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Topic: Behind the Beat

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  1. #1

    Behind the Beat

    What do I need to do to get one instrument of a larger ensemble to play behind the beat for a few bars?

    I see there are system tempo commands, but I want to slow down one instrument only, not the entire ensemble.

  2. #2

    Re: Behind the Beat

    I think you need to work 1 part at a time each part in separated projects to do this. Then you set the tempo for each part/project. Once you have exported all parts as raw wave file, you can mix those parts in a global project.

    I hope I made myself clear...
    There is no spoon.

  3. #3

    Re: Behind the Beat

    Quote Originally Posted by boulifb View Post
    I think you need to work 1 part at a time each part in separated projects to do this. Then you set the tempo for each part/project. Once you have exported all parts as raw wave file, you can mix those parts in a global project.

    I hope I made myself clear...
    Thanks for your reply. Hmm. That seems awfully labor-intensive for a "jazz and big band" program. I'm going to try working with odd groupings (of 5 notes over 2 beats for example).

  4. #4
    Senior Member
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    Re: Behind the Beat

    G’day bkrider9,

    You said:

    “What do I need to do to get one instrument of a larger ensemble to play behind the beat for a few bars?

    I see there are system tempo commands, but I want to slow down one instrument only, not the entire ensemble.”


    You do not tell us what software you are using. Also, do you want to delay notes behind the beat, or do you want to slow down the tempo of instruments?

    If you want to play behind the beat, in piano roll, you shift the notes to be delayed to the right. In notation you insert a short rest (1/64, 1/32 etc) and shift the notation to the right. The result is likely to be unreadable by ordinary musicians, but will sound ok.

    If you want to have several tempi in your music at the same time, you record your tracks at different tempi to separate audio files and then mix those audio files.


    Best wishes,

    Herbert
    GPO, JABB, CMB, GWI, GOFRILLER, HALION PLAYER, ACCORDIONS by E Tarilonte
    Cubase 6, Notation Composer, VSTHost, GoldWave audio editor.

    Interests:
    Good Food, Gemütlichkeit, Wein Weib und Gesang – History, Politics, Civil Law –
    Electronics, Software Development, Physics – Plant Physiology, Creative Horticulture –
    Photography, Painting, Wood Working - Midi Orchestration, Music, Music, und Musik …

  5. #5

    Re: Behind the Beat

    Quote Originally Posted by sonata5920 View Post
    G’day bkrider9,

    You said:

    “What do I need to do to get one instrument of a larger ensemble to play behind the beat for a few bars?

    I see there are system tempo commands, but I want to slow down one instrument only, not the entire ensemble.”


    You do not tell us what software you are using. Also, do you want to delay notes behind the beat, or do you want to slow down the tempo of instruments?

    If you want to play behind the beat, in piano roll, you shift the notes to be delayed to the right. In notation you insert a short rest (1/64, 1/32 etc) and shift the notation to the right. The result is likely to be unreadable by ordinary musicians, but will sound ok.

    If you want to have several tempi in your music at the same time, you record your tracks at different tempi to separate audio files and then mix those audio files.


    Best wishes,

    Herbert
    Thanks, Herbert. Sorry for the delayed response and the omission of technical info. I'm using Sibelius 6.1 (on a Win 7 system). Your solutions are quite reasonable, but I was hoping that Sibelius would allow me to tell one instrument alone to change tempo or to play rubato etc. That would most accurately reflect "behind-the-beat" playing.

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Just north of Sydney
    Posts
    272

    Re: Behind the Beat

    G’day bkrider,

    You said:

    “ … tell one instrument alone to change tempo or to play rubato etc. …”

    I understand now what you want to do.

    I mostly do backing tracks and leave exploring rubato to the soloist.

    However this is an interesting challenge, worth exploring. I think what beats you is that midi does not work with several independent time bases at the same time.

    As I see it, the best work around is by changing the midi data, either in a list editor or by graphic manipulation in piano roll view of a sequencer.


    Best wishes,

    Herbert
    GPO, JABB, CMB, GWI, GOFRILLER, HALION PLAYER, ACCORDIONS by E Tarilonte
    Cubase 6, Notation Composer, VSTHost, GoldWave audio editor.

    Interests:
    Good Food, Gemütlichkeit, Wein Weib und Gesang – History, Politics, Civil Law –
    Electronics, Software Development, Physics – Plant Physiology, Creative Horticulture –
    Photography, Painting, Wood Working - Midi Orchestration, Music, Music, und Musik …

  7. #7

    Re: Behind the Beat

    Quote Originally Posted by sonata5920 View Post
    G’day bkrider,

    You said:

    “ … tell one instrument alone to change tempo or to play rubato etc. …”

    I understand now what you want to do.

    I mostly do backing tracks and leave exploring rubato to the soloist.

    However this is an interesting challenge, worth exploring. I think what beats you is that midi does not work with several independent time bases at the same time.

    As I see it, the best work around is by changing the midi data, either in a list editor or by graphic manipulation in piano roll view of a sequencer.


    Best wishes,

    Herbert
    Okay, Herbert. Thanks very much. That points me in the right direction. I'm also grateful to know that the midi system is the cause of the restriction.

    Cheers.

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