protect the material. Let's not pretend they're anything anybody thinks is great to work with. Shame on the sample producers for allowing NI to make such a lousy product a market leader.

    Nigel

  4. #4

    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel W
    I know everybody will say "just load the instruments in Kontakt2". Of course, that works.
    No it doesn't! So far, the only Garritan instrument designed for Kontakt Player 2 (Stradivari 2) can not be customised any more in Kontakt 2 than it can in Kontakt Player 2.

  5. #5

    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Yes, their previous players were awful, and stopped me buying libraries based on their player. Terrible interface. I hoped with this new one, they might have improved matters - sounds just as bad.

  6. #6

    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickie Fønshauge
    No it doesn't! So far, the only Garritan instrument designed for Kontakt Player 2 (Stradivari 2) can not be customised any more in Kontakt 2 than it can in Kontakt Player 2.
    I think it's a developper' s option do let users load the sounds in Kontakt in other word to lock the door or not.Chris Hein Guitar (really amazing BTW ) comes with Kontakt player 2 but you can load the sounds in Kontakt.

  7. #7

    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Quote Originally Posted by jazzobizz
    I think it's a developper' s option do let users load the sounds in Kontakt in other word to lock the door or not.Chris Hein Guitar (really amazing BTW ) comes with Kontakt player 2 but you can load the sounds in Kontakt.
    That's right. This is a design decision made by the developer. Unfortunately there seems to be a growing trend towards take-it-or-leave-it virtual instruments, where all parameters are locked according to the developers decisions. No more end user tweaking and experimentation VSL apparently did it with Vienna Instruments, Garritan did it with Stradivari 2, and it seems EastWest is on their way to do it with their own Player software. Soon to be gone are the golden days of sample libraries, that can be tweaked to the end users satisfaction.

  8. #8

    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Its not NI to blame, its always the developer who allows edits or not.
    Kontakt Player2 has the same engine as kontakt2. So, the player has all the edit features kontakt has.
    BUT, the developer has to program edit buttons or controllers for every single feature.
    CHG has 98 midi controllers and a lot of buttons and sliders to edit various functions. (but no ADSR)
    There was a bug in K2 concerning the automation of ADSR, thats why I had to leave it out.

    As far as I know, all KP2 Libraries run in K2, but the developer has the choice to lock the edit features in kontakt.
    CHG has all edit features unlocked, except the scripting.
    This means you can remap the samples, combine them with others, and save them, whatever you like.
    You just can not edit the raw samples.

    Another advantage of the Player system is, its quite easy to do updates.
    So, you could ask the developer to program attack, or anything you wish in the script.

    Chris Hein
    Chris Hein - Horns / Chris Hein - Guitars / Chris Hein - Bass
    http://www.chrishein.net

  9. #9
    Senior Member Nigel W's Avatar
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    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Thanks Chris, that's really useful information.

    If a developer allows their KP instruments to load & be edited in Kontakt, the copy protection remains intact, doesn't it? in other words, you can only load the samples into Kontakt if the Player is authorized on that particular computer?

    The reason I ask is because if this is so, there is no real justification for the "closed-system" Player libraries.

    Thanks

    Nigel

  10. #10

    Re: really fed up with *all* Kontakt/Kompakt Players!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel W
    Thanks Chris, that's really useful information.

    If a developer allows their KP instruments to load & be edited in Kontakt, the copy protection remains intact, doesn't it? in other words, you can only load the samples into Kontakt if the Player is authorized on that particular computer?
    Exactly.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel W
    The reason I ask is because if this is so, there is no real justification for the "closed-system" Player libraries.
    Thats why I like this system.
    As developer you can lock or unlock any control parameter, the script and editing in kontakt.
    So, its not that "Closed"
    If you compare it to systems like Real Guitar, VSL, or Spectrasonics instruments which are all great software,
    kontakt libraries can have the same functionality, but more open than a specially written software.

    I don't know why people often talk so bad about NI.
    Ok, they always have some bugs in their products, but i think its the most innovative company with the most product output at the moment.

    Chris Hein
    Chris Hein - Horns / Chris Hein - Guitars / Chris Hein - Bass
    http://www.chrishein.net

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