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Topic: Money Back Guarantee?

  1. #1

    Money Back Guarantee?

    I think sample cd producers should start offering a \"money back guarantee\". This would promote consumer confidence in the product. I program computer software for a living, I have to offer a money back guarantee for my products. Why shouldn\'t sample producers offer the same quality assurance? As far as the \"piracy\" issues goes, it\'s already happening. There is nothing you can do about it. What serious musician would put out commercial efforts with non-licensed samples anyway? I get to try out microphones, speakers, etc., all other aspects of my home studio with product guarantees, why not my samples?!? Let the flames begin.

  2. #2

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Simon Ravn:
    If sample developers offered this, I am sure we\'d see a big increase in \'sales\': People buying the library, copying it, getting the money back.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I have to disagree, those that are buying these libraries in the 200$-600$ range are not pirates, they are professional musicians. Why would they risk selling their music with non-licensed samples? Users that want to get the samples for free are doing it right now as we speak, they wouldn\'t pay for it at any price.

  3. #3

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    I agree with Simon. Id expect more people to beleive that buying and copying and returning isn\'t as illegal as copying and using from a friend. *I* know there isn\'t a difference regarding legality, but to many people it would seem less legal. Also it would offer an option to people who aren\'t in \"pirating circles\", for getting \"free\" libraries. Even guatanteed to getting the library for free if they return it. Rather than buying from some overseas pirating company that you have to be weary of. It actually can make pirating more convenient.

    As for professional musicians using non liscenced sounds in their compositions/recordings. I don\'t think thats the best defense. There are MANY musicians/artists out there that dont consider themselves high profile enough to get \"caught\". These people could in a sense have EVERY library out there for abotu a grand if they were able to return things on a money back gurantee. I know thats an exreme and probably wouldn\'t happen, but you guys get the point

    Think about the amount of work it would be to go \"over\" all the music out in the world to check to see if your library was being used illegaly, giving this kind of ease of access to unliscenced sounds would make sample developers have to go through music more thoroughly and expansively.

    How many individuals do you developers actually catch? I\'m sure there is a more definite focus on groups/rings of piraters.

    Really...I am an Idiot

  4. #4

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    But the people who pirate it weren\'t going to buy it anyway. If you look at the way Microsoft developed, they constantly whinged about piracy while:
    a) They were the world\'s most guilty swashbucklers themselves.
    b) Many people used pirated software then eventually bought the stuff legally.

    It\'s like the old Napster argument: all the stuff that\'s downloaded wouldn\'t be bought legally anyway, but many of us discovered new music for free then went and bought the CDs.

    I\'m going to be honest here so please don\'t jump down my throat. I don\'t know a single person I can share samples with, but if I did I would copy every single sample s/he had. I\'d use them for an indeterminate length of time, then I\'d delete the \'crap\' and I\'d buy the stuff I wanted. That\'s what I\'ve always done with every piece of software I could. I used to live in the middle east; I had copies of software that cost many thousands of pounds; I deleted all the stuff I didn\'t use. But I did eventually get around to buying all the software that I knew I would continue to use.

    CD creators have to find a way to get us on board through upgrades and freebies, extensions, new features (but no strangling please).

    As an example. I really want the gigastrings the way a five-year old wants (well, whatever it is that five-year olds want this year). But I\'m not going to take a $1,000 gamble that all the beta testers are squeaky clean (that is not in any way to imply subterfuge, but if you review an item and have it on your hard disk for FREE it subtly colors your attitude - you didn\'t have to fork-out non-returnable drinking vouchers for it - if it stinks well, that\'s just too bad but it\'s no skin off your nose).

    The idea that everything that is copied by \'pirates\' would have generated income is completely ludicrous: it just ain\'t so.

    I\'ve said it here before and I\'ll say it again; $1,000 is a steal for a sober, in tune string section, but I will not in any shape or form, go buy it without trying it out for a couple or three months at least. That means that the revenues I might have generated will never be generated because if I did find someone to lob a copy in my direction, I would be considered a criminal.

    Why can\'t we all be beta testers? We are anyway. There isn\'t a software company in the world that gets its software market-ready before they sell it and I\'m sure it\'s the same with samples.

    Why don\'t you just give it to us? The people who want to steal it will, I assure you, steal it anyway. After all, gigastrings is only a hundred dollars if you\'ve got nine pals who make music.

    I believe that all the new faces creating CDs should take this opportunity to claim the market by giving it away on spec. We\'ll all get to use the stuff and we\'ll pay you as soon as we decide we want it (if we want it).

    Sample creators do not have the cash (or few do) to embark on large marketing campaigns but this is one way they could do it. I know it\'s scary and it\'s anti-intuitive but ultimately the only money you\'re ever going to make is from \'honest\' people such as myself and probably everyone else in this group. All this paranoia won\'t make you a single cent more. And I guarantee you\'ll see exponential growth - especially if the products are as great as some of you claim. Schools, universities, kids everywhere will get on the sampling bandwagon, you\'ll have a real consumer market.

    Sure some will steal, but THAT WILL HAPPEN ANYWAY. We are the ones who are penalized by your fear (and your potential income is stunted by it).

    Stop treating us like criminals.

    Finally, let\'s not forget that you guys walk into a room and sample a Steinway or some other famous instrument because the owner doesn\'t really \'get what\'s happening\'. Who owns their sounds? The company that built it? The owner of the instrument? The player? You? Us?

  5. #5

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    The money back guarantee thing just won\'t work. There are too many people out there that will order it, copy it, and send it back. The argument that they will find ways to steal it anyway just doesn\'t cut it. Why make it even easier to pirate stuff?

    I never understood why the same people that would never walk into a grocery store and steal groceries find it perfectly OK to steal software and other computer related items.

  6. #6

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    Originally posted by Jamieh:
    \"Why make it even easier to pirate stuff?\"

    The degree of difficutly is not relevant unless you get into \'real\' security measures. Also, because old salty seadogs like myself always \'go straight\' in the end.

    \"I never understood why the same people that would never walk into a grocery store and steal groceries find it perfectly OK to steal software and other computer related items.\"

    Sure you do. Unless you\'re the one person who never downloaded anything from Napster.

    I never understood why anyone who\'d never steal software would walk into a grocery store and steal things (I\'d put a smiley face here if I knew how to).

    And I\'m still trying to figure out how all those dead French and Italian violin makers are going to sue the makers of gigastrings for blatantly pirating their life\'s work. Shame on you. They should clap you all in irons and keel haul the whole skirvy bunch of you.


  7. #7

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    Perhaps the answer isn\'t a 100% refund, but maybe a 75% refund. That way, people would be less likely to copy the CD\'s (or maybe they\'d still do it, but it\'s not like they\'d get it for free.. GOS would still cost them $250.)

    Also, the companies that sell the sample CD\'s can keep a running database of \"deadbeat\" customers that return things, and refuse to honor their RMA requests after two returns. (Maybe someone can honestly return two libraries as unusable, but after that, they can buy elsewhere or live with their third choice and every purchase thereafter!)

    And, what of the returned sample CD\'s? Sell them for 10% off!

    Just a couple of ideas.

  8. #8

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    just curious: where can you buy software, install it on your computer and then send it back with full refund just because you dont like it?
    I think what would help are realistic demos (like runs and chords)and cheap downloads of single patches.

  9. #9

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?


    this is a bit off top, but..We actually paid to be on Gary\'s Beta team

    anyhow, even with that said, one might find people who pay $$$ for somethign trying to justify their payment by convincing themselves its a good purchase, when it might not be.Its all a point a veiw on that one

    In the end, our comments as beta testers will only be worth the value that WE are to individuals who read these posts. In the end its still an opinion and the worth of that is different to everyone.

    I for one have been out here in this forum for about 2 years and have no reason to steer anyone wrong, so why would I?

    ok I\'ve rambled too off topic already..

    back on topic... I wish I had every library for free, and Developers didn\'t starve or go broke and would still make more libraries...for me to return...lets go back to not liscensing the sounds..and having to pay a royalty everytime you use samples in a song. The royalty fee can be expensive so that you guys can afford to screen all the music in the world to check for your samples Atleast the CDs will be dirt cheap!

    I\'m sure a bunch of these guys do make extra money from people who are disatisfied with the library. I DONT BELIEVE that they are deliberatly trying to disappoint us tho

    Really...I am an Idiot

  10. #10

    Re: Money Back Guarantee?

    Don\'t get me wrong, I am vehemently anti piracy.

    But, what I want to know is, who of you has ever seen the \"Sample Police\". Or heard of a sample piracy arrest. Even with piracy being apparently rampant.


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