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Topic: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

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  1. #1

    VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    For those who may be interested, I have just finished my "performance" of Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring in its entirety using VSL and Altiverb. If anyone wishes to delve deeper, I have provided my midi files and VE3 project files.

    All comments are welcome and encouraged.

    Best wishes,
    Jay

    http://vsl.co.at/en/65/71/1590/1242.vsl


    For some additional information about my experience working on this piece please click here:
    http://vsl.co.at/en/65/71/1590/1592/1243.vsl

  2. #2

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    First of all, congrats to Jay. I cannot imagine an orchestral mockup of this complex piece being done better. You should write a book.

    Secondly, congrats to VSL, who clearly make excellent libraries.

    Finally, however, since there is little or nothing to criticize in the programming or the library, this reinforces my belief what I have maintained all long, which is that one never can do more than the musical equivalent of a photograph of the real thing.

    I remember as a freshman at Boston Conservatory, sitting in an open rehearsal on a Thursday evening of the Boston Symphony Orchestra and hearing the great bassoonist Sherman Walt play the opening and literally feeling the hair stand up on the back of my neck. And then when the motor rhythms kicked in, the sheer power was awesome.

    This splendid version that Jay has performed does not, and cannot, achieve that. And for those of us working in the commercial end of this, that is the message we need to give to directors and producers.
    Composer, Logic Certified Trainer, Level 2,
    author of "Going Pro with Logic Pro 9."

    www.jayasher.com

  3. #3

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    Hello Jay,

    Wow, this is really pushing the limits of what can be done with samples!!!

    Thank you for inspiring all "midi-mockupers"!

    BTW, how do you pull this off with respect to time and making money?

    All the best and thank you sir! ;-)

    Peter

  4. #4

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    WOW. I am not worthy!

    The only niggle I have with this is the same niggle I have with 'real' performances... the bassoon sounds too good. ie. An old guy mentioned this when I was in college... his claim was that -no one- could make the opening passage sound 'right' in the modern world because, when Igor wrote this, that was at the top of most guys' range and it had a lot more shrill tone--befitting the setting. Nowadays, everybody plays a lot better so it sounds too sweet for it's own good. I thought he was nuts at the time, but now I know what he meant. IOW: I wish they had a 'raspy' set of samples for notes over the 2nd octave.

    I gotta particularly pay respect to the soundstage... I dunno if that's -you- or VSL but the stereo spread -really- makes it for me.

    What I wanna know is... what kind of hardware does it take to realise this? Is it rendered in real time or is there 'freezing' going on?



    ---JC

  5. #5

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    Quote Originally Posted by Suntower View Post
    The only niggle I have with this is the same niggle I have with 'real' performances... the bassoon sounds too good. ie. An old guy mentioned this when I was in college... his claim was that -no one- could make the opening passage sound 'right' in the modern world because, when Igor wrote this, that was at the top of most guys' range and it had a lot more shrill tone--befitting the setting. Nowadays, everybody plays a lot better so it sounds too sweet for it's own good. I thought he was nuts at the time, but now I know what he meant. IOW: I wish they had a 'raspy' set of samples for notes over the 2nd octave.


    ---JC
    Actually, when it was written they used French Bassoons which are much softer and sweeter in tone than the modern Bassoons. It's also easier to get the opening note accurately and softly on an old, French Bassoon.

    D

  6. #6

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    Interesting!

    All the old recordings I have head, you can -really- hear the guy absolutely straining for that opening note.

    Thanks.

    ---JC

    Quote Originally Posted by Daryl View Post
    Actually, when it was written they used French Bassoons which are much softer and sweeter in tone than the modern Bassoons. It's also easier to get the opening note accurately and softly on an old, French Bassoon.

    D

  7. #7

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    Hi Jay,

    Fantastic!

    What I like about it is that you hear every part so clearly.
    How long did that take you? Also, what VSL Library were you using?
    And what software were you using to sequence and record?

    Thanks,

    Bond

  8. #8

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    Quote Originally Posted by Suntower View Post
    Interesting!

    All the old recordings I have head, you can -really- hear the guy absolutely straining for that opening note.

    Thanks.

    ---JC
    Firstly this would depend on how old "old" is, secondly which orchestra is playing and thirdly the standard of the actual player.

    Also, remember that in old recordings you don't get re-takes, so if the guy screws up, the orchestral performance is ruined. Pressure...

    One other thing to remember is that this was earth shatteringly new when it was written. the orchestra couldn't play it, the dancers couldn't count it (they had to hire a Dalcroze teacher to help) and the audience hated it. These days it is much easier to play because it is very familiar. Most conductors these days wouldn't think twice about performing this ballet, but during the period when it was written, you'd have to be very brave to attempt it....!

    D

  9. #9

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    Jay, I am proud of you!

    Tons of labor, well done!
    Dan

  10. #10

    Re: VSL demo-- Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring-- Complete

    Quote Originally Posted by Daryl View Post
    Actually, when it was written they used French Bassoons which are much softer and sweeter in tone than the modern Bassoons. It's also easier to get the opening note accurately and softly on an old, French Bassoon.

    D
    That doesn't really tally with Stravinsky's own remarks. He said that if he'd realised how easy it would become for bassoonists to get the first note he'd have written it higher.

    His own recordings also sound like the player is busting a gut to get the note.
    David

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