Tremolo length

**chesterdesmond** · 07-19-2007, 01:24 PM

In a piece I am working on I would like to have a fairly lengthy gradual buildup of cello played with the trem. articulation. From a realism perspective, how long would a player be able to continue doing this? Is it common to use this style of playing for extended passages? I find it a lot more "menacing" than a bowed note.

Thanks

Todd

**Raymond62** · 07-20-2007, 06:56 AM

Looked in an Orchestration book. No limit is stated there.
I think it can last until:

RSI comes in;

He/She gets tired.

Don't overdo this. Only in Romantic music it had its function for a longer duration. In today's music hardly used...... according to that book I mentioned, but ... it is fully free to use it.

http://www.hberlioz.com/Scores/Berli...se.html#Violin

.. has very little on tremolo for strings.....

Raymond

**Skysaw** · 07-20-2007, 07:54 AM

Originally Posted by Raymond62

In today's music hardly used

All the more reason to break it out, I say!

**chesterdesmond** · 07-20-2007, 09:04 AM

Thanks guys! Appreciate the info and the research.

All the more reason to break it out, I say!

I like the way you think

**kanazo** · 07-20-2007, 02:30 PM

this is not really related to the length of tremelo, but is it possible to imitate "sul pont." (at the bridge) effect in GPO tremelo strs?

**chesterdesmond** · 07-20-2007, 03:03 PM

Thanks for the post Tom; if you (or anyone) has any other suggestions for "dark and evil" techniques please post them.

Also thanks Raymond for the Berlioz link.. Some good info there.
I had a good laugh at this (from the bass drum section)

No need to add that in this system the bass drum is almost never used without the accompaniment of cymbals, as though these two instruments were by their nature inseparable. In some orchestras both instruments are even played by one and the same musician: one of the cymbals is fixed to the bass drum, so the player can strike it with the other cymbal in his left hand, while the right hand wields the bass drum’s stick. This cost-cutting method is intolerable: the cymbals lose their sonority in this way and can only make a noise similar to the dropping of a bag full of metal junk and broken glass. This is trivial, and devoid of pomp and splendour. It is just good enough to set monkeys dancing and to accompany the tricks of conjurers, jugglers and swallowers of swords and snakes on public squares and at the dirtiest of cross-roads.

**reberclark** · 07-20-2007, 08:37 PM

The Berlioz Orchestration book is one of the best, and funniest, out there. I think Dover reprints it.

**reberclark** · 07-21-2007, 04:33 PM

I agree about the historicity of the Berlioz. The Blatter is excellent as is the Kennan (which is what I recommend for current studies). I was just commenting on the Berlioz mentioned earlier. A few more to mention: Piston (ancient and curmudgeonly), Garcia's Contemporary Composer and Arranger (straight info and small), Lang's Scoring for Band (a dated but usuable wind resource), Mancini's Sounds and Scores (kinda commerical but has some very decent advice). Don't forget to consult your ears and your imagination as well! Happy scoring.

**Skysaw** · 07-21-2007, 05:48 PM

Originally Posted by Prince of Music

For anyone looking for a serious orchestration book that covers pretty much everything to the present, the best by far is the Blatter. It's not cheep (as I remember I got mine for about 70 bucks on amazon, but then it is a textbook and all present day students know how crazy those prices have gotten.

I use the Blatter as well. I had to pick it up when taking Orchestration in conservatory. I think it's out of print now.

**shirrefs** · 08-20-2007, 10:48 PM

I came to this thread with a query about tremolo, but was thrilled to get some good directions on orchestration books. I have the Adler and an old Dover printing of Cecil Forsyth's 'Orchestration', which is dated, but not having any serious formal training, I learnt a lot from his straightforward writing when I bought it about 20 years ago. But the Blatter sounds very interesting. However, is there a good and not overly pompous text, perhaps more encyclopaedic, that deals just with the art of notation? Just more of a reference that you can grab to quickly get a grip on some of the nuances and conventions? Though I have to say that what would be REALLY helpful would be if someone could write a text that deals with the (ever changing) tension between the theory of notation and the complications of interfacing notation software with MIDI apps.

But the main question I wanted to ask about tremolo - and this relates to what was said earlier about long passages of tremolo - how do I soften the attack of individual notes when the tremolo is meant to flow smoothly across a melody line? This is when I'm trying to replay a score off Overture. At the moment, every note starts with an attack that's is quite alarming, even thought there seems to be a controller for Sustain set within the tremolo command. So the tremolo is certainly switching in and out as it ought, it just lacks a certain gentle flow. Is it a matter of adjusting the envelope? And can that be done with external controls from Overture?

Cheers