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  1. #1

    New to this forum

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    Hello,

    I'm a regular on the Ableton forums and was directed here as i'm very interested in scoring and commercial work. I've done quite a few recording over the years and i'm looking for information about how to record for commercial and scores and how to get into the industry.

    Cheers!

  2. #2

    Re: New to this forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequitas123 View Post
    Hello,

    I'm a regular on the Ableton forums and was directed here as i'm very interested in scoring and commercial work. I've done quite a few recording over the years and i'm looking for information about how to record for commercial and scores and how to get into the industry.

    Cheers!
    Well, first off welcome.

    You sure know how to start with a tough question

    I would have a lot to say on the subject but you need to give us more info.

    You say you've done some recording. What type? Midi orchestration? Recording yourself with a Guitar or band or looping?
    Also, what software do you use. I know you mentioned Alberton but what about professional sequencers such as Logic or Cubase?

    You said scoring and commercial work. Do you mean doing TV commercial spots or do you mean motion picture work.
    What is your goal?

    Are you well versed in computer technology AND music theory?

    Shoot me back some more info, ok?

    Cheers
    2 X Intel i7 920 sys. 12 gigs Ram. XP & Win 7 64
    Cubase 5. Kontakt 4. EWQL C.C.C. (Play)
    Vienna Instruments SE & Plus. Symphobia. GPO.
    RME HDSPe AIO KRK V8s Avalon Vt-747sp
    M-Audio Keystation Pro 88


    My two passions. Music and Cooking.
    Both require just the right ingredients....

  3. #3

    Re: New to this forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Chalfant View Post
    Well, first off welcome.

    You sure know how to start with a tough question

    I would have a lot to say on the subject but you need to give us more info.

    You say you've done some recording. What type? Midi orchestration? Recording yourself with a Guitar or band or looping?
    Also, what software do you use. I know you mentioned Alberton but what about professional sequencers such as Logic or Cubase?

    You said scoring and commercial work. Do you mean doing TV commercial spots or do you mean motion picture work.
    What is your goal?

    Are you well versed in computer technology AND music theory?

    Shoot me back some more info, ok?

    Cheers
    Hey Chalfant, Thanks for the response!

    I've done co-produced big production recordings for a few of the bands i've been in (mostly rock, punk and indie bands). I have lots of experience tracking for bass, guitar, piano, vocals and cello. I've done lots of Midi stuff for my own personal music.

    As for software, i mainly use Ableton as my DAW(its far better than you'd expect, really). I have used Adobe Audition (Cool Edit Pro) and i've got quite a bit of experience with Pro Tools.

    As for work, i'm really interested in both commercial spots and motion picture work, however the latter would be my ultimate goal.

    I've posted some tracks and such on my account: http://www.northernsounds.net/members/208/

    Thank you for your time!

  4. #4

    Re: New to this forum

    Would you believe I just spent the last hour and a half responding in War and peace fashion and somehow I lost it all! Sh.. Grrrrrrrr.

    So, I will re think it all and sent it tomorrow some time, ok?
    2 X Intel i7 920 sys. 12 gigs Ram. XP & Win 7 64
    Cubase 5. Kontakt 4. EWQL C.C.C. (Play)
    Vienna Instruments SE & Plus. Symphobia. GPO.
    RME HDSPe AIO KRK V8s Avalon Vt-747sp
    M-Audio Keystation Pro 88


    My two passions. Music and Cooking.
    Both require just the right ingredients....

  5. #5

    Re: New to this forum

    I appreciate your time! No Rush... enjoy your friday.

    Cheers

  6. #6

    Re: New to this forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequitas123 View Post
    I appreciate your time! No Rush... enjoy your friday.

    Cheers
    OK. Let’s try this again.

    I’ll try and make this as easy as possible to follow and keep things in order but being such a huge issue,
    things come to mind by the time I’m in the next paragraph so bear with me.
    Also, some of this stuff you may know or at least be aware of but I am going to assume you know little, that way I cover at least the major topics.

    I went over to that site and took a listen to the 3 pieces you posted.
    This obviously gives me a better insight as to your abilities and style.
    From a professional standpoint I believe you are half way there.
    You have passion, your music reflects that. Where you need to focus your time and energy is in technique and arrangements.

    Technique:
    This encompasses the equipment and software needed and how to use it.
    Your prior experience with recording bands will serve you well but for scoring and commercial spots there are additional factors, as you no doubt are aware.
    Arrangements:
    This obviously refers to music arranging and composition, the toughest aspect of scoring work, if you don’t posses the necessary skills.

    Motion picture scoring is far more complicated that doing ad spots.
    When Acid came out so many commercials were made strictly from that program, you could hear the loops and many I recognized.
    Today, you can still get away with Ableton or Acid along with synths, perhaps even recording your band but for scores you will need a real sequencer,
    notation program and some high quality sample libraries, not to mention the ability to utilize these tools.
    There are hardware requirements also such as a high quality audio interface and at least 2 computers.
    There’s more but for now those would be your first priorities.

    You mentioned using Pro Tools. Forget that for Midi Orchestration.
    You’re going to have to look at either something like Logic on a Mac or Cubase on a PC or Mac. These programs are superior for midi.
    There are a couple of great video tutorial DVDs you can but that really teach you well, I own a set for Cubase SX and version 4. They’re wonderful.
    The single most important thing in a studio these days is the sequencer.
    Become a power user. Most musicians/composers utilize about 30-40 % of the program.

    Now, while a degree in music isn’t required to get into scoring you must have some fundamental knowledge.
    To start with I would spend time listening to scores by great Midi orchestrators like James Newton Howard and Christopher Young.
    James is the best in the biz. Listening to his scores will serve you well. Study them.

    There’s a great book titled “The Guide to Midi Orchestration” by Paul Gilreath (3rd edition only) Go buy it now!
    Trust me, it’s a great insight into the tools needed and it goes into stuff like how to write for all the sections of the orchestra, how to use EQ and so on.
    It’s not cheap, about $60 but worth it.
    There are other books you may require to broaden your knowledge of orchestration but there are also some great affordable courses from dvds. http://www.truespec.com/professional-orchestration-volume-ultimate-learning-package-p-596.html

    You simply can’t get away from having at least one high quality orchestral sample library.
    There’s much discussion about these right here at Northern Sounds but the following are some of the most popular.
    EWQLSO. VIENNA INSTRUMENTS (VSL). SYMPHOBIA. KIRK HUNTER RUBY OR EMERALD. GPO

    You will need to know your library intimately, understand articulations and so on.
    The bottom line is you are half way there and another year of study, practice and such will place you in a better position to move forward.
    The biggest mistake you can make is to charge ahead when you’re not ready and you are not.
    Not for scoring anyway.

    In addition you will need to have a strong understanding of computers, how to edit an operating system and so on.
    A decision to go Mac or PC is also important as some software is only available on one platform, not the other. For example logic.

    How to get work:

    There’s no real right way. Sometimes its luck or knowing someone but there are things you can do to make it so much easier for you. This worked for me.

    Commercials-

    I took a few ads, removed the audio, redid the dialogue where I had to and recorded the music.
    I setup some appointments with local and interstate advertising agencies and got a gig that way.

    Scoring-

    You need something under your belt, usually anyway.

    There are a lot of music schools around the country and many of them have postings by independent film makers looking for composers.
    Most of these will require you to do a score for little money but it’s the experience and what you can put on your resume that counts in the long run.
    In addition there are hundreds of community television stations that also need music for both documentaries and simple background stuff.
    That’s how I got started.
    Again, little money to start but once you have a few under the belt you can put together a nice presentation DVD to submit for bigger ventures.

    This is a process that can take anything from a couple of years and up but if you really want to score you can.

    There’s always more info but that should do for starters.

    Let me know your thoughts.

    Cheers,
    Charles
    2 X Intel i7 920 sys. 12 gigs Ram. XP & Win 7 64
    Cubase 5. Kontakt 4. EWQL C.C.C. (Play)
    Vienna Instruments SE & Plus. Symphobia. GPO.
    RME HDSPe AIO KRK V8s Avalon Vt-747sp
    M-Audio Keystation Pro 88


    My two passions. Music and Cooking.
    Both require just the right ingredients....

  7. #7

    Re: New to this forum

    Wow Charles, thank you so much for your input. You don't often see someone willing to put that much effort into helping a stranger!

    I'm definitely going to get the Gilreath book as soon as possible. Thats something i've been looking for for a while now. And i will for sure look into Howard and Young.

    I've used Ableton as my sequencer and i feel very confident in it. I will look into Cubase more as i'm definitely going to stick with PC as i know them inside out.

    I've got the East West Quantum Leap Symphony Orchestra Gold edition and just love it. Do you think it will suffice for an Orchestra sample library?


    I'm curious why you suggest having 2 computers?


    Thank so much for your input! It is very appreciated.

  8. #8

    Re: New to this forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Aequitas123 View Post
    Wow Charles, thank you so much for your input. You don't often see someone willing to put that much effort into helping a stranger!

    I'm definitely going to get the Gilreath book as soon as possible. Thats something i've been looking for for a while now. And i will for sure look into Howard and Young.

    I've used Ableton as my sequencer and i feel very confident in it. I will look into Cubase more as i'm definitely going to stick with PC as i know them inside out.

    I've got the East West Quantum Leap Symphony Orchestra Gold edition and just love it. Do you think it will suffice for an Orchestra sample library?


    I'm curious why you suggest having 2 computers?


    Thank so much for your input! It is very appreciated.
    Thanks, it was a bit of work but I hope you get something out of it.

    Ok. I'll answer quickly for now and get back to you later today with a more detailed response. Grandkids 4th Birthday today so kinda hectic here

    Please get that book, it's a wonderful publication and will be invaluable for you BUT make sure it's the third edition, ok?

    Ableton is a fine program and certainly is great for commercials but as I said ya need a sequencer. As you are PC (I am too) Cubase is really the only way to go. Some will argue that Sonar is great but for scoring Cubase is superior, you will have to trust me on that.

    The EWQLSO Gold library is, well, superb. You simply can't go wrong.
    My only suggestion is that you get the XP upgrade if you can.
    This really raises the bar considerably and provides you with so much more. For scores it's really at home.

    2 computers is really becoming a necessary for 2 reasons.
    Firstly, keep your main DAW offline at all times, so hence the need for a general office/internet machine.
    Secondly and more important is the fact that sequencing a score with some 100 tracks is going to put huge load on your system and in so doing produces negative results. Virtual instruments like Atmosphere or the newer Omnisphere are standards and running all your plugins and instruments on a second computer is soooooo much smoother.
    If you stick to a 32bit Win XP system which is my advice (forget Vista)
    have 4 gigs RAM on both machines.

    I build DAWs frequently and can assist with input on hardware when and if needed.

    I'll be back later
    Cheers
    2 X Intel i7 920 sys. 12 gigs Ram. XP & Win 7 64
    Cubase 5. Kontakt 4. EWQL C.C.C. (Play)
    Vienna Instruments SE & Plus. Symphobia. GPO.
    RME HDSPe AIO KRK V8s Avalon Vt-747sp
    M-Audio Keystation Pro 88


    My two passions. Music and Cooking.
    Both require just the right ingredients....

  9. #9

    Re: New to this forum

    Thanks again! I'll be doing some purchasing and tracking soon.

    I'm looking forward to doing some more recording!

  10. #10

    Re: New to this forum

    No probs, good luck, I'll be around........
    2 X Intel i7 920 sys. 12 gigs Ram. XP & Win 7 64
    Cubase 5. Kontakt 4. EWQL C.C.C. (Play)
    Vienna Instruments SE & Plus. Symphobia. GPO.
    RME HDSPe AIO KRK V8s Avalon Vt-747sp
    M-Audio Keystation Pro 88


    My two passions. Music and Cooking.
    Both require just the right ingredients....

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