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Topic: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

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  1. #1

    A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    I want to say thank you to the Spectrasonics team for the most engaging, fun and awesome sounding instruments I have ever heard and seen. I recently got Trilian and I finally have the complete trio. I am just one big smile

    I also want to see if anyone else here agrees to my thoughts on a few functions added for a future Omnisphere/Trilian update.

    - A latch mode that cuts off the previous chord/note when a new one is pressed. If there already is a way to do this, I would really like to learn it.

    - The ability to pitch the notes in the arpeggiator. Like the matrix in Propellerheads Reason.

    - Making the granular synthesis an insert effect or, better yet, have the ability to feed audio into Omnisphere to use as an instrument. I say this because the granular synthesis demo presented for the 1.5 update sounded awesome together with speech. If importing whole wav's or unlimited capturing is out of the question, what about 15 seconds or so via microphone?

    So what do you think?
    I would also appreciate to hear Mr. Persings thoughts on these suggestions.

  2. #2

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    Quote Originally Posted by DSProject View Post
    I want to say thank you to the Spectrasonics team for the most engaging, fun and awesome sounding instruments I have ever heard and seen. I recently got Trilian and I finally have the complete trio. I am just one big smile

    I also want to see if anyone else here agrees to my thoughts on a few functions added for a future Omnisphere/Trilian update.

    - A latch mode that cuts off the previous chord/note when a new one is pressed. If there already is a way to do this, I would really like to learn it.
    I would like to see a more detailed articulation/latch/live/stack mode tutorial vid. There's one for omnisphere that, in theory, relates to Trilian. The problem is, it's on-screen only vid we're seeing, we're not physically seeing what the musician is doing to trigger the various articulations. I could see a bit of what Eric was doing during his Trilian NAMM demo, but there's a disconnect between what his left hand is triggering (C1, etc) and what's set up in Live mode.

    Quote Originally Posted by DSProject View Post
    - The ability to pitch the notes in the arpeggiator. Like the matrix in Propellerheads Reason.

    - Making the granular synthesis an insert effect or, better yet, have the ability to feed audio into Omnisphere to use as an instrument. I say this because the granular synthesis demo presented for the 1.5 update sounded awesome together with speech. If importing whole wav's or unlimited capturing is out of the question, what about 15 seconds or so via microphone?

    So what do you think?
    I would also appreciate to hear Mr. Persings thoughts on these suggestions.
    My issue -- you know, after two solid weeks, I went from being a complete newb in Logic 9 to advanced proficiency.

    With Trilian/Omnisphere, it's just a much slower going because there's so much there. Watching youtube/tutorial vids has me at an advanced beginner level, but with 40 hour work weeks, life in general etc there's just too much in those apps to digest to become proficient in a short period.

    Frex, your arpeggiator and granular suggestion... i can't even say if that's a reasonable request because I'm still wrapping my head around more basic fundamentals of the programs.

    part of that is because I bought trilian/omni during 'production' phase, so I haven't had the luxury of playing around with it at my leisure. The other thing is spectrasonic's GUI -- it's deep, and it took me a few weeks to grok what's going on. Even though it's deep, it isn't abstruse and has its own internal logic that makes sense.

    One thing I would like to see (I will go into this more with a trilian/omni review I'm working on): more scripting options similar to that in Kontakt. ie up to a certain velocity I would have the normal random round robins, at 90-100 it would trigger glisses, 100-110 would trigger vibrato/vibrafills, etc. Those options may exist but I'm not seeing it.

  3. #3

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    Thanx for replying!

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    I would like to see a more detailed articulation/latch/live/stack mode tutorial vid. There's one for omnisphere that, in theory, relates to Trilian. The problem is, it's on-screen only vid we're seeing, we're not physically seeing what the musician is doing to trigger the various articulations. I could see a bit of what Eric was doing during his Trilian NAMM demo, but there's a disconnect between what his left hand is triggering (C1, etc) and what's set up in Live mode.
    It would certainly be a welcome tutorial for many.

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    My issue -- you know, after two solid weeks, I went from being a complete newb in Logic 9 to advanced proficiency.

    With Trilian/Omnisphere, it's just a much slower going because there's so much there. Watching youtube/tutorial vids has me at an advanced beginner level, but with 40 hour work weeks, life in general etc there's just too much in those apps to digest to become proficient in a short period.
    I'm not gonna brag upon myself that I'm a pro user of these instruments, but I feel i don't need rush it. I dig in a bit more if I need to, and day by day I learn a bit more. It's fairly intuitive and straightforward to make your own patches and get it to do what you want, but to master it requires a fair bit of knowledge about synthesis. I know the basics++, but it's more of the "lets see what happens if I do this".

    I have been into music quite a few years now. As with you and many others, my weeks involves a job, choirs and family. The hours is just enough to keep the composing on a hobby level. Therefore I am about to throw out most of my VST's an concentrate on Spectrasonics trio.

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    Frex, your arpeggiator and granular suggestion... i can't even say if that's a reasonable request because I'm still wrapping my head around more basic fundamentals of the programs.

    part of that is because I bought trilian/omni during 'production' phase, so I haven't had the luxury of playing around with it at my leisure. The other thing is spectrasonic's GUI -- it's deep, and it took me a few weeks to grok what's going on. Even though it's deep, it isn't abstruse and has its own internal logic that makes sense.
    Well, I have used Reason for some time, and it just came natural to me to want a similar function when it comes to the arpeggiator. Just search for "Propellerheads Reason matrix" on YouTube, maybe you'll agree
    The thing about the granular effect is that it doesn't do anything for me personally on instruments. I'm not gonna use it that way. But on speech it sounded so cool.

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    One thing I would like to see (I will go into this more with a trilian/omni review I'm working on): more scripting options similar to that in Kontakt. ie up to a certain velocity I would have the normal random round robins, at 90-100 it would trigger glisses, 100-110 would trigger vibrato/vibrafills, etc. Those options may exist but I'm not seeing it.
    That's a bit over my head But I see what you mean. You do have the velocity stack mode, but I don't think it can do the same as you ask of here. I'm gonna tinker a bit with Omni and see if it's capable of any of it, because it would be cool for sure!

  4. #4

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    Quote Originally Posted by DSProject View Post
    You do have the velocity stack mode, but I don't think it can do the same as you ask of here. I'm gonna tinker a bit with Omni and see if it's capable of any of it. Because it would be cool for sure!
    Doh, you just *totally* answered a big question for me, THANK YOU! I looked at the velocity stack section probably a dozen times the first night I had Trilian, and of course back then I wasn't trying to figure out how to trigger different articulations. I can completely see how I need to do what I want to do now. Thanks for the reminder, this will save me lots of work.

    re: your original question on Latch stuff -- have you gone into the Live mode and clicked on the + magnifying icon to drill down into the latch/touch/switch settings? Your question is a level beyond my current skills, but it might have something to do with those settings.

    re: granular synthesis -- this could be huge, and I need to dedicate some time to it. for me though, and not opening up the whole 'I want to import my own .wavs into Omnisphere' can of worms... what the hell, I will. I'd love to be able to import my own .wavs. Omnisphere is powerful enough, however, that it rarely enters my mind.

    For stuff like learning the granular synthesis, I don't have any 'vested interest' in the original sound source, if that makes sense. If I could take some of my own samples and be able to sculpt/distort them, I could sit down for an entire week doing nothing but dick around with granular synthesis. A pre-installed sample? I've spent a few minutes with it, said 'wow, cool' and moved on. For me, I just have no motivation to spend time with it. In that sense, Omnisphere has a 'closed box' feel to me, but that's fine -- having downloaded the Camel Alchemy demo, I'll probably eventually buy it and would be more inclined to use its granular engine simply because I can import my own sounds.

  5. #5

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    Quote Originally Posted by DSProject View Post
    - Making the granular synthesis an insert effect or, better yet, have the ability to feed audio into Omnisphere to use as an instrument. I say this because the granular synthesis demo presented for the 1.5 update sounded awesome together with speech. If importing whole wav's or unlimited capturing is out of the question, what about 15 seconds or so via microphone?
    Sorry for mucking up the thread with multiple responses (I'm ADHD scatterbrained pre-caffeine). What your describing sounds awfully similar to Audiomulch, a pretty freaking great program I was able to try. I'm not sure I'd pay what they're charging, but it's a 'lost weekend' app much like Omnisphere.

  6. #6

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    Doh, you just *totally* answered a big question for me, THANK YOU! I looked at the velocity stack section probably a dozen times the first night I had Trilian, and of course back then I wasn't trying to figure out how to trigger different articulations. I can completely see how I need to do what I want to do now. Thanks for the reminder, this will save me lots of work.
    Oh! I am glad it turned out to be of help

    I think the latch settings you mention only apply to the way you select patches. I'm thinking about changing chords more easily. Now, it seems you have to play the same chord to shut it off, then play the other chord in mind. It would have been easier to just strike a chord, cutting off the other.

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    re: granular synthesis -- this could be huge, and I need to dedicate some time to it. for me though, and not opening up the whole 'I want to import my own .wavs into Omnisphere' can of worms... what the hell, I will. I'd love to be able to import my own .wavs. Omnisphere is powerful enough, however, that it rarely enters my mind.
    It IS a great feature. So yeah, I want that feature so bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    For stuff like learning the granular synthesis, I don't have any 'vested interest' in the original sound source, if that makes sense. If I could take some of my own samples and be able to sculpt/distort them, I could sit down for an entire week doing nothing but dick around with granular synthesis. A pre-installed sample? I've spent a few minutes with it, said 'wow, cool' and moved on. For me, I just have no motivation to spend time with it. In that sense, Omnisphere has a 'closed box' feel to me, but that's fine -- having downloaded the Camel Alchemy demo, I'll probably eventually buy it and would be more inclined to use its granular engine simply because I can import my own sounds.
    The soundsources is great to use in combination with waveforms to create something new. So I personally don't have that "closed" feeling about Omnisphere. The presets are cool too, but i tend to modify them a bit so I get the feeling they are "mine"

    I think I'm gonna put the brakes on when it comes to purchasing any new VST's. It CAN get too much to learn - eventually killing my creativity.
    I remember sitting in my room 15 years ago with Fasttracker and a few samples. I was more productive then than I am now. Well, I criticize my own music more now than 15 years ago, so I blame that too.

    I'll have a look at Audiomulch, although I doubt I'm gonna buy it

  7. #7

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    Thanks for the feedback. Those suggestions are all already in the very large wishlist, except this one....because you can already do this:

    Quote Originally Posted by DSProject View Post

    - A latch mode that cuts off the previous chord/note when a new one is pressed. If there already is a way to do this, I would really like to learn it.
    Select Sustain mode 2 and use the sustain pedal.

  8. #8

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    Quote Originally Posted by spectrum View Post
    Select Sustain mode 2 and use the sustain pedal.
    Thank you, Eric! Now, off to buy a sustain pedal
    I was already going to buy one because of what it can do in Trilian.

    Since you have your eyes on this thread, I would just like to say a big THANK YOU to you and your team. I do not know you personally, but from the videos you seem like a down to earth, music loving and very nice persons.

    Right now, I feel like I have had a visit from a celebrity

    I think this wraps up this thread.

    Cheers from Norway!

  9. #9

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    One trillian 'feature' I'm noticing is a not-quite-aligned effect in the velo stack mode.

    At the bottom of the stack mode is a grid showing velocities so one can stagger and arrange various parts. Here's a screenshot:



    If you look at the screenshot, I've arranged the first part to trigger between 1-98. If you look closely though, there's a disconnect between where 98 exists on the longitudinal grid and where 98 appears on the velocity bar at the bottom (I'm playing a note at 98 vel and it shows as a yellow indicator bar on the bottom).

    To confuse things even more, there's a vel range on the bottom listed as 1, 13, etc. Look where the 97 is on the grid. Look where my 98 range part ends at the top. Look where the 98 vel note indicator is played on the bottom. This visual disconnect leads to a lot of trial and error and plinking on notes, dragging the bottom corners of part boxes etc until the proper articulations are played. The disconnect between the various visual elements is more confusing than helpful. That said, maybe I'm just missing something, but I think this area could get tightened up.

    The reason this is so big for me is because for now, I'm just not going to touch Live mode with keyswitches. I can arrange a velo stack, record a part, then go back and in Logic's list mode I can quickly change particular notes to glisses, harmonics, whatever. I usually will set something like gliss up 99, gliss down 100, vibrafill 101, etc.

    That leads to just one more teeny tiny stack mode request... I've notice that due to the way I'm writing now, I'm making lots of little 'micro-sliver' parts where I can trigger a different part just by changing it's velocity +/- 1 (as noted above). Very freaking powerfully cool that I can do that, but the setup for adjusting these micro slivers are a complete bear. In stack mode, selecting bars that are only a few velocities thick are impossible to move, resize, etc. If there's a way to make this easier that would be wunderbahr.

  10. #10

    Re: A few toughts on future Omnisphere/Trilian updates.

    That all looks correct. Maybe you're getting tripped up by your velocity curves? Go into the velocity curve editor for each part and cmd or ctrl click on it to reset it and that should give the results you're looking for.

    As for selecting the small parts, you don't need to click inside the part. You can click outside as well, there's plenty of space where you can click to resize them.
    Glenn O
    Spectrasonics

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