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Topic: quick mix for critique/suggestions

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  1. #1

    quick mix for critique/suggestions

    I have had my GPO on the shelf for a couple years now because I never had a control surface to adjust the parameters and using a mouse was just too much work and hard to get things to sound natural.

    Well, I finally got a control surface, so I figured I'd try my hand at GPO again to see what I could come up with. I started this song this weekend, and this is what I have so far. I'm just writing as I record.

    I'm hoping for some critiques/suggestions on whether or not my instruments sound "real" and what I can do to make them sound more real. Please be as critical as possible. I want to be able to get my songs to sound as real as possible.

    http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/122815/orchTestMixdown2.mp3

    Updated version: http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/122815/orchTestMixdown5.mp3
    Boz Millar

  2. #2

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    Well, I'm not terribly skilled at using GPO, and you appear to be a more accomplished composer than I, but I didn't hear anything to criticize. The composition itself is quite promising, and I would like to hear the rest when you complete it. As to the rendering, it sounded very realistic to me.

  3. #3

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    I think you did a very nice job. One suggestion that I've picked up from our forum's best mixer is EQing the low strings. If you solo your low strings and listen you'll hear some pretty heavy overtones - mainly the fifth and octave over the root. What I would do is raise the level on the root just a tad and bring down the most overpowering overtones. I would just focus on the root note in the ostinato and you'll surprised at how much more "punch" you'll get. If you want just send me audio files of only the low strings and I'll show you what I mean. Hope this helps.

    ***EDIT - I actually just plugged your piece into Logic and there were quite a few really glaring overtones. You were getting whole new notes when the string sections were combined. I erased the ones that were the worst, but since I only had master track it meant that while fixing the problems of some instruments it hurt the sound of others. If you're interested in this sned me a PM and I'll give you some more info and send you the file after I did some really simple EQing so you can hear what I'm talking about.
    -Keith Fuller

    http://keithfullermusic.com
    ---
    iMac Quad i7 * MacBook Pro * Logic Studio 9 * WD 320GB & 1TB Externals@7,200RPM * Presonus Firebox * M-Audio Axiom 25 & Keystation 61 * Rode NT1-A * Epiphone Hollowbody * Fender Amp * KRK Rokit 8's

  4. #4

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by keithjfuller View Post
    I think you did a very nice job. One suggestion that I've picked up from our forum's best mixer is EQing the low strings. If you solo your low strings and listen you'll hear some pretty heavy overtones - mainly the fifth and octave over the root. What I would do is raise the level on the root just a tad and bring down the most overpowering overtones. I would just focus on the root note in the ostinato and you'll surprised at how much more "punch" you'll get. If you want just send me audio files of only the low strings and I'll show you what I mean. Hope this helps.
    Hey, thanks. I'll give that a shot when I get home tonight, if my wife lets me. The basses and the cello feel a little too "different" to me in this song, and I'm wondering if that will help it out.

    thanks.
    Boz Millar

  5. #5

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    I actually just posted what I did to it here. But first let me explain.

    I took your master track and EQed some of the most prominent overtones that were mudding up the sound, and I also raised the root pitch of the basses for some added kick. Now keep in mind that to fix some of the problems it had unintended consequences on other sounds - this is simply because I had everything on one track, and I'm not expert mixer by any means.

    So what you'll hear is a before and after EQing on each section. It starts with your version then switches to mine on every section since each section repeats itself once. Basically this:

    Rough Times - but you should be able to hear it.
    Start - No EQ
    0:07 - EQ
    0:10 - No EQ
    0:13 - EQ
    0:16 - No EQ
    0:19 - EQ
    0:21 - No EQ
    0:24 - EQ
    0:26 - No EQ
    0:29 - EQ
    -Keith Fuller

    http://keithfullermusic.com
    ---
    iMac Quad i7 * MacBook Pro * Logic Studio 9 * WD 320GB & 1TB Externals@7,200RPM * Presonus Firebox * M-Audio Axiom 25 & Keystation 61 * Rode NT1-A * Epiphone Hollowbody * Fender Amp * KRK Rokit 8's

  6. #6

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    I like what you have. I would suggest playing with the EQ's and maybe pan the instruments a little wider but..................................

    .................................I do symphonic arena rock n roll so don't pay too much attention to what I say or would do.

    This sounds like something I would add some rock n roll to.


    Good luck with the wife and recording.



    Been there, done that.
    Producer ~ Sound Engineer ~ Musician

    http://www.myspace.com/451525581

  7. #7

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by Hippie View Post
    I like what you have. I would suggest playing with the EQ's and maybe pan the instruments a little wider but..................................

    .................................I do symphonic arena rock n roll so don't pay too much attention to what I say or would do.

    This sounds like something I would add some rock n roll to.


    Good luck with the wife and recording.



    Been there, done that.
    Eh, I'm actually a metalhead and guitarer myself, as seen by the other song I'm working on right now here, but that's a topic for another thread. I figured it would be fun to take a crack at composing to try to get more variety in my production style. My next song will most likely be some form of a rock song backed by a GPO orchestra, so I should at least pay some attention to what you are saying right?

    I'm throwing this song together as practice to get a feel for some of the quirks and controls of GPO and how to best utilize some of the controls that I might not know about.
    Boz Millar

  8. #8

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by keithjfuller View Post
    I actually just posted what I did to it here. But first let me explain.

    I took your master track and EQed some of the most prominent overtones that were mudding up the sound, and I also raised the root pitch of the basses for some added kick. Now keep in mind that to fix some of the problems it had unintended consequences on other sounds - this is simply because I had everything on one track, and I'm not expert mixer by any means.

    So what you'll hear is a before and after EQing on each section. It starts with your version then switches to mine on every section since each section repeats itself once. Basically this:

    Rough Times - but you should be able to hear it.
    Start - No EQ
    0:07 - EQ
    0:10 - No EQ
    0:13 - EQ
    0:16 - No EQ
    0:19 - EQ
    0:21 - No EQ
    0:24 - EQ
    0:26 - No EQ
    0:29 - EQ
    I see what you're getting at with this, but I feel your eq settings are a bit extreme in this example. You have convinced me however that I do need to apply some eq to get a bigger sound. Hopefully my machine can handle a million instances of eq plugs without crashing.
    Boz Millar

  9. #9

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    I agree that they are extreme, but that was the point. I wasn't suggesting that it sound how I have it. It was merely to show you what I was talking about.

    One thing that I've noticed is that this effect is usually much more pronounced on staccato articulations - which this piece is primarily composed of. I don't think you have to do too much and have a million plugins open. Just tone down the stuff that is interfering with the intended sound, and bring up the root pitch a tad on the low notes (these have a glaring octave overtone that confuses the intended octave). You have to remember that sometimes secondary tones/artifacts are what gives instruments their character.
    -Keith Fuller

    http://keithfullermusic.com
    ---
    iMac Quad i7 * MacBook Pro * Logic Studio 9 * WD 320GB & 1TB Externals@7,200RPM * Presonus Firebox * M-Audio Axiom 25 & Keystation 61 * Rode NT1-A * Epiphone Hollowbody * Fender Amp * KRK Rokit 8's

  10. #10

    Re: quick mix for critique/suggestions

    Quote Originally Posted by keithjfuller View Post
    I agree that they are extreme, but that was the point. I wasn't suggesting that it sound how I have it. It was merely to show you what I was talking about.

    One thing that I've noticed is that this effect is usually much more pronounced on staccato articulations - which this piece is primarily composed of. I don't think you have to do too much and have a million plugins open. Just tone down the stuff that is interfering with the intended sound, and bring up the root pitch a tad on the low notes (these have a glaring octave overtone that confuses the intended octave). You have to remember that sometimes secondary tones/artifacts are what gives instruments their character.
    yeah, I'll definitely mess around with the eq tonight to see if I can fix things up a bit. I'll post what I come up with. Thanks for the help.
    Boz Millar

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