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Topic: Halion is now able to read giga files

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  1. #1

    Halion is now able to read giga files

    http://www.cubase.net/

    Interesting... I wonder what the latency etc. is on Halion? I mean - OK - so it won\'t play the same number of voices simultaneously as perhaps gigastudio, but the fact that it is integrated into the vst environment.

    Mmm... I suspect gigastudio will remain a stalwart of those doing what seems to be the case of most of the people on this forum, that being orchestral work where large, big, high-polyphony samples are required...

    Maybe... anyone else had any thoughts.

    Of course, the real power is in the sample libraries and as long as the developers of these libraries allow us to port across then I don\'t see a problem. Not as if there really needs to be a Nemesys vs the world debate?

    Thoughts, thoughts, thoughts...

  2. #2

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    Yes, i saw this a few days ago. I\'m wondering how the performance is on some of the Giga instruments, however. Since much of the power of GS is in that it streams the samples from the hard drive, thus eliminating the need to loop samples and allowing much larger sample sizes, how will HalION handle this. Is HalION RAM-based or disk-based? I would think that many Giga instruments would choke HalION if it is RAM-based, not to mention that you would need a huge amount of RAM to run some of the Giga instruments in it.

    Any thoughts or information on this?

  3. #3

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    HALion poly is totally up to the computer I have Tibook 400 and I get about 20 voices and the thing starts choking!!!!

    HALion sucks as far as Giga disks go and getting them into a mac... It won\'t even look at stuff like steinway B and Trachtman or Christian and Lane or Malmsjo or any one of a number of other disks. I have been keeping up with the HAlion forum at Cubase and the results seem to be very mixed

    giga

  4. #4

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    Yes, that\'s one thing that I was wondering about. How does HALion handle things like Gigasampler\'s dimensions any other features that are specific to Giga? Do these translate? For example, the Scarbee J-Slap Bass library has alot of complex velocity layering and other controller sample switching. How does this translate in HALion?

    I\'m a Cubase user, and I am right now considering buying another machine to dedicate to Gigasampler separate from my Cubase machine. If HALion can boast that it translates Giga instruments reliably and maintains the programming characterisics of the instruments, then I might consider buying HALion to use as a VST plugin and not have to spend the money on another machine? Is this the way to go?

  5. #5

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    Hmmm, just read the manual for Halion V1.1

    I still can\'t believe that the polyphony or latency will cut it.

    [This message has been edited by Chadwick (edited 09-05-2001).]

  6. #6

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files


    Well,at this point, I am probably the only piano sample producer who has programmed the same piano library in native format for both software applications, so I can offer some observations from my experience so far.

    Yes, for a direct translation of a library, Halion will use more CPU than Gigastudio. Whether this is a problem for you depends on whether your computer was being limited by CPU or by disk I/O as far as your polyphony results go.

    Over 2 months ago, I reprogrammed a 6-layer version of my Steinway-C piano samples for the first release of Halion.
    In re-programming my Steinway-C piano in the native Halion format, I have found that better overall results may actually be achievable.
    Specifically, Halion does not suffer from the velocity/volume compression/saturation, and the sample layer crossfade is compatible with equal-amplitude phase-coherent crossfade. What this means is that instead of using the Gigastudio lowpass filtering to reduce the impact of the abrupt velocity-switched layers, in Halion I can use the crossfade feature to get smoother transitions **without the CPU overhead that the filtering uses***. So, the final results with Halion can be equally good for a given CPU.

    The first release of Halion did not include the dimension switching, but now that the version 1.1 includes this, I will be reprogramming my sample sets to include this. So, I\'ll soon have a 12 layer (6 pedal-up and 6 pedal-down) version for Halion. If I include the release triggered samples in the file, instead of as a supplemental layered instrument, this will make for an even larger number of dimensions. The fact that Halion uses individual WAV files, instead of the monster monolithic Gig file means that I am no longer limited by the 2GB (or 4GB) Windows file size barrier.

    Halion still has its own problems and limitations, but things are not as simple as raw CPU load when you program an instrument specifically for each application.

    Regards,
    Warren Trachtman
    http://www.wstco.com/pianosounds/



  7. #7

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    Halion is disk based like GS... there is some talk of infringement of copyright about them using disk streaming... which in my mind is a bit like someone trying to patent the wheel.
    I read a review in the UK Sound on SOund magazine recently that seemed to indicate that the performance wasn\'t as good on Halion as it was on GS in terms of number of sounds... I\'m just wondering whether there is a potential \'so-what?\' associated with that given the lack of available fx in gs?
    I guess I\'ll just stick with GS for the time being and see what happens? The important thing is that this only promotes the sample library developers to continue producing the great samples they are producing knowing that they have a wider market now and potentially this may bring down some costs...

  8. #8

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    I\'ve been in a studio these past couple of days working with an engineer who uses Halion in cubase. I was very impressed with its seamless integration into the sequencer and love the way that FX are so easily added to each seperate channel. Hearing that it reads gig. format is a real bonus. I noticed however that it uses up far more in processing than the same number and size of voices would in GS which seems to indicate that it is a fair distance from being as economical.

    It is very effective if you use cubase but I still prefer to have GS housed in a seperate computer for maximum effectiveness. The two are really very different from eachother.

    Still, competition is never a bad thing!.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Bruce A. Richardson's Avatar
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    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TJ:
    I noticed however that it uses up far more in processing than the same number and size of voices would in GS which seems to indicate that it is a fair distance from being as economical.

    It is very effective if you use cubase but I still prefer to have GS housed in a seperate computer for maximum effectiveness. The two are really very different from eachother.

    Still, competition is never a bad thing!.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Yes, I think it\'s a good thing, too...it will shut some folks right up who seem to believe that GigaStudio level performance is possible in that environment.

    Frankly, I\'d like to see GigaStudio support VST synthesizers as plugins. Now THAT would shut some people up, haha.


  10. #10

    Re: Halion is now able to read giga files

    What may now be an option is to buy halion in conjunction with gigastudio and use it to drive samples that maybe don\'t require a huge amount of polyphony (such as percussion) thus leveraging your investment in the gigasampler libs and also freeing up valuable polyphony on the dedicated machine... tis an idea. To be honest, the ideal solution would be for Halion to stream around 500 voices simulteneously and apply fx to them... then I\'m there and buying it
    Still: probably not *that* far off... the need for separate hardware is probably just a 2-3 year blip... once the number of simultaneous voices on a single box exceeds 300 or so... we should all be laughing... and THAT is only a doubling of hard-drive, memory, CPU speed... which is probably around a year away, not three...
    I suspect that the cubase people will get the Halion synth up to scratch in next to no time... let\'s face it, they\'ve got nothing else to worry about in that the rest of the environment is already there for fx etc. Just need to get the Halion synth to up its spec.
    Anyone know what the Halion polyphony is?

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