• Register
  • Help
Results 1 to 6 of 6

Topic: Computer Generated Solos?

Share/Bookmark
  1. #1

    Computer Generated Solos?

    Quote Originally Posted by rbowser-
    One suggestion here I have to confess made me wince, "...as for the solos Band in a Box is very useful for generating Jazz solos - you enter in the chords for the song and BIAB can generate decient solos..." - Oh I hope you don't do that. What's the fun in pushing a button to generate music that can be so exciting to develop on your own? Those robo-solos could very well be good for inspiration and for offering some technical guidance, but not for actually coming up with what you leave in your recording.--That's my feeling on that anyway.
    (rbowser)
    So as not to Hijack sosmus's listening room posting and I think this is an interesting topic on it's own I'm replying to Randy here.

    Randy,

    I think it's a matter of the recording's use. If it's for a CD I would agree that a BIAB or other computer generated solo would not be a good choice. But I don't think a keyboard played or manually entered Sax, Trumpet etc solo would cut it either. You would probably want a solo played by live Brass or Reed player.

    If the recording is for a mockup or to sell an arrangement I think a generated solo is fine. BIAB gives a fair amount of control over the generated solo allowing degrees of melody use, outside playing and soloist style. I know for me being a drummer I could not come close to BIAB's output playing a Sax solo on a keyboard. Also anything keyboard entered will require a lot of time tweaking that a mockup scenario probably wouldn't justify.

    just my 2 cents

    Mike

  2. #2

    Re: Computer Generated Solos?

    Hi, Mike - It's a really good topic, and that was a good move to open it up here in the General Discussion Forum instead of "...Hijack(ing) sosmus's listening room posting..."

    Everything you're saying here makes clear sense to me, to be sure. Thanks for expanding on what you brought up on the other thread.

    I have perhaps a not-typical feeling about what makes for a "legitimate" recording - I'm not concerned to the same degree as a lot of people about how "real" a recording sounds. I think a hybrid result of naturalism and decidedly synthetic sound makes for the more interesting recordings, so I would, for instance, find a keyboard rendition of a Sax solo to be more than just acceptable as a final result.

    Considering the gymnastics the most detail-oriented notation users have to go through to breathe the most musicality out of charts, I do think that music which is actually played into a DAW more often results in the most organic work. It's only logical that music which is played is more often going to have the "humanistic" touch everyone wants to hear in recordings.

    I want to stress though that some very clever and creative people manage to get very organic sounding results with notation programs - it's just that most people aren't willing to spend quite as much time to get those kind of results.

    But it still comes down to a gut-reaction thing with me, I guess. I think that utilities like the "instant solo" one in BIAB you're describing can be great learning tools, generating lines to be studied on a composer's way towards coming up with his own work. I just have a lot of discomfort about cut-and-paste work and computer-generated lines. It's just not the way I personally want to work.

    Your points are all solid and logical. And naturally, we all work in the way that's most rewarding for ourselves.

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)

  3. #3

    Re: Computer Generated Solos?

    Hi, everyone, I haven't been around much for the last few weeks due to other commitments. So here's one for composers who have demands on their time! I post it here rather than in the Listening Room because it's not my own composition! This is from Band-in-a-Box, which now has a feature called "Soundtrack" where it'll generate 100% of the music for you -- chords, melodies, everything. The BIAB publicity says it's intended for soundtracks for corporate videos, etc., where they want music in the background, but no one will actually listen to the music. This was generated by one of the "New Age" settings in BIAB. I exported the generated composition to MIDI then rendered it in Sonar/GPO:

    http://www.box.net/shared/138by3rim4

    For some reason it doesn't play in the box.net player. You have to Open it and let Windows Media Player, etc., play it.
    Vista / Sonar Home Studio 6 / GPO 2d edition / Melodyne Uno 1.8

  4. #4
    Senior Member rwayland's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    California Redwoods
    Posts
    2,938

    Re: Computer Generated Solos?

    Quote Originally Posted by rbowser-
    ...

    I want to stress though that some very clever and creative people manage to get very organic sounding results with notation programs - it's just that most people aren't willing to spend quite as much time to get those kind of results. ...

    Randy B.
    (rbowser)
    Very important point, Randy. So much depends on your intentions when creating the sounds. I generally intend to create a reasonable facsimile of a live performance as a demo, not as a final recording for a CD. Nitpicking, tweaking, whatever, can take a tremendous amount of time, easily more than the composing. My intent is always to compose, not to spend so much time on audio tweaking.

    Richard

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    NW Illinois
    Posts
    1,175

    Re: Computer Generated Solos?

    My first reaction to this is similiar to Randy's. The thought of a computer generated solo makes me cringe.

    But I suppose the desired use for this demo does dictate whether a BIAB solo would be appropriate. I remember back to playing in jazz band in high school, where the music publisher notated an improvised solo along with the chord symbols. If the player didn't feel comfortable improvising on their own, they could play the written solo. It's not really jazz that way, but in certain situations it's the best solution. I can view BIAB solos the same, under certain situations their usage is acceptable, but a real solo is always preferred.

    JT

  6. #6

    Re: Computer Generated Solos?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Turner
    But I suppose the desired use for this demo does dictate whether a BIAB solo would be appropriate.
    Quote Originally Posted by rwayland
    Nitpicking, tweaking, whatever, can take a tremendous amount of time, easily more than the composing. My intent is always to compose, not to spend so much time on audio tweaking.
    Jeff, Richard

    I agree I think the demo's use against time and ability should be the determinig factor. There is a direct correlation with the quality of solos BIAB generates and user input parameters - so it's not a matter of pushing a button to create a solo but more of a users musicianship. With the advances in sampler technology and midi humanization techniques I think we're getting close to creating demos that blur the distinction between real or sampled / computer generated. For demos for mock-ups and even some soundtracks I think a good computer generated solo is acceptable and depending on a persons ability or budget may be perferable. I can generate far better BIAB solos then I could ever play into a sequencer. And like Richard I don't have the time or patience to spend endless hours tweaking a piece and I think "composing" a solo would yield worse results then BIAB not to mention the time expenditure.

    Mike

Go Back to forum

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •