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Topic: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

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  1. #1

    Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    Since there is so much knowledge here about Gigastudio and the available libraries for it, I would like to pose a problem, and hear your solutions.

    How would you go about putting together an orchestra simulation using Gigastudio with one or more computers running Giga, assuming that money is not an issue. Assume the ability to control up to 64 midi channels from a scoring program. The purpose of the setup is to be able to preview a score so that it sounds much like it would if it were played by an orchestra. The ultimate composition will be played by a real orchestra, but for composition purposes, the simulation would allow the \"proof\" of the score while composing.

    The setup must have fixed instruments that would correspond to an orchestra (i.e. trombone 1,2,3, horn 1,2,3,4, etc.) so that the score could correspond to individual instruments. Brass, woodwinds and percussion would have only a single channel per instrument (i.e. horn 1 gets a channel), and strings would get 3 channels per part (legato, marcato and pizzicato for violin1, another similar set for violin 2, etc.).

    Do you think this would be practical, and/or possible, and if so, what libraries would you use?

    If this plan would not be practical/possible, do you have an alternative?

    Thanks!

    -- Martin

  2. #2

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    Yes, to some extent I believe that would be possible. You\'d be better off just using a General Midi sound module though. For preview purposes.

    I think what you basically do when you begin working on a piece is that you decide what you\'re going to compose. You make a little selection of the needed instruments and articulations and you just load them up into gigastudio and lay the foundation in your sequencer. Then as you realize you need to thicken textures and the orchestration, you add instruments as you go along. I use two computer with gigastudio. On the dedicated computer I have the typical articulations of the whole orchestra loaded (basically miroslav , kirk hunter and some AO) and on my sequencer pc I have my custom sounds and add special articulations and instruments etc. It doesn\'t matter in what order you put your instruments. If you\'re going to work on notation and finally print it out as a complete score for orchestra you\'d just rearrange the parts in your notation software at the click of a button. Of course there are people who are very tidy when they compose. They\'re always putting instruments in midichannels according to their position on a typical score sheet. I don\'t mind doing this either, but it\'s not that important, IMO.
    Fx. in a typical full orchestral arrangement:

    piccolo midi-channel 1
    flutes midi-channel 2
    oboes midi-channel 3
    clarinets midi-channel 4
    bassoon midi-channel 5
    c.bsn midi-channel 6

    horns midi-channel 7
    trumpets midi-channel 8
    bones midi-channel 9
    b-bone midi-channel 10
    tuba midi-channel 11

    1st vn midi-channel 12
    2nd vn midi-channel 13
    violas midi-channel 14
    celli midi-channel 15
    d.bass midi-channel 16

    Having one computer dedicated to this kind of setup is highly recommended by me. It is however not necessary to have them loaded in the proper order. Having, say, 4 midi channels for horns (one each) can be useful, but I would never do that. It\'s really up to the composer. I like to work this way, because it\'s very effective. I always have all the different instruments loaded and ready to play.

    With the new breed of gigastudio libraries most instruments come with keyswitches which means you wont have to spend extra midichannels on additional articulations.

    Then you can use your second gigastudio comp for an additional 64 midi channels of whatever you\'d like. Be it percussion, choir, exotic instruments, etc.

    Thomas

    [This message has been edited by Thomas_J (edited 09-06-2001).]

  3. #3

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    Has anyone tried this with Sibelius ?

    I am a new user of gigastudio an am at the moment working on Venus by Holst .I am just entering the text straight from my dover score into Sibelius and running giga off it . It,s working out okay and it,s nice to deal with real score but I have to import into Logic to fiddle with the dynamics .Sibelius does have some cool things like haipins effecting velocity levels but it can be pretty tricky .

    I ended up having to use 24 channels as this is a big orchestra . Does anyone out there have good results with notation software on gigastudio ?
    Any tips ?

    Dicky

  4. #4
    Senior Member Bruce A. Richardson's Avatar
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    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WAGNER:
    Has anyone tried this with Sibelius ?

    I am a new user of gigastudio an am at the moment working on Venus by Holst .I am just entering the text straight from my dover score into Sibelius and running giga off it . It,s working out okay and it,s nice to deal with real score but I have to import into Logic to fiddle with the dynamics .Sibelius does have some cool things like haipins effecting velocity levels but it can be pretty tricky .

    I ended up having to use 24 channels as this is a big orchestra . Does anyone out there have good results with notation software on gigastudio ?
    Any tips ?

    Dicky
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Biggest tip, don\'t use it! You will have more musical results from playing the lines in by hand, into Logic. Since you already have the score, you don\'t need printed output, so using a scoring program is really not giving you anything and it\'s taking quite a bit away.


  5. #5

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    Ah ha

    Yes well I guess playing each part by hand is what would happen In real life , and when i,m in the studio I much prefer people to sequencers . I was just intrested to see if a decent result was possible with a score program . I am planning on writing for film and just though if the results could easily be made musical it would be very quick way of working .
    I have read your column on this and you alude to alot of time tweaking in pro-tools and the like . I guess i,m just dreaming of a day when i type it in and hear it .

    Dicky

  6. #6

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    I do need notation most of the time so what I do is use Finale for typing everything in. I can still hear things being played back this way too. Then once everything is in I port evrerything over to Digital Performer and sequence everything from there.

    Donnie

  7. #7

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    For what it\'s worth, I find Cakewalk Overture a lot easier to use than Sibelius. The Graphic window is great for controlling crescendos etc and it\'s easy to grab a bunch of notes in the score and change the voice to assign a different sample. A very intuitive program for me. I\'ve also tried Finale, Encore and Notetheads.
    Try posting a clip from your Holst piece when you finish it.

  8. #8

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    Is cakewalk more comprehesive on the midi front than Sibelius ? or Finale ( although I don,t realy know that program )

    Donnie you say you still have to import into Performer to get a satisfactory result . Is that to tweak timings to make it more expressive ( i like the expressive playback option in sibelius , It does help ) or is it for make basic things like Dynamics and program changes ?

    I,m not sure if dealing with notated data as apposed to playing the parts is the right way do go . I just think it might be .I had my music teacher over at the studio i,m currently working at to show him Gigastudio and he was very impressed with the results for the holst piece ( which I will post ) but warned me against orchesrtating in a computer . He stressed the need to write everything out first to get all the parts arranged propely and then try building it in the gigastudio .

    He especially did,nt like the idea of trying out various combinations of instruments rather than commiting in your head to idea you know will work .

    Perhaps this is the most facinating aspect of modern composing , (with computers) . My father is a composer , and my childhood memories are full of him wailing at the piano some horn part ,or finding him scratching out a cello line in the back garden on a piece of paper .

    I wonder if having all this technology at our fingertips will produce very different music . By all accounts a lot of the top Film Composers write a lot of music that too all intents and purposes is unplayable in a concert hall . The balance of the instruments alone is unrealistic and needs the support of extensive balancing . Im not saying that,s bad music ( although imho alot of it is ) it,s just that it seems a long time ago that good old benny herrmann sat done at the kitchen table and wrote out the score to North By Northwest

    Dicky

  9. #9

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    I\'m not sure about Cakewalk Overture, but I do know that Finale has a lot more control over MIDI than Sibelius and Igor do. It allows the same amount of control as Cakewalk Pro Audio, although the interface is of course not designed to be as convenient for that. It\'s the most popular notation program in the world, so naturally it lacks compared to a dedicated sequencing program. But I\'ve become very used to Finale, and over all I prefer to work with it rather than Cakewalk. It\'s just faster for the type of work I do with Gigastudio.

  10. #10

    Re: Dream Gigastudio orchestra simulation

    My personal preference is to use Cakewalk Pro for GigaStudio work and then use Finale if I need printed parts for any reason.

    The only problem is that I find that it is necessary to hand input the music into Finale because I do too much custom editing of the Midi file to make it sound good that I cannot do a direct port into Finale.

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