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Topic: RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer

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  1. #1

    RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer - UPDATE

    Short update:

    I don't get the note overlaps or doubling with most grooves anymore with 1.7.1e - before I could reproduce it with literally EVERY groove I tried.

    It's still there on some though, e.g. 80-Jedi Bass from the Groove Elements > Tonal Elements suite.



    ORIGINAL POST:

    Hi all,

    I was experiencing bad volume spikes with some grooves when set to non-4/4 signatures. On further investigation I found out that RMX generates overlapping notes just by engaging the Time Designer (power switch), leaving everything else unchanged. This happened with EVERY groove I've tried, on some with clearly audible effects and barely noticeable (but still visible) on others. It's easy to test by dragging the MIDI into the host in slice menu mode.

    Switching to non-4/4 without engaging TD's power switch sometimes produces overlaps, sometimes not - which seems to depend on the specific groove. Switching to alternative patterns has a similar effect. The same goes for the "simplify" knob (which automatically switches power on anyway, so...).

    With most percussive sounds the overlaps won't hurt much, but can lead to severe volume spikes with sustained or slowly decaying sounds like e.g. bass - and that's very difficult to tame. The only workaround then is to meticulously edit the MIDI events - which somehow defeats the purpose of having a Time Designer in the first place.

    On some grooves multiple layered notes can be generated - I counted up to 12(!) of the same note piled on, with just small time offsets (Core Library > Example Groove Menus > Film - Action Groove Menu > 174-World Hunt Big Boom - set to 7/4). I realise that the latter is an extreme case, and might be unintended use of the sound, but I don't think it should happen at all.

    Also, the length of the MIDI clips is wrong with some grooves. Try "Jedi Bass" (Core Library > Groove Elements > Tonal Elements) and set it to 5/4. It's a 4-bar pattern, and certainly should still be 4 bars long in any time signature, yes? However the resulting clip in 5/4 is 4 bars + 1 beat long. That's of course easy to fix, but again, shouldn't happen.

    These issues don't seem to be host-related - I tried in Sonar 6 and energyXT 1.4 and saw the exact same things happening. Can anyone else confirm this? I don't think it's system-specific.

    werner

  2. #2

    Re: RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer

    Doubled/Overlapping confirmed here on Cubase 4.1.3

    My strange 1.7 issue (unrelated to time designer): Loops don't loop or sync properly for me unless my timeline is stopped on an exact measure (29.1.1.0). If timeline is at 29.1.1.007, loops don't sync properly when auditioning in RMX. Dragging files to host is not a problem with sync, only auditioning in RMX.
    Host sync is off btw.

  3. #3

    Re: RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer

    Thanks for the feedback...we're looking into that issue.

  4. #4

    Re: RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer

    Hi Eric - Great! You guys are teh bestest!

    Oh, and let me just join the chorus and say "Thank you!" for the great update! Actually its announcement at NAMM was the thing that pushed me over the edge, and I ordered RMX right away. And boy... I had no idea what I've been missing all that time. What a GREAT and INSPIRING groove box!

    werner

  5. #5

    Re: RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer

    Short update:

    I don't get the note overlaps or doubling with most grooves anymore with 1.7.1e - before I could reproduce it with literally EVERY groove I tried.

    It's still there on some though, e.g. 80-Jedi Bass from the Groove Elements > Tonal Elements suite.

    werner

  6. #6

    Re: RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer

    That groove works fine here. Of course, depending on what you do with it in Time Designer, it could be there _should_ be some overlap.

    - Glenn

  7. #7

    Re: RMX 1.7 - Doubled/overlapping notes with Time Designer

    Thanks for replying, Glenn.

    I understand what you're saying about possibly intentional overlaps. But I'm seeing exactly doubled notes here as well - I don't think that's the way it's meant to be.

    In slice menu mode load Jedi Bass and set it to 5/4 - all else default. Drag MIDI to host. Looking at the event list in Sonar I can clearly see that quite a few notes in the clip are doubled: same note#, same time stamp, same duration. When played, volume peaks at about 6dB higher than at default setting - which is to be expected with doubled sounds.

    With default time signature "(4/4)" and pattern "B" I even get tripled notes and spikes of almost +9dB. Funny enough, "B" and "C" are fine at 5/4 - despite overlaps.

    I can send you a MIDI file with some patterns if you can't reproduce it - please let me know. Though considering that the host just imports the MIDI file through the OS buffer, I can't understand how that could be system- or host-related in any way. AND the spikes are there by merely auditioning in RMX itself.

    werner

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