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Topic: Feedback on Track

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  1. #1

    Feedback on Track

    Hi All,
    I was hoping I cound get some feedback on this demo track I did for someone. It wasn't what he was looking for and he said it sounded too "keyboardish". Now I am assuming he means it's too synthetic sounding and not sounding like a real orchestra.

    The track is called "The Intruder" and can be heard on my myspace page: http://www.myspace.com/scorewritermusicproductions

    I've composed and arranged before, and have a good grasp of the usual music stuff: melody, harmony, orchestration, etc., but only have dealt with live instruments. So I'm fairly new to recording with samples, so any feedback on how to make my tracks sound more realistic would be appreciated.


    Here's is what I used for this:
    Sonic Implants Strings (in Gigastudio 3.0 Orch)
    Oboe and Flute from GPO
    Cubase 4 on Intel Mac to record and produce
    -Used one of the included reverb and EQ plug-ins with Cubase

    Thanks,
    Mike

  2. #2
    Senior Member Steve_Karl's Avatar
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    Re: Feedback on Track

    I agree. The legato strings sound a bit like a church organ. Dynamics seem to be what is missing most. Think of how the bow works on the strings swelling a bit as it gets closer to the center of the bow.

    Also I'd make sure to not be playing chords but playing each individual string parts, 1 at a time.

    The wwinds ... dynamics might also help there, A slight crescendo and then decrescendo across the length of the held note.

    I think the main problem is the legato part.
    I'd first try separating the bass and cello by 1 more octave, or maybe use the GPO strings.
    From what I'm hearing the GPO samples should ~sound~ much more realistic.

    The marcato strings on beats 2 and 3 ( or 3 and 5 depending ) are pretty good. Just a tad bright ( eq ) for my taste, and not as thick as I'd like.

    Interesting moody piece ... all in all. I wish it was longer.

  3. #3

    Re: Feedback on Track

    My first thought is that you have some very exposed writing. Although samples are getting better and better they generally still do best in fuller orchestrations, where the imperfections in each line are hidden by more realistic moments in others.

  4. #4

    Re: Feedback on Track

    Quote Originally Posted by mbreidegam
    Hi All,
    I was hoping I cound get some feedback on this demo track I did for someone. It wasn't what he was looking for and he said it sounded too "keyboardish". Now I am assuming he means it's too synthetic sounding and not sounding like a real orchestra.

    The track is called "The Intruder" and can be heard on my myspace page: http://www.myspace.com/scorewritermusicproductions

    I've composed and arranged before, and have a good grasp of the usual music stuff: melody, harmony, orchestration, etc., but only have dealt with live instruments. So I'm fairly new to recording with samples, so any feedback on how to make my tracks sound more realistic would be appreciated.


    Here's is what I used for this:
    Sonic Implants Strings (in Gigastudio 3.0 Orch)
    Oboe and Flute from GPO
    Cubase 4 on Intel Mac to record and produce
    -Used one of the included reverb and EQ plug-ins with Cubase

    Thanks,
    Mike
    I saw 4 tracks loaded on your profile, but non of them is called "the Intruder" though!

  5. #5

    Re: Feedback on Track

    Quote Originally Posted by mbreidegam
    -Used one of the included reverb and EQ plug-ins with Cubase
    That's probably the big problem right there.. your piece sounds too dry.. those built in reverbs are never very good as they don't do early reflections most times. Sonic Implants strings are probably the best to use in exposed situations like that, but even those I wouldn't use without convolution as they would sound bad.

    For this kind of work you really should be using a convolution reverb like Altiverb or Voxengo Pristine Space. It'll make a HUGE difference in the realism. Giga 3 Orchestra comes with GigaPulse which is a good convolution reverb but it could be tricky to route your Garritan stuff through that.

  6. #6

    Re: Feedback on Track

    Quote Originally Posted by dalek3
    That's probably the big problem right there.. your piece sounds too dry.. those built in reverbs are never very good as they don't do early reflections most times. ......
    Oops,

    you can get very good results with the included effects in Cubase.

    For the early reflection open a first reverbeffect (as insert of a group or directly at the instrument track), and then another reverbeffect as a send effect (or insert) in another group... for the Room/Hall.


    Gunther
    "Music is the shorthand of emotion." Leo Tolstoy

    Listen to me, tuning my triangle http://www.box.net/shared/ae822u6r3i

  7. #7

    Re: Feedback on Track

    Hi Mike,

    Well, there are serveral things to mention..

    1. the line of the basses should have more phrasings. Meaning the line lacks of direction. Try to use more cresendi and decrescendi, without overdoing it.

    2. the room seems extremly dry to me. This can be good, but here it seems too much out of the box.

    3. the staccatos of the strings, it is a nice idea, but they sound indeed, as if you just hit some keys on the keyboard. Try to use differents sounds, for the staccato (violas, and 2 different staccatos for the violins). The staccatos themselves don't sound as crisp as they should. Here should simply use other samples, if possible. The velocity (how hard you hit the key) seems a little bit random, too. Try to rework note by note, will they all play forte? Or will the velocity increase or decrease?

    4. To get a warmer sound, you could doulble all of the parts with woodwinds, maybe light brass, and some percussions here and there. Don't forget to draw different phrasings for all of them!

    Hope this helps a bit, it is a long way to go (for all of us) -- so keep it up!

  8. #8

    Re: Feedback on Track

    Quote Originally Posted by germancomponist
    you can get very good results with the included effects in Cubase.

    For the early reflection open a first reverbeffect (as insert of a group or directly at the instrument track), and then another reverbeffect as a send effect (or insert) in another group... for the Room/Hall.
    Not the same as having a good convolution verb IMO.. and Pristine Space is a dirt cheap convolution verb.

  9. #9

    Re: Feedback on Track

    Quote Originally Posted by PROTOOLSGUY
    I saw 4 tracks loaded on your profile, but non of them is called "the Intruder" though!
    It was actually listed as the 6th track. I moved it up to the first one, so it should visible w/o scrolling.

  10. #10

    Re: Feedback on Track

    Quote Originally Posted by germancomponist
    Oops,

    you can get very good results with the included effects in Cubase.

    For the early reflection open a first reverbeffect (as insert of a group or directly at the instrument track), and then another reverbeffect as a send effect (or insert) in another group... for the Room/Hall.


    Gunther
    Gunther,
    Thanks for the input. I may indeed just try to get my hands on Altiverb, like suggested, but in the meantime I'd like to try your suggestion.
    I think I understand what you are getting at with having reverbs on individual tracks and then one on a send. Obviously the insert reverb is going to have different setting than the one on the send. Any suggestions as to the settings for each (insert vs send effect)?

    Thanks

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