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Topic: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

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  1. #1

    How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    Hey Guys,

    I am trying to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar but cannot seem to get it right. I am using Sonar Studio 8 + Kontakt 2. This is what I want to do. I have recorded a string section and rather than staying with the velocity of my midi keyboard controller I would like to do an even better job in creating movement by manually drawing in the velocity.

    I have noticed 2 things. I right click on my track and select insert Clip velocity. This does not do anything. Then I discovered the Remote Control function but I cannot figure out how to use it.

    Could someone, using Sonar, please explain to me in a step by step way what I need to do to be able to record velocity using my modwheel or to manually draw the velocity trailers in by hand.

    In the end I want to be able to create a movement from soft little velocity to hard loud velocity as a gradual increase and decrease.

    PLEASE HELP !!!
    Thanks in advance!
    "‘The heights by men reached and kept were not attained by sudden flight,
    but they, while their companions slept, were toiling upward in the night
    .’ Henry Wadsworth Longfellow."



  2. #2
    Senior Member Frank D's Avatar
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    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    Hi Empneo,

    I open the Controller Pane at the bottom of the Piano Roll View and simply draw the velocities using the draw tool. Just make sure you have the edit set to "Notes/velocities"

    Although I'm still using Sonar 5, this should be similar in 8 except now you can have multiple controller panes.

    Hope this helps!

    Regards,

    Frank

  3. #3

    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Frank D View Post
    Hi Empneo,

    I open the Controller Pane at the bottom of the Piano Roll View and simply draw the velocities using the draw tool. Just make sure you have the edit set to "Notes/velocities"

    Although I'm still using Sonar 5, this should be similar in 8 except now you can have multiple controller panes.

    Hope this helps!

    Regards,

    Frank
    Thanks for the info. But how can I make "envelope" type drawings. I understand how I can add velocity to a single note by drawing it in manually. But how can I do that to increase velocity gradually from one not to another ? Or decrease from one not to another. Almost like a volume fade up and down. I hope my explanation makes sense.
    THANKS !!!!
    "‘The heights by men reached and kept were not attained by sudden flight,
    but they, while their companions slept, were toiling upward in the night
    .’ Henry Wadsworth Longfellow."



  4. #4
    Senior Member Frank D's Avatar
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    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    Try placing an 1/8th note scale in the piano roll view ... for this experiment, you can just draw them in. Open the controller pane and with the draw tool draw a diagonal line from under the 1st note to the last ... you should end up with the very "envelope-like" series of velocities ... but only a single velocity will be shown beneath each note. A note can't have more than a single velocity value.

    One huge point: If these are GPO or JABB instruments, don't confuse velocity with CC1 ... volume. If you were to do the same thing above but using cc1 instead of velocity, you would indeed end up with a dynamic series of values ... as many as you want within the time duration per note ... this would look more like the traditional 'envelope' you may be envisioning.

    Frank

  5. #5

    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    When you insert a Clip Velocity envelope (or any other envelope) you get a horizontal line running through the clip. Right click on the line to add nodes to it and select the curve between any two nodes. Left click on the line/node to drag the line fragment/node up/down.

  6. #6

    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Frank D View Post
    Try placing an 1/8th note scale in the piano roll view ... for this experiment, you can just draw them in. Open the controller pane and with the draw tool draw a diagonal line from under the 1st note to the last ... you should end up with the very "envelope-like" series of velocities ... but only a single velocity will be shown beneath each note. A note can't have more than a single velocity value.

    One huge point: If these are GPO or JABB instruments, don't confuse velocity with CC1 ... volume. If you were to do the same thing above but using cc1 instead of velocity, you would indeed end up with a dynamic series of values ... as many as you want within the time duration per note ... this would look more like the traditional 'envelope' you may be envisioning.

    Frank
    Thanks Frank. I will give your instructions a try. I think you understood exactly what I meant. With the volume CC1, I can post-record volume using my modwheel and I would like to do the same sort of thing with the velocity. But I understood your explanation. Thanks so much for the help !!!
    "‘The heights by men reached and kept were not attained by sudden flight,
    but they, while their companions slept, were toiling upward in the night
    .’ Henry Wadsworth Longfellow."



  7. #7

    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    Hi, Empneo

    I think you're doing OK now after all these helpful replies. - ? - Maybe?

    It does sound like you've been confusing several things - Velocity and Volume, and the controls available for MIDI as opposed to Audio.

    In your last response you said, "...I can post-record volume using my modwheel and I would like to do the same sort of thing with the velocity..."

    But earlier you also said, "...I understand how I can add velocity to a single note by drawing it in manually. But how can I do that to increase velocity gradually from one not to another ?..."

    Velocity doesn't control the volume for most Garritan instruments, while it does control the Attack envelope. Higher Velocities get a faster, harder attack, lower values get you soft, slow attacks to the sound. Volume is controlled with MIDI CC1. But you understand that since you mentioned using the mod wheel to record your volume control - that's how you would get the crescendos you want.

    Here's the main reason I got on here - Velocity is different from all the other controllers. It's a value determined by how hard you hit the keys. The velocity value is "married" to the note - It can be edited, and you are saying that you already know that - you know that you can manually change the velocity note by note.

    But the rest of the MIDI control you have is different because none of it is directly welded to the notes in the same way as velocity. You can draw in or record in waves and waves of volume control, vibrato, panning, but none of that data is pasted on to the notes themselves. That is the data through which the notes play - if they're in an area of the track where you have low CC1 data for a Garritan Flute, for instance, then the ntoes will play back quietly no matter what the velocity value is.

    So - there is no way to "post record" velocity in the same way. If you want to change those values, you have to get out the pencil tool and start making changes. You Can sweep through the velocities in the Piano Roll View without having to stop at each note the way you've apparently been doing.

    Randy

  8. #8

    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    There is also the Process-Velocity command to modify velocities over a range, with a linear scaling applied from one end to the other. For example, you can leave one end of the range at 100% and change the other to 60% and the changes will be applied to the velocity of the notes over the range progressively.

  9. #9

    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    Good one, Alan - I use that tool in Sonar constantly. But I liked the way it was designed previous to the current Sonar. Still works though, and is THE way to change a selection's velocity values by a percentage--lower them but retain all their relative variety.

    Randy

  10. #10
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    Re: How to draw a velocity envelope in Sonar ?

    The velocity value is tied to each note. There are no velocity envelopes like you have have for other controllers such as volume or pan.

    Velocity does work different in Sonar 8 than it does in Sonar 5. You need to highlight the notes first that you want to make velocity changes to. Then you can just hold down the left mouse button and drag it thru the notes you want to change. Another way to scale notes and do other various velocity changes is by highlighting the notes, right click and select MIDI Effects and then the Velocity effect. This neat app allows you to scale velocities, limit the ranges, randomize, etc.

    You can also scale velocities by selecting the draw tool and then place the cursor on the top of one of the selected notes, hold the left mouse button (this will show a bunch of short horizontal lines) and then drag up or down. You can see the velocities change in the velocity pane.

    As mentioned before, if you are trying to change the volumes of strings, brass or woodwinds, then you should be drawing envelopes for CC1 (modulation).

    Jim

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