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Topic: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

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  1. #1

    Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    Hello.

    I'm a Finale user since 97-98! I know the program like the back of my hand. All notation tricks are mine! YAY!

    and I know *ahem* about rendering. I recently got Finale 2009 version, which I totally adore, but along with my soundcard problems, I'm also having trouble using finale to render the music.

    I don't really mind not listening. I compose with pencil and paper, but it still remains that my clients have asked a simple mp3 of the score (what ages... ). So...

    I can't specify all problems, but I was hoping that it would be relatively easy to render in Finale (which doesn't seem to be so). The primary problem, is mixing. I know I'll find it in 5-10 minutes, but I can't change the volume of the separate instruments, nor I want to change dynamics (the score is 'perfect' and ready for performance).

    So is it really that difficult? I mean the score is READY. All dynamics in, all tempo markings in, etc...

    The alternative is always to import the midi file in Cubase and use my other sample libraries, but I'd love to show YOU guys the track (not only score), and I'd hate to take advantage of Gary and show something which has 0 GPO in (if it was to be done in Cubase)...

    So just wondering on experiences in finale rendering. Difficult for you? Not?

  2. #2

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    I have had no problems rendering in Finale 09 whatsoever. I do not believe it is even using the soundcard at the point of rendering. It is all software and CPU working to make the sound file.

    Are you on a PC or a MAC? Are you rendering directly to MP3s? I have never done it that way.

    I am using a PC. I render to .wav files first then convert to MP3. Since the samples are .wav files for PC's this seems to be the best way to render to me. I use these renders as quick listens for how the piece is developing. I go the extra step and drop the finished midi file into Sonar or Tracktion and give the sound a more polished finish.
    [Music is the Rhythm, Harmony and Breath of Life]
    "Music is music, and a note's a note" - Louis 'Satchmo' Armstrong

    Rich

  3. #3

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    Rich, thanks for replying.

    It's my fault, sorry. I meant the whole process of mixing, and making the rendering sound ok... I can render to WAV and mp3, no problems there. Finale 09 works fine in that point (in general it works fine I think. I haven't encountered any bugs, apart from one, which probably is my sound card...).

    But it just seems that I can't grasp the whole process of making the music sound "good" inside Finale. And it should sound... good... I think ... heh...

    I'm on a PC, btw.

    Again, thanks for replying.

  4. #4

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    I know that Finale is not a DAW (like Cubase), and I don't want it to be a DAW neither.

    But I also hope that Finale will be better in mixing, effects (reverb etc), and also editing midi-information before or after HP had done its job. (HP is quite good, but I sometimes would like to tweak a bit more).

    I have also tryed Sibelius, but Sib's playback sounds poor to me if we compare with Finale HP.
    Fred

    Finale 2008, GPO, JABB, C&MB, Strad, Gofriller, Kontakt 3

  5. #5

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    Unfortunately there's no mixing with Finale. At least in the same sense one would mix audio tracks in Sonar or another DAW product.

    I think the best you can do is mark your score well (which you've done), turn up the master volume in Finale's mixer, and adjust the dry/wet sliders in the ambience plugin to hear more dry sound.

    I don't know if this is accurate, but I liken Finale to "recording" an orchestra with a couple of room mics in front of the orchestra. In a DAW you have the ability to close mic each instrument. The analogy breaks down a bit though since you don't really get a sense of depth with Finale's recording. Oh well......

    I'm coming to terms with all of this myself. I've been pouring through threads trying to understand how to mix, etc. and I may give Sonar another shot as I've had a small breakthrough in my understanding of it all. Believe me though I wish I could get an accurate sonic representation of my pieces right from Finale. It would save a ton of time.

    Steve Winkler

  6. #6
    Senior Member bigears's Avatar
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    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    There are two points about mixing with Finale2009 that I wanted to mention in case they have been overlooked. The first thing is that you can tell Finale to playback a score as notated or as recorded. Under the "Documents" menu,
    choose "Playback/ Record Options". Here, there are boxes to select how you want Finale to playback the score. If you have made the score using only notation, with all the tempo markings, dynamics, expressions, etc. you have to uncheck the boxes if you want Finale to play the score as notated.
    The other point is about Finales mixer and the Studio view. They are linked, so a change to one affects the other. The staff controls are accessed by clicking "Studio View" under the view menu. The mixer is accessed by clicking
    "Mixer" under the windows menu. I hope this helps. John

  7. #7

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    Quote Originally Posted by nikolas View Post
    The alternative is always to import the midi file in Cubase and use my other sample libraries, but I'd love to show YOU guys the track (not only score), and I'd hate to take advantage of Gary and show something which has 0 GPO in (if it was to be done in Cubase)...
    Why can't you use the Garritan libraries in Cubase? I have Finale 2008 and 2009, and I am able to use both the Kontakt Player and the Aria version of the Finale/Garritan libraries in an external DAW (although I recently upgraded to full GPO and JABB, so I no longer need to use the Finale versions of the libraries).

    I render from Finale by importing the MIDI into REAPER, and I render the exact same libraries that I use for playback in Finale.
    Best Regards,
    Ernie

  8. #8

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    Hi, Nikolas - I know you don't want to go through the extra work of putting together a recording in Cubase, but you said if you did that you would have to use other sample libraries. I thought you owned GPO--?

    Randy B.

  9. #9

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    Hi all,

    Thanks for your help.

    Randy, no, unfortunately I don't. I have the strad and the steinway (and now Finale sounds), but that's about it... Cubase does not have the human playback that Finale has, so it's actually quite a lot of work (to make, probably, a little better rendering). I do use it for production work and computer games, but I can't really be bothered if it's a case of concert hall music to be performed live later on this year... In Finale just loading a flute is enough, whereas in Cubase I have to load flute legato, staccato, trill, fluttertongue and whatever else I'm using to make a presentable rendering...

    lunker, I actually didn't know that... I'll look into it.

    Steve, big ears. Lots of great information (no mixing in Finale... ). Thanks guys!

    Muchos gracias!

  10. #10

    Re: Finale renderings, how difficult can it be?

    I guess one more option, although quite cumbersome, would be to render each Finale staff as a wave file (dry of course) and load that in Cubase or whatever and mix from there. One problem I see with that though is you'll get a stereo wav file for every track where in many cases a mono track might be more appropriate.

    Another thing I've tried to experiment with in Finale is using impulse responses in the Kontakt player and using the aux sends in Kontakt to try getting front/back perspective. I haven't succeeded however....

    Steve Winkler

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