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Topic: GOS2 sooner rather than later

  1. #1

    GOS2 sooner rather than later

    So I've seen many mentions about GOS2, and some saying that because of the release of LASS and the imminent release of "Hollywood Strings" that Gary decided to delay the release of GOS2.

    I looked up the system requirements for LASS, as well as the COST of Hollywood Strings, and all I can say is that unless GOS2 requires you to install on 2 (yes, two!) computers to just run it, and costs upwards of $1000, then sure, don't release it.

    However, if GOS2 is anything like the other Garritan libraries, then god dammit, release it already.

    Somehow, I can't imagine a Garritan product being "elitist" like these other products are.

    LASS requires you to install it and run it on two different computers without which you will run in to performance issues.

    While HS costs upwards of $1200 for the lower end version, and over $1600 for the higher end version.

    LASS is also selling for over $1300.

    Will GOS2 be as "high end" as those two libraries?

    I would very much like to know what to expect.

    I listened to the demos for each, and I wasn't impressed.. mostly because they just do the usual "film music" style demos that spotlight their library in only the most favorable light.

    I want to hear them do a demo of some REAL music, not some movie/game underscore loaded with sound effects and "ooh / ahhh" choruses and massive taiko drums.

    If GOS2 is going to be a library that requires a computer upgrade just to use, and forbids me from loading other instruments because of its own memory-hog requirements, then I'd also like to know. I want to know that I can continue to write for full symphony orchestra and still get nice demos from my Garritan products without my computer overloading.

    I know I sound annoyed... and I guess I am.
    I understand the medical emergency that has put the breaks on Gary's professional life, but the reasons I'm hearing for the delay of GOS2's release have nothing to do with that, and seem to be "marketing" reasons, more than anything.

    Like I said, if GOS2 is gonna cost upwards of a grand, I want to know, now. I won't even consider it if that is the case, and will just settle for what I am using now.

    If GOS2's memory usage is going to monopolize my computer to the point where I won't be able to load any other libraries at the same time, well, I would like to know that also.

    I don't see much point in a library that ONLY allows me to write for strings.

  2. #2

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    Hello Michel,
    I get why you are frustrated, GOS2 has been a long time in coming. I've no inside information around the product, nor any information outside of what Gary has posted on the forum. However, I can tell you what I expect from the product. Most of this you probably have figured out on your own, but just in case...

    First, the hardware requirements for GOS2 will be significantly more than GPO. Gary will always try to keep system requirements down and he and Tom find ingenious ways to do so. However, the bar has been raised significantly since GOS came out and to be competitive GOS2 will require more horsepower to not only compete but to beat the competition. As I see the Aria player today, it will be useful for GPO and similar libraries like JABB, however GOS2 is going to incorporate Giga tech and then improve on it (why else would Gary purchase the technology?) and it will require horsepower and scripting that Aria, at least in its current incarnation, does not begin to approach. Maybe there will be an Aria Pro? Maybe a completely separate engine? I've no idea. It will be interesting to see what he has brewing!

    So what hardware requirements would I guess for GOS2? At least a quad core with 8 gig of RAM. This is a qualified estimate based on what I see across another dozen products out today, so I think it is fair. Anyone in this world (meaning libraries of this size and not the GPOs of the world) would be foolish to purchase anything less these days. Articulations require CPU!

    The world of a two computer setup is becoming more commonplace given the lower cost of entry these days. You can build a Windows box (I do and my main box is a Mac) and use VE Pro to host samples on the second box. It works well, is compatible with products other than the VE products and is not difficult to get up and running. Something worth looking into. Certainly GOS2 will be capable in one way or another to take advantage of a multi box system. Whether it is a part of the GOS2 architecture or you use it with something like VE Pro I have no idea.

    Now about cost. Again, I have no insider information, nothing more than what you've seen on these boards. In other words when it comes to cost I've seen nothing. (And rightly so.) I believe GOS started at $1300. I can see GOS2 being in the same ballpark or less. I doubt it will be less than $800 and am planning my budget to accommodate at least that price point. One thing is for sure, it is not going to be $350! So there will be an investment to move into the realm of GOS2. Both hardware (unless you already have a quad core based system) and software. Best advice is to start stashing away cash now! This might take some pain out of the length of development. More time to save.

    You mentioned a couple of other libraries that you have looked at. Hollywood Strings and LASS. What you said about both is true, big resource requirements, higher software cost, a Hollywood or cinema sound. There are several other options out there that cost less and are much more oriented to a classical sound than Hollywood. Some of them had some killer deals during the holidays, two of which I was able to take advantage of. I won't name products on Gary's forum out of respect, but you can PM me if you are not sure what products I am talking about. The beautiful thing about orchestral libraries is that you can use multiple libraries to blend in with each other to get a unique sound. GOS2 will fit in very nicely when it comes out.

    I am really looking forward to GOS2. Gary has a guaranteed sale with me. Like many others, I own several libraries (I am the pinnacle of jack of all trades, master of none when it comes to orchestral libs!) but that is not a sign of disloyalty. It is a sign of hopeless addiction! If you are frustrated with the delay of GOS2 go out and buy another library that you can afford now and then pick up GOS2 later when it comes out. I don't think you will hurt Gary's feelings, you will have a lib to work with and Gary will still have you as a customer with GOS2.

    We are the music makers, we are the dreamers of dreams …
    24" 2.4 Ghz iMac, OSX 10.4.10, MOTU 828 MKII, 2 Glyph 250 Gig external drives, Logic 9, Finale 2008 GPO, JABB, Strad, Gro, Reason 4, EWQL Storm Drum, Adrenaline, Symphonic Choirs, SO Gold,All Arturia Synths, Many NI Synths, Spectrasonics Synths, KH Strings, VEPro on a Windows 7 4x 2.8 Ghz 12 gig of RAM

  3. #3

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    I completely understand Michel's concerns and frustrations. I also understand the other side that wants to get the development and timing just right to maximize sales, etc.

    What would be awesome is to be able to download particular articulations that are missing from GPO that one might like to have. That way the cost would stay down AND you could maintain the lightness of GPO by just adding a few samples/articulations missing from GPO.

    Does anyone think this is possible or in the works?

    Steve Winkler

  4. #4

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    Michel, this from you gave me a good chuckle:

    "...I want to hear them do a demo of some REAL music, not some movie/game underscore loaded with sound effects and "ooh / ahhh" choruses and massive taiko drums..."

    hehehe--So right. We're surrounded by this Stuff - it's all we here in demos, at the movie theatre--ARRrrrrrgh we're engulfed by it! But don't you see?--That IS what people think of as orchestral music now. And a surprisingly large number of musicians actually want to write this stuff - because it's commercial. sigh.


  5. #5

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    Quote Originally Posted by LFO View Post
    ...and use VE Pro to host samples on the second box.
    Kevin, could you elaborate on VE Pro? I did a Google search but didn't come up with anything that looked like an operating system, just a suite of analysis tools and some motorcycle engineering company...


  6. #6
    Senior Member Frank D's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Suburban NYC

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    Hi Guys,

    This was an interesting read ... thank you Michel for formulating these questions; I'm sure many Users on this forum await GOS2 with the same 'baited breath' .

    And thanks to Kevin for the thoughtful reality check. The combination of these posts at least brings this topic back in the Forum's eye as we start 2010.

    I'll add this: Like several other Users on this forum, I have a sizable investment in Giga. On my 'money' projects, I still use a combo of Giga for piano, bass, and strings, and JABB and GPO for most brass and reeds, particularly the JABB saxes which I prefer over a costly Giga sax library that I also own.

    I appreciate what Kevin mentioned about Giga technology. For those not familiar, Giga streams samples in real time off of fast hard drives ... it doesn't load everything into RAM. That's how I can play my 2 Gb GigaPiano and another 10 Gb or so of Giga-samples (plus the KP Garritan stuff) and not have it eat up my entire 4 Gb of RAM! In my experience, I found I have more distributed horsepower using a combo of Giga in Sonar (via ReWire), plus 2-3 instances of KP2 (I still need to upgrade GPO to the Aria flavor) than a Sonar session where I used no Giga, and attempted to use 4-5 instances of KP2 and 100% JABB, GPO, etc.

    Of course, I tip-toe around using Giga at all (I use Giga3 Orchestra-flavor), because since the Tascam divorce, it is pure vaporware with virtually no support. And although it performs flawlessly, and I have my music production PC Ghosted, I still dread the day I have to restore an image and have Giga challenge me for a NEW authorization code ... Ehhhh.

    My point is, I can understand that a higher-end sample library may require a higher-end engine to use it. If I'm not mistaken, wasn't the original GOS originally a Giga library? (I may be wrong on that, but I thought I read that on this site once).

    Just one last general comment/philosophy on sample libraries: I gave up long ago holding my breath for the next latest and greatest sample library (or in the 'old days', a new sample player a la EMU's Proteii, Kurzweil 1000 PX, etc.) I found I delayed making (and enjoying the process of creating) music because I wanted to optimize my next project with better samples. And guess what: there will always be another new product to start us salivating all over again!

    Right now, personally, I'd LOVE to get JABB Aria ... but in the meantime, I'm not checking every 20 seconds if it's out yet. I use my KP2 JABB regularly and keep enjoying it and learning my craft and when it's out: FANTASTIC! In the meanwhile, I keep plugging along with what I have operational in my DAW and enjoy creating music.

    And NO ... this was not a paid response by Gary .



  7. #7

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    Quote Originally Posted by raweber View Post
    Kevin, could you elaborate on VE Pro? I did a Google search but didn't come up with anything that looked like an operating system, just a suite of analysis tools and some motorcycle engineering company...

    raweber: Vienna Ensemble Pro

    everyone: First, of course LA Scoring Strings (LASS) and Hollywood Strings are designed for film music. They're named that!

    Second, I think the LASS demos show a good variety of styles by some talented composers. No mockups of classical repertoire, but LASS can probably handle that as well as anything else available.

    Third, if you don't like the music, why not listen past that to the sound of the samples themselves. People use GPO for a wide range of styles, surely you can expect other sample libraries to be flexible.

  8. #8

    Unhappy Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    So, considering that there are already two VERY major "hollywood-ish" string libraries, does Garritan REALLY need to release one as well?

    How about a string library for the orchestral composer who ISN'T writing Hollywood-style music?

    As at least one other poster mentioned, I'd be VERY happy with an improved GPO strings that includes at least the standard articulations one expects from a string player.

    I don't need 15 types of 1st violin section, with every conceivable mixture and weight of string sound (ie: 12 violins, 3 violins, 6 violins, 9 violins, 5 1/4 violins with the second cousin of the third one from the left, 8 old grannies playing violin with Jascha Heifitz, etc...).

    I want my violin section to sound good, and be able to play col legno, pizz, harmonics, etc.

    Is it REALLY necessary for Garritan to release a product that will have so much competition in the "realism" race?

    So if GOS2 will incorporate Giga technology and require the purchase of another computer, then sadly, the upgrade to Aria I recently did of GPO will be my last purchase of a Garritan product. If this is truly the case, then Garritan products will be pricing themselves right out of the market, along with all the other libraries that are geared for people who make "final product" audio from their libraries.

    I saw the testimonials on LASS - John Debney, Danny Elfman, and the likes. Somehow, I didn't think that Garritan products were aiming for that market.

    I am now officially saddened.

  9. #9

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    I wouldn't lose heart yet Michel until we hear something official.

    I really can't imagine Gary would abandon the model he's already set up of a light sample engine that doesn't require a large footprint and tons of computer resources. I guess I'm thinking he could offer different versions of the various products that would please people like you and I (samples are a means to an end) AND those who the samples are an end to themselves. Each user has different requirements and I have to think the technology and brilliance shown so far is available to both types of user.

    Maybe someone will chime in who knows something official. I know how you feel though; I'd LOVE to have some string section harmonics and col legno.


  10. #10

    Re: GOS2 sooner rather than later

    As long as there isn't GOS or GOS2 or whatever - and I will wait in patience until that date - would everybody in charge delete the demo's made with them? It sets the potential buyers on the wrong foot that these great renderings are possible with the present material.


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