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Topic: getting playback sound

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  1. #1

    getting playback sound

    I've installed GPO 3 and it seems to be functioning ok; however when I try and use it with Sonar Home Studio 7 although recording seems fine I can't get any playback. What am I doing wrong?

  2. #2

    Re: getting playback sound

    Hi, I've used GPO and several versions of Sonar (including Home Studio) for a long time, and so could help you out. But your post is extremely sketchy. Any number of things could be causing your problem, including simply not having your sound card set up properly. I do hope you realize you can't use your computer's built in card, you need a replacement card and preferably one with its own stand-alone hardware conjunction box.

    But your problem is more likely due to incorrect routing of your signals in Sonar.

    More details please.

    Randy B.

  3. #3

    Re: getting playback sound

    Hi, sorry it's been so long getting back to you since your kind offer of help.

    I've got Home Studio 7 and GPO3 and the soundcard is Tascam US-144. I can only get playback through my keyboard - I can't sem to find a way of geting playback through the speakers. In fact, at the mment I don't seem to be able to input through GPO either.

    And also, I have Sibelius 6 and have failed completely to get GPO up and running with this either.

    any ideas gratefully received.

  4. #4

    Re: getting playback sound

    Oh my - FOUR months later - ! --I take it you haven't been working on much music since January!

    Well - Your original post sounded like you hadn't read Sonar's Help files. It has thorough info on how to use soft synths. And now your new post makes it sound like you still need to do that basic soft synth tutorial.

    Also in the Help file, it explains how to set up a sound card. Basically, once your Tascam is plugged in - BEFORE you fire up Home Studio, you need to make sure the program is recognizing it as your audio and MIDI interface. That is done through Options>Audio in HS's toolbar.

    I'm willing to help, but naturally I don't want to write pages which have already been written and are there in your HS program. You need to get a handle on that basic info, then we'll have some common ground when you come back with questions on things not clear to you. How's that?

    Randy B.

  5. #5

    Re: getting playback sound

    Hi Randy, thanks for not taking 4 months to reply! As you guessed i find it very hard to make enough time to do much serious musicmaking, consequently i feel i'm always starting from scratch.

    However, although I have quite conscientiously followed the manual on previous occasions (unsuccessfully), I do take your point about trying it again - so I have, and no probs at all with Dropzone, Cakewalk TTS or Roland Groovesynth, but with GPO I still get no sound. I'm sure I'mdoing exactly the same with it as with the ohters, but of course they all came with HS7 and GPO is installed separately. Is that the problem? and if so, what do I do? From the sound levels it's clear that something s going in, I just can't play it back.

    Re the soundcard, I haven't got one in the computer at all, just the Tascam, which is the only recognised device I have - does it matter whether it is set to analog or digital?

    looking forward to pearls of wisdom......and happy to provide any other info you need if I can,

    Gaynor

  6. #6

    Re: getting playback sound

    Hello again, Gaynor - Yeah, I thought it'd be better not to wait 4 months before replying.

    OK, this is encouraging, "...no probs at all with Dropzone, Cakewalk TTS or Roland Groovesynth, but with GPO I still get no sound..."

    So you do seem to understand how to use soft synths. I was pointing out the Sonar tutes which explain in detail how to use them, because I thought maybe you were having a universal problem with soft synths, not just GPO.

    "...they all came with HS7 and GPO is installed separately. Is that the problem?..."

    No, that's not the problem. Those synths basically work like any other synths available, so it's not as if their functions are unique to Cakewalkk.

    "...Re the soundcard, I haven't got one in the computer at all, just the Tascam, which is the only recognised device I have - does it matter whether it is set to analog or digital?"


    That's good - You don't want to use your computer's built-in card. You've done the right thing to have an external audio/MIDI interface. The setting for analog or digital is for when you're recording external devices through it. If you have a mike plugged in, then it's analog. If you have a digital signal coming in, then you set it to digital.

    AN IDEA TO TRY - Here's a likely candidate for what your problem with GPO is. It's a very common stumbling block to people trying to use GPO in Sonar for the first time:

    --In Sonar, click Options in the top menu, then Project. On the MIDI Out tab, you'll see there's a setting called "Zero Controllers When Play Stops." By default that is checked, turning that control on. UN-check it. You have to always have that un-checked when creating a Sonar project using the Garritan Libraries.

    What happens with the default of On, is that every time you stop, whatever setting you have CC1 at is re-set to Zero. CC1 is what controls the volume of GPO instruments - if it's re-set to Zero, your volume has been turned off.

    CC1 is generated by a keyboard's Mod Wheel, and it can also be drawn in by hand in the Piano Roll View.

    You must use CC1 in a continuous way in GPO--It's not something you set a level for and leave. To make the instruments come to life, you need to phrase your musical passages in a way that emulates the constant ebb and flow of volume as happens in a live performance.

    That's the first thing I need you to try. It could very well be your problem. I'd be rich if I had a dollar for every time I've seen someone new to GPO say they can't get any sound - and it's invariably because of this Sonar setting I've explained.

    Try it out, let me know the results.

    Randy B.

  7. #7

    Re: getting playback sound

    Hi Randy,

    Did as you suggested ("--In Sonar, click Options in the top menu, then Project. On the MIDI Out tab, you'll see there's a setting called "Zero Controllers When Play Stops." By default that is checked, turning that control on. UN-check it. You have to always have that un-checked when creating a Sonar project using the Garritan Libraries.")

    Tragically, it hasn't worked. - sound levels go up and down but no sound appears.

    Couple of points - firstly, what is CC!? Secondly, when inputting a few notes using the midi keyboard, should i have been doing something else to get volume? ie the mod wheel (i've never used this for anything - thought it just made the notes go up and down a bit).

    I'm very grateful for your help and feel quite positive we'll get it sorted - any more thoughts?

    Gaynor

  8. #8

    Re: getting playback sound

    While I wait for some new tracks to bounce down in Sonar, I can write some more.

    OK, good, your reply gives me more info about what you do don't know yet.

    CC stands for MIDI Continuous Controller. CC1, as I said, is what the keyboard's Mod Wheel generates. In most MIDI software, CC1 controls the Vibrato of an instrument. But in GPO, CC1 controls the Volume. Instruments which have controllable Vibrato use After Touch to control the amount of Vibrato.

    So to do anything with GPO, Gaynor, You HAve to record Mod Wheel data, because that's your instrument volume control. As I said in the earlier reply, if you don't have any CC1 in your project, you won't hear anything.

    Go record something, only this time also move that wheel up to the top and play with the results - you'll instantly hear the volume change.

    And then of course, leave that Sonar setting un-checked.

    I mean this with no offense intended, but I'm understanding better now that there are extremely basic things you haven't learned on your own yet. You couldn't have actually done the Sonar Tutorials, like your in a class, following the instructions, step-by-step--because at the end of that course, you'll know a lot more about MIDI.

    The GPO manual is very detailed, and has full information about MIDI controllers, CC1 volume control etc.

    I'm glad to help, but you understand I can't keep writing posts which are basically rehashes of what you should already have studied.

    OK--Go try the wheel, let me know how it goes. I'll check back again next time I'm at a pause with today's Sonar project.

    Randy B.

  9. #9

    Re: getting playback sound

    Hi Randy, you are quite right = my knowldge is very basic. I have gone through the tutorials in the HS7 handbook but they are pretty basic so maybe somewhere there is a more thorough manual? Anyway, have tried the mod wheel - it shows up on screen very clearly - lots of nice peaks and troughs - but sadly no sound. I wonder if my input/outputs are set up correctly - they are the same as for the other soft synths but maybe for GPO they need to be different.

    I find the GPO manual really difficult to follow - the small print doesn't help! And I think it is aimed at people who already have quite a good knowledge of what they're doing, not at beginners. But tomorrow I'll try to have another go at it.

    I do appreciate all your help and understand you dont want to churn out stuff for me unnecessarily.

    Cheers,

    Gaynor

  10. #10

    Re: getting playback sound

    Hello again, I don't mind helping, but I appreciate you realize there's a finite limit on how much can be explained in posts like this.

    I'm talking about the Sonar Tutorials, not the little hard copy manual that comes with HS7. You click Help in the upper right hand corner of the program when you have it open. There's a series of tutorials with sound examples and videos.

    The GPO manual is now a PDF file, there shouldn't be any small print to contend with. I have the impression you don't have the current GPO. But the manual is really very thorough. Manuals can be a real snore to get through, nobody likes reading them - but really, that was written for people who have no previous experience. There is a lot of detail in the current PDF manual.

    Is your GPO playing in Aria or Kontakt? The current GPO is in Aria.

    Thanks for running that test--Good that you see some activity, but you're right that since you still don't have sound, you don't have things routed correctly.

    Maybe you just lucked out when you got the other synths to work? Because there is absolutely nothing different in setting up Aria/GPO (or Kontakt GPO) from any other synth.

    A sketch of the process:

    --In HS, click Insert - Choose Aria or Kontakt, whichever player you have. In that insert synth dialogue, ask for ALL AUDIO OUTPUTS to be inserted in the project for you.

    --Open up that instance of Aria/Kontakt/GPO and start loading instruments. Change the settings so each instrument is coming out of a different stereo pair of outs. The default is for everything to come out of the first stereo pair - audio outs 1/2.

    --Those audio tracks inserted in Sonar are already paired up to the audio outs of the sample player. There's no setting up to do beyond that.

    --Only one MIDI track was inserted with the synth. That's to get you going. It defaults to MIDI Channel One - and it's logical that your first instrument in the player is set up to not only MIDI Channel one but also audio out one.

    --When you choose that MIDI track in HS, playing your keyboard will play the associated instrument.

    --Add other MIDI tracks, directing them to be connected to the rest of the audio channels which are carrying the sound from the sample player.

    That's really like it's done for any soft synth. If you can't get sound after making sure you're inserting GPO correctly - it's going to be difficult to come up with more ideas. You could do a screen shot of HS with the way you have things configured - I could possibly tell from that if something's wrong.

    OK - I'll check in again tomorrow!

    Randy B.

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