• Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 8 of 8

Topic: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

Share/Bookmark
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    SAN ANTONIO, TX
    Posts
    1,386

    Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    A fuller version with a bit more sound and the new K2 player.

    I seem to have a "phantom sound" toward the end....

    hi-fi URL: http://www.soundclick.com/util/getpl...d=4680056&q=hi

  2. #2

    Re: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    Good interpretation of this, Gary; well done.

    On the sound...

    Edit:

    I originally posted the following. But I think you'd better ignore
    me on this one. Gotta be something with my ears.


    We need better ears on this than mine. I seem to be hearing
    almost a slgiht "flanging" effect on it... ? (Anybody? Or have my
    ears gone south, again?)


    A bit dry, but that's another matter.

    Not quite sure what you meant by the "phantom sound" comment.

    Best,


    David
    www.DavidSosnowski.com
    .

  3. #3

    Re: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    Hi, Gary

    Really nicely detailed recording you've done with this piece. Nice music to work with!

    I don't hear Et Lux's "flanging"--?

    BUT, this sounds completely dry. Reverb is often something I comment on, but it's rare for me to find something too dry. With this, it sounds like you decided to use none, or it's been used So subtly that I can't even tell. The result is an unnatural non-reverberant sound of the sort that can't happen in the real world.

    This really needs a fairly good sized hall reverb, with varying amounts for the different sections, used at your discretion.

    Another technical observation--Generally, I think the prominent soloists were too loud in proportion to the backing instruments. There were times when the orchestra was so ppp that everything but the lead instruments at that moment seemed to fade almost completely out. Just a matter of having a less exaggerated contrast between leads and backing.

    Thanks though--It was impressive to hear the work put into this.

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Wilton, NH
    Posts
    2,450

    Re: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    For the most part the rendering is very well done, but I have to agree with Randy that the amount of reverb is, well, to my ears at least, almost distractingly dry.

    I've noticed in my own use of GPO that sometimes different combinations of mod-wheel and velocity can make a sound much brighter or darker and that as I change dynamics it is occasionally very pronounced. Reverb usually smoothes this out and makes it less noticeable. I did hear this effect a little in this (part of what I meant by so dry its distracting). I wonder if that is what David is hearing....

    I'm sorry if I sound too negative. Overall you did a good job with this.
    Trent P. McDonald

  5. #5

    Re: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    Hey, I remember playing this clarinet part! Thanks for the memories.

    The clarinets did sound phased a bit in the beginning but definitely not (to me) the whole piece. I didn't hear any "phantom sounds" though.

    One thing that stands out is how you've expressively used the controllers (1 & 64) in all the right places, which pretty much makes certain that this would sound great with reverb.

    -Chris
    There is the music of Johann Sebastian Bach. Therefore there must be a God. You either get this one or you don't - Kreeft & Tacelli
    The will to achieve is not sufficient. Some things should not be achieved. - Rimsky-Korsakov
    Musicians are just these guys that want to make music. Okay, they want to have a wonderful lifestyle, but the majority just want to make really great music. - Jon Anderson


  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    SAN ANTONIO, TX
    Posts
    1,386

    Re: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    Hi Randy,
    I used what I thought was the largest room.
    I'm still confused about reverb..l.
    My inteerpretation of parts to bring out reflects my own viewpoint
    from having played this on clarinet. I used dynamic markings to bring out solos, but individual notes seem to blair out occasionally. I know there is still a lot to be learned abou† this. It was a whole lot easier when I didn't have choices...
    Thanks

    Gary

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    SAN ANTONIO, TX
    Posts
    1,386

    Re: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    Hi Trent,
    When you speak about veloci†y & mod-wheel, is there only one set†ing for the piece, or can it be changed when needed?
    When the manual speaks of a mod wheel, is this only about a keyboard
    or does it refer to the Kontact keyboard?
    Thanks,

    Gary

  8. #8

    Re: Elsa' S Procession-wagner

    Hi, Gary

    "...I used what I thought was the largest room.
    I'm still confused about reverb..."


    Hmmm, well then I'm thinking that after choosing the large room reverb setting, that you somehow defeated its effect in the way you set up your rendering/recording. Because there's no reverb on this, as Trent also commented on. Something is wrong in your procedure.

    Take as an objective listen as you can, Gary--doesn't it sound odd, with no aural indicaiton that it's being performed in any kind of venue?

    You said you used dynamic markings for solos, which indicates that you're using notation---I can't keep straight what programs various people use on this Forum, but you're on Sibelius or Finale I would guess.

    Sometimes I feel I need to get and learn a notation program like Finale, at least so I can better understand the challenges people face when using them. Because as it is, I've only used audio/MIDI software like Sonar and Cubase--those are my points of reference.

    Isn't there a way to work with the velocity value on a note by note basis in your program? To insert a dynamic marking, which bumps up the MIDI volume--that is such an extreme minimum of control.--I'm saying I'm still not clear if notation users are able to do the fine tune editing on things like velocity values which are the key to natural sounding playback.

    You asked Trent, but I'd like to reply also:

    "...When you speak about veloci†y & mod-wheel, is there only one set†ing for the piece, or can it be changed when needed?..."

    OH my. The manual does a very good job of stressing the importance of the mod wheel in GPO work. It needs to be a continuously varying stream of data, best recorded in real time with a keyboard's mod wheel. You can Feel how a note needs to fade after its onset, dip down, hover, swoop up--all throughout a piece.

    The mod wheel data, cc1, can be edited extensively also.

    Velocity is how hard a note is played on a velocity sensitive keyboard. The range of value is from 0 to 127. It's amazing what a difference different values can make to the sound, and in instruments like the Strad, they are extremely critical for controlling things like Portamento.

    But again--I'm not clear what the limitations are in notation programs when it comes to this kind of work.

    "...When the manual speaks of a mod wheel, is this only about a keyboard or does it refer to the Kontact keyboard?..."

    The mod wheel in Kontact can be used for checking a level, listening to a chosen instrument etc, but those movements aren't part of your actual recorded project. The mod wheel data which controls your music has to be part of the data stream--and in continuous motion, as described above.

    --Side note question: Where do those mysterious faint "Ts" come from in your text? I keep wondering about that.

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)

Go Back to forum

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •