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Topic: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

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  1. #1

    Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    I appreciated B. J. Morgan's tutorial on getting GPO set up in Garage Band. I have run into a problem which makes me feel like an idiot. I work with Finale, as I am primarily a "classical" composer, and created an audio click track (for a string quartet movement, to get the tempo fluctuations I wanted). I used it as a "real instrument" in GB. No problem.

    Then, I successfully recorded several solo string tracks from GPO to GB (cello & viola). Now: although I can see the tracks graphically, they WILL NOT sound on playback. They appear to have NO volume level in GB. I can hear the click track itself with no problem (the issue not with accidentally muting tracks or soloing only the click track). At a preliminary trial, I did record another GPO instrument, and could hear it on playback, but not being so familiar with the software, I must have done something bad. I appreciate any advice you'd have.

    Thanks, John Newell

  2. #2

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    Hi, John

    I'm not totally clear on the chain of events:

    "...I successfully recorded several solo string tracks from GPO to GB (cello & viola). Now: although I can see the tracks graphically, they WILL NOT sound on playback. They appear to have NO volume level in GB..."

    Are you talking about MIDI tracks, or audio tracks? If they're audio, do you mean you could see the .wav form visuals on the tracks? And what do you mean that you recoded "GPO to GB"--That sounds like you didn't record GPO in GB?

    If they're MIDI tracks, did you record cc1 which is for volume? If not, they'd be silent.

    "...At a preliminary trial, I did record another GPO instrument, and could hear it on playback..."

    This was before your failure with the Cello and Viola tracks? A different instrument from the GPO library, and it was successfully played back in GB?

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)

  3. #3

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    Quote Originally Posted by rbowser-
    Hi, John

    I'm not totally clear on the chain of events:

    "...I successfully recorded several solo string tracks from GPO to GB (cello & viola). Now: although I can see the tracks graphically, they WILL NOT sound on playback. They appear to have NO volume level in GB..."

    Are you talking about MIDI tracks, or audio tracks? If they're audio, do you mean you could see the .wav form visuals on the tracks? And what do you mean that you recoded "GPO to GB"--That sounds like you didn't record GPO in GB?

    If they're MIDI tracks, did you record cc1 which is for volume? If not, they'd be silent.

    "...At a preliminary trial, I did record another GPO instrument, and could hear it on playback..."

    This was before your failure with the Cello and Viola tracks? A different instrument from the GPO library, and it was successfully played back in GB?

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)
    Reply to your questions:

    I recorded MIDI tracks. I recorded GPO in Garage Band. Sorry for the misspelling.

    Re: recording cc1 (volume) Aha!!! I am not sure exactly what you mean. I'm still trying to learn this stuff. Can you explain? This could be the problem. How would I record cc1?

    Before recording viola and cello I recorded some notes using the solo violin KS from GPO, and it successfully played back. I don't know what changed from then to trying the viola and cello.

    Randy, your previous advice about using a sequencer was very sound. Now I need to the sound out of the sequencer!

    Thanks, John

  4. #4

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    Randy, your message helped, in that it led me in the right direction. I hadn't set up the instrument presets correctly in Garage Band, But now they work. It's funny how someone's reply may not give the precise answer for a particular problem, but gives another perspective that helps to lead you to your own solution.

    John

  5. #5

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    Hello again, John

    Thanks for getting some answers in--I think we can get narrow down the problem to one thing now:

    "...Re: recording cc1 (volume) Aha!!! I am not sure exactly what you mean...How would I record cc1?.."

    MIDI continuous controller #1 (cc1) is THE top priority MIDI data that has to be recorded with your tracks--or you won't hear any sound out of GPO! It'd be like having your radio turned on with the volume knob full left and wondering where the sound is.

    For this reply, I went to the Garage Band site and took a quick tour through the program's features, since I've never used it. Search as I did, I couldn't see mention anywhere about MIDI editing in the program. Maybe it's there but it's just not very prominently displayed--? They say there is a Staff View, and that's of some help, but what is really needed for the best kind of MIDI editing is a Piano Roll View in which there's a window where any and all MIDI controllers can be edited.

    Let's hope there's a MIDI editor in the program--But even if there isn't, you can still at least record the cc1 data--It's the data your Modulation Wheel spits out by default. In standard MIDI soft synths, the Mod Wheel is for--Modulation--vibrato. But in GPO, it controls the volume of the instruments and the variations of timbre which occur with volume change.

    John, do you have the hard copy manual that comes with GPO? The most repeated instruction in it is about the absolute necessity of using Mod Wheel data. Starting on page 4, after the intro, there's the first big explanation of how without Mod Wheel data, you're not going to get sound.

    Maybe the problem you've encountered is due to some other routing problem, but since you weren't sure what I meant by cc1--I suspect this is indeed the problem.

    Look in the manual--you will get a very clear picture of how the key element to getting GPO to sounding realistic is to CONStantly be using the Mod Wheel as you record. Hopefully you'll be able to adjust the data you record in some kind of data editing window--but you at least have to be able to record it.

    Some programs, like Sonar, default to a setting where all such MIDI controllers are re-set to zero every time you stop playback in a project. That means that when you push play again, with GPO there's no sound, even if there's cc1 in the track. That option has to be turned off so the instruments will maintain the same level of cc1 as when the playback was stopped. Maybe Garage Band has a similar function where it's turning cc1 off.

    Investigate both in the manual for GPO and for Garage Band and see what you can figure out from what I've outlined here.

    And--best of luck!

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)

    Before recording viola and cello I recorded some notes using the solo violin KS from GPO, and it successfully played back. I don't know what changed from then to trying the viola and cello.

  6. #6

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    John! We were writing at the same time apparently--I just went through my long explanation about cc1, then I saw that you had already figured out that your instruments weren't set up correctly. Well that's good news, that you figured it out!

    The cc1 info will still be helpful.

    Have fun!

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)

  7. #7

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    Randy, your cc1 is helpful. There is MIDI editing capability in Garage Band, and I'm now learning to use it. GB may be all the sequencer I need. I'm now trying to figure out how to get a "default" cc1 setting, i.e. so that when I begin to record a second instrument I can start out at a given setting. It's annoying to have to move the Mod Wheel around to get to the same starting point that the other instruments use.

    Thanks again.

  8. #8

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    Hi, John--Glad the stuff I posted was of some help.

    I've noticed recent posts about a problem in Garage Band which is kind of a big drag--it sees the Kontact Player as being on one MIDI channel, which means you have to have separate instances for each instrument. Wow--that's quite a handicap. --I guess I'm not sure if this problem is true of both the old Kontact and the new KP2.

    "...I'm now trying to figure out how to get a "default" cc1 setting, i.e. so that when I begin to record a second instrument I can start out at a given setting. It's annoying to have to move the Mod Wheel around to get to the same starting point that the other instruments use..."

    Wrestling with the initial cc1 volumes for instruments is something everyone hassles with at first. In Sonar, I have orchestral templates to load in my Kontacts, and it includes the mod wheel being pushed up full on all the instruments--I don't know if you can do that in GB--Well, a template with a full set of woodwinds (for example) in one player isn't possible, if what I said above is true for your Kontact--of needing separate instances for each instrument.

    But when you're setting up the instruments you want in your Kontacts, it's a good habit to push that virtual mod wheel up full with your mouse. I do it without even thinking anymore. BUT if GB has a "zero controllers" kind of setting like I described Sonar as having, then it will still turn cc1 off every time you stop. If you encounter that kind of constant re-setting to zero problem, look around for a way to turn that off in GB.

    It also helps to have a blank opening measure or two in your projects. When you go to add your other tracks, you start record at the top, move your keyboard's wheel up, and you're set with a starting volume for the track.

    But you can't ever totally rely on real-time recording, as intuitive and natural as that approach is--You will always need to be getting into whatever MIDI editing windows you have and adjusting things. --Tweaking the cc1 values polishes off your work, along with tweaking velocities and all the other controllers.

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)

  9. #9

    Re: Playback of GPO tracks in Garage Band

    Hi John,

    Gary Garritan asked me to try and help. There are several issues that might cause GPO to go quiet on you in GarageBand. One is already mentioned above regarding the cc1 switching. But there are others.

    First, make sure you have some sort of modulation setting on your tracks. If it is stuck in zero, you will hear nothing.

    Check your track volume to make sure it is up. There is a little triangle on the track that you can click to view your automated volume levels. When in doubt, create a new track and copy your Midi region to the new track.

    You may want to look over these tutorials. (focus on mixing your song tutorial)
    http://www.apple.com/ilife/tutorials...and/index.html

    Feel free to contact me at rickonline@verizon.net

    Rick Schneblin
    Garritan on GarageBand '08 using Intel iMac with 1.5G RAM
    Listen to my collection here

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