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Topic: Velocity and expression

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  1. #1
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    Dec 2010
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    Velocity and expression

    I have the GPO that came with Overture4. NI Kontakt. Ie not Aria complete set.

    I note that I can't use velocity and expression(or was it volume). I can only use Volume to change dynamics.

    Have I done something wrong with my GPO setup or do I simply need the complete GPO upgrade to utilize velocity and expression curves? Or is velocity and expression something samples simply don't do?


    Note I use to use a JV1080 Synthesizer to get sounds. Synth "patches" do allow velocity and expression (along with volume).

  2. #2

    Re: Velocity and expression

    Hi, JM1234321

    Sounds like you're not clear on the way Garritan instruments are controlled. The programming is non-standard, and so is often a bit confusing to new people.

    Velocity in GPO doesn't change the volume (except for the percussion instruments) but instead, controls the envelope. The highest velocity values produce stronger, faster attacks, and lower values produce softer, slower attacks.

    But the actual volume level is controlled by Mod Wheel - MIDI controller 1. Alternatively, you can use CC11 (The "Expression" pedal) for volume.

    So for the most expressive playing of GPO instruments, you need to use a combination of velocity and cc1 (or 11) in a way that's unique to Garritan. You'll see that actually this makes the instruments more versatile - You can have a mellow, slow start on a horn, for instance, but with a loud volume. Or low volume notes can still have a sharp attack - it's the sort of variety of techniques you'll hear in a live orchestra.

    Randy

  3. #3
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    Re: Velocity and expression

    Quote Originally Posted by rbowser- View Post
    Hi, JM1234321

    Sounds like you're not clear on the way Garritan instruments are controlled. The programming is non-standard, and so is often a bit confusing to new people.

    Velocity in GPO doesn't change the volume (except for the percussion instruments) but instead, controls the envelope. The highest velocity values produce stronger, faster attacks, and lower values produce softer, slower attacks.

    But the actual volume level is controlled by Mod Wheel - MIDI controller 1. Alternatively, you can use CC11 (The "Expression" pedal) for volume.

    So for the most expressive playing of GPO instruments, you need to use a combination of velocity and cc1 (or 11) in a way that's unique to Garritan. You'll see that actually this makes the instruments more versatile - You can have a mellow, slow start on a horn, for instance, but with a loud volume. Or low volume notes can still have a sharp attack - it's the sort of variety of techniques you'll hear in a live orchestra.

    Randy
    Hi Randy.

    Thanks for the response.

    Right after I posted here I saw on the main Garritan page the writeup about the MOD wheel as vol and "brightness" [vel] controller.

    I believe that the way velocity and expression should have been created at the start of the music tech industry was for Velocity to increase automatically at the same time Expression increased; ie they always should have been connected the way GPO does it now.

    -----------
    Some notes:

    Regarding GPO ...and the JV 1080 and Genie soft OVERTURE at least...

    Nbr 1)

    Expression is a mellower change in dynamics. Eg from pp to mf using expression seems less severe and more realistic than when using volume for those changes.

    Nbr 2)

    For "intelligent" score playback (eg the accent marks automatically playback as an affected note) the user sets his accent marks to his liking. BUT the settings are ideally for changing the percent of velocity. (Eg one sets his accent to be "scale velocity by 110".) If user can only set his accent mark's volume control number to be say 82 or 98 or 127 --ie NOT a percent-- the accent will only ring proper for certain passages.

    Ie in ppp passages the accent will be too loud and for fff passages the accent will be too low.

    How do you all go around that without editing each individual placed accent?

    ------
    Not related to GPO or any product. Just a thought out loud.

    There should have been two types of software expression. One for dynamic changes outright (eg pp to ff); And the other for when users want to delve into a note's attack or decay and draw in a controller so as to try and create a supra nuanced playback (say a solo violin line).

    I guess VOL and EXP were made by the early music tech [MIDI] guys for that purpose, with cntrl 07 [vol] for dynamics and cntrl 11 [exp] for drawn in curves and such.

    But as said "volume" is a harsher less real sounding change of dynamics. Therefore I like expression for grand dynamic changes too.

    And also a novice user needs to use that ctrl 07 VOL as a set and forget "vol" --at the very front of the score-- to build different ensembles to his desired scale. Eg a user sets his wind parts lower in 'set and forget' VOL so as to create the very large brass heavy film style orch (where winds are sublimated). But for a rococco style smaller orch a user would set his "winds" (ehem, his oboe) with more presence.

    I as an advanced synth user go around that by building my ensembles by modding synth patches themselves. (But noobs need that crtl 07 VOL for set and forget reasons. Eg they set winds at VOL75, brass at VOL120 [w/ tpt higher], and strings at VOL100 [w/ Vi higher].)

    That brings me to another GPO question. Can I customize and save samples with the full GPO Aria package. (I believe "yes".) Is it easy and are the results as real sounding as the original samples (though)?

    Thanks for any feedback.

    (I might have more questions in the future .)

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