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Topic: Well, what the heck are these notes?

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  1. #1
    Senior Member Leaf's Avatar
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    Well, what the heck are these notes?

    I have a score here that has some notes i have never seen before, and i'm am still learning to read music so don't know if it is an engravers mistake or if there are really notes like this.

    It's by Federick Delius, written in 1890, published by Boosey & Hawkes

    In 4/4, starting at measure number 82 on the staves for 1st and 2nd Violins and on the stave for Violas, there are four notes per measure, no rests, so i would think they would be Quarter Notes, but they are two pairs beamed (looking like eighth notes in 2/4 time) and the note heads are not blacked out, so the note head looks like the head of half note.

    ????????????

    What are they?


    David

  2. #2

    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    Tremolos. They're like trills, except it can happen between any pitch like D to Ab.
    Anthony Abruscato

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  3. #3
    Senior Member Leaf's Avatar
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    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    Thanks Raz! Very cool... tremelos that can be between any pitch.
    I see, they start out one step apart then a third then a fourth.

    Learn something new everyday.

    Ern, no there was nothing, no dots or articulations or anything, unlike all the others i guess all the info was hidden in those funny noteheads and beams.

    edit: but there are slurs across the whole measure.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Leaf's Avatar
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    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    Now i have to figure out how to make them, so Finale Human playback will do that.

  5. #5

    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    I agree with raz.

    When you notate a tremolo, you *double* the rhythmic value. That's why you have four 'half-notes' in a 4/4 measure.

    If they're beamed with a single line, you would alternate between the first and second notes as if they were eighth notes, for a duration on one half-note. Then you would proceed to the second grouping. If you wanted 16th notes, you would add a second line (often *not* connected to the stems).

    The main reason for this is just to save everybody a lot of work, ink, and paper.

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    Senior Member Leaf's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    Quote Originally Posted by klassical
    I agree with raz.

    When you notate a tremolo, you *double* the rhythmic value. That's why you have four 'half-notes' in a 4/4 measure.

    If they're beamed with a single line, you would alternate between the first and second notes as if they were eighth notes, for a duration on one half-note. Then you would proceed to the second grouping. If you wanted 16th notes, you would add a second line (often *not* connected to the stems).

    The main reason for this is just to save everybody a lot of work, ink, and paper.

    - k
    Thanks for that info, Klassical. So i should write it in Finale with eighth notes for the HP to read it? Four alternating the first two and then four alternating the second two?

  7. #7

    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    David, there is a plugin in Finale that will automatically create the tremolos for you, and HumanPlayback will recognize the notation and play it back for you as well.

    When you see notes like that, simply take ONE of the two notes as the "base value". So in this case, you have two linked "half notes", well, that's the equivalent of one half note. Just write the two notes of the interval as half of whatever value is written there, in your case that would be two quarters. The plugin will add the beams, and change the noteheads to the hollow halfnote note heads.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Leaf's Avatar
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    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    Quote Originally Posted by qccowboy
    David, there is a plugin in Finale that will automatically create the tremolos for you, and HumanPlayback will recognize the notation and play it back for you as well.

    When you see notes like that, simply take ONE of the two notes as the "base value". So in this case, you have two linked "half notes", well, that's the equivalent of one half note. Just write the two notes of the interval as half of whatever value is written there, in your case that would be two quarters. The plugin will add the beams, and change the noteheads to the hollow halfnote note heads.
    Michel, I found it, Easy Tremelos 3.20. I will give that a whirl, thanks very much!!

  9. #9
    Senior Member Leaf's Avatar
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    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ernstinen
    Leaf, I just looked in my orchestration book and that is correct.

    I'm just not sure if alternating between two eighth notes is really called "tremolo," though. "Tremolo" is a RAPID repetition of a note, or between two notes. I know that's being picky, but normally a tremolo is played as fast as possible.

    Just wonderin' ---

    Ern
    I tried that temolo plugin that Michel told me about and it works well, and does sound like eighth notes. I put two bars on a measure just to check out how that would sound, and HP read that also. I think some very old works had tremolos that were kinda slow, like Bach, if that's what they were.

  10. #10

    Re: Well, what the heck are these notes?

    just to add a bit of detail: there are two distinct kinds of temolo. there is measured tremolo and unmeasured tremolo. The former would be more likely in a slow tempo and is usually a short-hand for a series of 8th or 16th notes. While the latter is generally seen in moderate to more rapid tempos, and are, well, unmeasured.

    Just to be sure, if you want an unmeasured tremolo in a slow tempo, you can notate as in the example above in this thread, however, add the notation "trem." just to be sure your musicians won't try and play a measured tremolo.

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