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Topic: Symphonic Organ Samples

  1. #1

    Symphonic Organ Samples

    This work appears to be very promising.

    If anyone has purchased/previewed this extensive Peter Ewers effort, please follow up with ALL of your impressions, like, how might Spectrafoo read it\'s tonal/frequency balance? Does the \'room\' intrude, modulating sustains into a muddle, or is the micing in close enough?

    How does this Organ speak? When performing with an articulating technique, (detache\'), might it natually cut through a full \'concert\' choir/orchestral mix? Previous products tend to fall short in the area of \'attack\', especially in the Pedal ranks - both tubby and diffused. - \"Fill yer boots!\" +d9

    [This message has been edited by deadman9 (edited 11-13-1999).]

  2. #2

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples

    Being a hobby organist with much PC and HIFI experience I have the following notes for you:

    There are about the following Samples:
    Full Organ Manual, Full Organ Pedal,
    Fonds, one with some typical Stops mixed together, plus some 16 foot and 32 foot Pedal stops which probably sound on no PC-Loudspeaker good (low frequency).

    The Qualtiy of the sound is very good. But if you articulate on this instruments with staccato, then the organ sounds like a xylophon (which is not state of the art at all) in this case Release Trigger should be triggering a echo with less volume....

    Nemesys announced (last summer) to have worked on those samples for 1000 and more man hours. looking at the number of samples and the amount of time they have needed for those few samples.

    If you hold a key for longer than 20 secs the sample is finished and there is no endless sample technology looping that sample (isn\'t state of the art as well.)

    I must say, that I\'m a bit disapointed. I started to sample my own Church Organs now. One small german romantic Organ I have nearly finished. (all compination of stops and so on). I might release one day a better CD than this.


  3. #3

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples

    Thank you sir. I share your disapointment.

    Please keep us informed about your work.

  4. #4

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples

    Greetings, all. New member here. I\'ve been enjoying everyone\'s posts for a while. I share the general disappointment with the Symphonic Organ samples but they definitely aren\'t all bad! They can be quite elegant played slowly and there is a breathy character to the foundations that is absolutely faithful to the French romantic organ. But the choice is either foundations or full organ--and that is not enough. The release triggered reverb sounds great but the actual note release of the pipes is sliced out of it--and that may be the single greatest problem with the sound. You do get to hear the real note release if you wait the 20 seconds or so for the note to play itself out--it\'s a very different sound from the one you hear when you let the key up, and much, much better.

    The files are in a compressed format. Can these be edited? I\'m inexperienced at this and don\'t know. - Doug Marshall

  5. #5

  6. #6

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples

    I have collected 4 other CD\'s of organ samples over time. All were cheaper and offered much more variety. Although some people might be awed by the gee-whiz of the decay on this set, the application of some effects, such as are possible with Sonic Foundry\'s Acoustics Mirror, can substitute for this. As a professional organist, variety of registration is a MUST, and a CD that limits itself to 5 registrations (if I read the review properly) just wouldn\'t fit the bill. Also, organ samples have to loop. Organ music frequently has long pedal points (where notes sustain sometimes over many measures and sometimes whole pieces). Although developing good loops for some samples is tedious and difficult, especially in the lower registers, long loops will generally yield satisfactory results. I successfully recorded two organ CD\'s in 1998 using Reality and Acoustic Mirror and they are avaialable at Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00000ICRE/viennawoodsmusic/103-2952752-7763003 or http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00000ICRF/viennawoodsmusic/103-2952752-7763003

  7. #7

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples

    <BLOCKQUOTE><font size=\"1\" face=\"Verdana, Arial\">quote:</font><HR>I successfully recorded two organ CD\'s in 1998 using Reality and Acoustic Mirror and they are avaialable at Amazon[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I just checked, but no demos. Where can I hear some audio clips? I\'m very interested in what you\'ve done here.


    [This message has been edited by Lougheed (edited 02-11-2000).]

  8. #8

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples

    There are a couple of tracks in MP3 and Real Audio formats, (the MP3, of course, is much better, but still has some strange artifacts that are not on the CD) but this might give you a feel for the result: http://www.iuma.com/IUMA/Bands/Davison,_John/
    There is also more background at http://www.netcom.com/~tleich
    Thanks for your interest,

    Tom Leich

  9. #9

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples


    Nice sounds, I\'d love to have organs that sound that good. If you want to tell us about your favorite organ samples that would be great.

    Also, you recorded those tunes with Reality? I take it you made your own patches? I use Reality too, the sample/synth engine is powerful and great sounding, but I find it painful to program multisamples, GS goes much faster (unless you just mapped in soundfonts)


  10. #10

    Re: Symphonic Organ Samples

    Those recordings used samples from 2 CD\'s:

    Cathedral Organs from Propeller Island: I used the audio CD ($99) and built my own loops. It has 11 registrations (5 ensemble, 6 solo or near solo) of a circa 1900 Sauer organ (German romantic) in Halle, Germany. I found all the sounds to be very usable, and built about 60 \"stops\" with various transpositions (including deriving mixtures from the bright Italian Principal and celestes from the flute and diapason). Each register is sampled on every 3rd note and lasts about 3-4 seconds, although some were chopped off a little too early. I made just about every one into a usable loop, with some patience.

    McGill University Master Samples: also an audio CD ($49) of a von Beckerath (circa 1960 Baroque revival) in Montreal. This CD sampled 13 registrations (8 ensemble, 5 solo) on either every note or every other note, depending on the sound. I looped and used two of the sounds (flute and 4\' principal), both of which have a very nice chiffy quality. Beckerath\'s are very high quality instruments and the samples are good, but I didn\'t have the time to process them all. I hope to work more with them.

    I also have a 2-CD set called Church Organs, from USB in France. This includes 100+ registrations (many solo stops and also many ensembles) in Akai format of mostly sounds from 2 Cavaille-Coll organs in France (with a few others thrown in). They mostly import into Gigasampler just fine and seem to have well-placed loops. I bought this subsequent to my first CD project, so I haven\'t yet used these in recordings.

    And most recently I bought the CD that Michiel Post listed here a month or so ago, which samples a couple of Dutch organs and an Italian organ. I believe he had ported these over from Akai to Gigasampler. This is a smorgasbord of sounds (over 100), many with very good quality, both ensemble and solo. Some are rather large with many samples. I am currently working through the sounds of these last two CD\'s and am tweaking them in Gigasampler to suit my taste and get them into tune. (Cool Edit Pro can determine the pitch of a sample or loop down to the cent level with pretty good accuracy).

    With Reality, it was not as easy to map out samples as Gigasampler, but it took almost no time compared to the looping process. Reality also has 128 voices of polyphony, which I was able to get on the PII 333. However, Reality has the nice ability to layer multiple programs or versions of a program (e.g., to build a mixture with the same sample tuned to different pitches) in a Patchwork program that was very nice. And its capture function gives some nice feedback on clipping so I could produce quality tracks without clipping rather easily. I did not use sound fonts.

    Thanks for your interest,
    Tom Leich

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